greyhoundp 990 Posted October 18, 2011 Whatever Why did you even bother replying ?. TMW, do you live in a different World ? one where something is given to you on a Plate, cus if that World exists tell me about it, b,cuz i have never come across it. In all walks of life surely its mostly about dedication and sacrifices to get where we want to be, unless we have a rich sugar Daddy i applaud Deanno for coming on here and talking a great deal of sense, from a riders point of view, and not just a keyboard cop. He talks/writes a great deal of common sense, okay agreed not all straight forward with regards occasional rides in the Pl, but from the NL perspective it is enlightening. Other careers pay you to learn, but they mostly pay at an existance level, same for the NL, its not about buying Joe Knickersons Gp Bike, having the latest bike Covers, Gold Chromed Wheel Rims, or the sexiest i Phone , its a learning process and Mechanical Knowledge surely needs to be part of it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhilK 150 Posted October 18, 2011 well i work 60 hours plus a week and some weekends and i stll find the time ,it comes down to dedication at the end of the day ,do you want to be a speedway rider ?, no one said it was easy ,and the national league dosent owe you a living ,i understand that statement goes against the grain but speedway is the only motorcycle sport that pays you to compete , and i feel very lucky that it pays me to do something i love Excellent response Dean, but you are sadly wasting your breath with this one Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edwardian 6 Posted October 18, 2011 well sam is proberly right when you get into premier and above but at national league a bog standard engine is more than good enough ,i have no idea what ashley birkes ,simon lambert ,jon armstrong ,john oliver ,jay herne have special in their engines or who tunes them or how much they pay for the tuning but i have beat them all in the last 2 months on a bog standard 6 year old engine and a clutch that noah sold me off the ark I think you are going a bit to far here, when you say the likes of Simon lambert and Ash birks they double up in PL they need to have there bikes tuned and tip top.. I think you are rather putting other riders down here, riders are looking for sponsorship and help and your making it sound so inexpensive and matter of fact that these other riders have not got a clue.. How do you think they even got a PL ride in the first place? Ash Birks has not been doing speedway for 3-4 years like some he has had one year NL and gone straight to PL. That's progress If riders want to progress a bog standard like you say will not do other wise your dropped. And if you work 6 days a week and ride speedway arnt you the lucky one to fit it all in. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
THE DEAN MACHINE 4,756 Posted October 18, 2011 I think you are going a bit to far here, when you say the likes of Simon lambert and Ash birks they double up in PL they need to have there bikes tuned and tip top.. I think you are rather putting other riders down here, riders are looking for sponsorship and help and your making it sound so inexpensive and matter of fact that these other riders have not got a clue.. How do you think they even got a PL ride in the first place? Ash Birks has not been doing speedway for 3-4 years like some he has had one year NL and gone straight to PL. That's progress If riders want to progress a bog standard like you say will not do other wise your dropped. And if you work 6 days a week and ride speedway arnt you the lucky one to fit it all in. i am not putting any rider down ,ash ,simon or anybody ,i just used them as an example as to prove a bog standard engine is good enough for NL racing ,they have got rides in PL through talent and im not disputing that , its not inexpensive at all ,it just could and should be cheaper than it is if you could do your own engines . im not pretending to have the answers to speedways problems, but at NL level im just trying to give some advice to some of these younger riders who are struggleing to make ends meet in speedway , if they choose not to take it then so be it Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Edwardian 6 Posted October 19, 2011 i am not putting any rider down ,ash ,simon or anybody ,i just used them as an example as to prove a bog standard engine is good enough for NL racing ,they have got rides in PL through talent and im not disputing that , its not inexpensive at all ,it just could and should be cheaper than it is if you could do your own engines . im not pretending to have the answers to speedways problems, but at NL level im just trying to give some advice to some of these younger riders who are struggleing to make ends meet in speedway , if they choose not to take it then so be it Your word NL dosnt owe you a living, and your trying to give riders who are struggling to make ends meet some advise.. It dosnt matter what league these lads ride they are ALL doing it for a living other wise why would risk there necks and as a rider you will know that Dean. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TMW 533 Posted October 19, 2011 Why did you even bother replying ?. TMW, do you live in a different World ? one where something is given to you on a Plate, cus if that World exists tell me about it, b,cuz i have never come across it. In all walks of life surely its mostly about dedication and sacrifices to get where we want to be, unless we have a rich sugar Daddy i applaud Deanno for coming on here and talking a great deal of sense, from a riders point of view, and not just a keyboard cop. He talks/writes a great deal of common sense, okay agreed not all straight forward with regards occasional rides in the Pl, but from the NL perspective it is enlightening. Other careers pay you to learn, but they mostly pay at an existance level, same for the NL, its not about buying Joe Knickersons Gp Bike, having the latest bike Covers, Gold Chromed Wheel Rims, or the sexiest i Phone , its a learning process and Mechanical Knowledge surely needs to be part of it. No offence intended I didn't reply because unless Dean can do some of his bike work at work,(which some riders can because of the nature of their work), gets free help or he is an insomniac. Either way circumstances don't fit all riders and it is unfair to imply they should Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Diesel 26 Posted October 19, 2011 Your word NL dosnt owe you a living, and your trying to give riders who are struggling to make ends meet some advise.. It dosnt matter what league these lads ride they are ALL doing it for a living other wise why would risk there necks and as a rider you will know that Dean. Deano's point is that in any other motorsport these riders would be paying to ride, they would be risking their necks because they enjoy it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
teddy2706 166 Posted October 19, 2011 Why is this a good opportunity to have a go or mock Dean? He expressed an opinion and answered some questions from interested people. Most people involved in motorsport that have no real backers prepare their own machinery in their own time (usually evenings), just as Dean seems to. The fact that he doesn't pay people to do what he is able to do himself merely shows he is resourceful and doesn't waste money. He made the point about other riders not to belittle them, more to demonstrate that in his opinion it is possible to prepare an engine in NL one's self and be competetive, the fact that he has beaten other riders who do outsource their engine building re-inforces this and shows he is perfectly able to build competetive engines that suit him just fine. I have watched Dean on a few occasions this season and I am content that my gate money is, in part going to him and others like him and I admire him more now I know that he builds his own engines. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
roguetrader 51 Posted October 19, 2011 Surely its not rocket science for promoters to get together in the NL prior to the AGM, Postphone bringing in the new Silencers, Scrap using Dirt Deflectors, only use the cheaper Carbs, only use the cheaper Clutch plates, Tyres dont seem to be a major issue, also this fashionable thing about sending engines away is very costly. I can see where a few thousand is wasted year on year, but i must Stress we are talking NL League only, and yes i can hear people saying, but what about if i am offered rides in the PL, my equipment isnt competitive, thats why i said have a pree AGM meeting to find ways round problems these ideas may create. The idea is "Survival" to reduce riders costs, therefore to reduce promoters costs, who then maybe then will be able to not only survive but possibly pass on a small saving in some way to the spectators, who are also having to take ever increasing household costs,and Travel costs, as we all know, etc,etc. Time for a reality check on this thread. The new silencers will be in the National League next season. Dirt deflectors wont be scrapped. Riders will use whatever carb they want, probably Blixts. They will use whatever combination of clutch plates they want. Tyres do make a difference. Whilst I respect Deans views I dont agree with all of them. To compete with the top riders in the National League, who are mostly Premier League reserves or main body riders, like Lambert, Howarth, Garrity, Birks, Irving, Branford,Worralls etc you need a decent engine. Saying you have beaten heat leaders around the renowned tricky Buxton circuit is not a fair comparison. You cannot just service a engine without some specific equipment like a press and valve timing. Get it wrong and you can kiss goodbye to between £1000 - £2500 which makes an average service of between £200 - £300 quite reasonable. All motorsport is expensive. Speedway is one of the cheaper ones. It is like anything in life. If you cant afford it you cant do it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TMW 533 Posted October 19, 2011 Why is this a good opportunity to have a go or mock Dean? He expressed an opinion and answered some questions from interested people. Most people involved in motorsport that have no real backers prepare their own machinery in their own time (usually evenings), just as Dean seems to. The fact that he doesn't pay people to do what he is able to do himself merely shows he is resourceful and doesn't waste money. He made the point about other riders not to belittle them, more to demonstrate that in his opinion it is possible to prepare an engine in NL one's self and be competetive, the fact that he has beaten other riders who do outsource their engine building re-inforces this and shows he is perfectly able to build competetive engines that suit him just fine. I have watched Dean on a few occasions this season and I am content that my gate money is, in part going to him and others like him and I admire him more now I know that he builds his own engines. If voicing a different opnion is having a go then guilty as charged.......If it just looking at another side of the story then not guilty........ One thing I will say even if it is cheaper as Dean says to DIY. Would the top riders, who are as rogurteader says PL reserves who do do it for a living. ride for less money I think not. I'll leave you to decide!!!!!!!!!!!!! I would say if you want to watch X (naming no names) in the NL you are going to have to pay. it's a s simple as that. There needs to be more teams in the NL to give the lads more meetings 18 meetings a season unless you are in the PL is not enough to keep your riding up (nothing to do with finance but ability) going for a month here and a month there with no meetings is not good cos as in any walk of life you lose your momentum. Some riders have been known to have brilliant meetings and then had wait weeks to take it anywhere.......Challenges are good experience and I would like to see these to bring new riders through but they are not league meetings weather your team wins or loses affects your position in the table I say bring back NL Trophey etc..... I hope more teams track a team in 2012 but then you get into the territory of top riders being missing for a lot of the meetings because of PL commitments....... and would double up tracks have enough blank fixtures and would enough people attend 15 home meetings when they aren't attending 9. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
THE DEAN MACHINE 4,756 Posted October 19, 2011 Deano's point is that in any other motorsport these riders would be paying to ride, they would be risking their necks because they enjoy it. im happy someone gets my point , Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
THE DEAN MACHINE 4,756 Posted October 19, 2011 im not saying rider x should ride for less money ,my point is if rider x did his own engines and learnt to do them as good as tuner x (which is not difficult) and which has been done many times before ,he would be a lot better off finacially from speedway , and could some expert out there in speedway land tell me what is so tricky about buxtons track , i will tell you ,riders come to the track and they are already beaton before they even ride it ,and you can pay for the best engines in the world but if you got that attitude you wont go far in the sport , i am only trying to help in a small way but if you know better then thats fine ,i am being open and honest about how i see NL speedway from a riders point of view, and just to throw a spanner in the works , who would win a race GREG HANCOCK using my engine V any premier league rider ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
THE DEAN MACHINE 4,756 Posted October 19, 2011 Time for a reality check on this thread. The new silencers will be in the National League next season. Dirt deflectors wont be scrapped. Riders will use whatever carb they want, probably Blixts. They will use whatever combination of clutch plates they want. Tyres do make a difference. Whilst I respect Deans views I dont agree with all of them. To compete with the top riders in the National League, who are mostly Premier League reserves or main body riders, like Lambert, Howarth, Garrity, Birks, Irving, Branford,Worralls etc you need a decent engine. Saying you have beaten heat leaders around the renowned tricky Buxton circuit is not a fair comparison. You cannot just service a engine without some specific equipment like a press and valve timing. Get it wrong and you can kiss goodbye to between £1000 - £2500 which makes an average service of between £200 - £300 quite reasonable. All motorsport is expensive. Speedway is one of the cheaper ones. It is like anything in life. If you cant afford it you cant do it. 1st i agree about the silencers,dirt deflectors and so on they will all be used ,it was just a suggestion,2nd yes you do need a decent engine but why couldnt you make that decent engine yourself ,a press would cost around £200 and the timing equipment and the bits and peices around £100, if it needs more extensive work yes you need more machinery but for serviceing that £300 should be enough , once you know how to do valve timing ,i dont think you will get it wrong ,and i dont know a rider who hasnt got an engine back from service and its blown on 1st race or sometimes on warm up , it a race engine "it happens " Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TMW 533 Posted October 19, 2011 (edited) im happy someone gets my point , I don't think it is getting your point that is the problem. I think it is casting certain aspersions.......Youngsters are more intereted in the latest Mobile Phone....Riders would rather have new covers than chains...... The question of commitment...... etc etc etc. I think if you had just put your point people may have tended to agree with you more although some do. I'm sorry Dean I don't believe you work a 60 hr week AND THEN start on your bikes (on your own) aswell as getting to the isle of wight. and last year Plymouth and Weymouth. An argument needs to be credible But I stand corrected if I am wrong Edited October 19, 2011 by TMW Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
THE DEAN MACHINE 4,756 Posted October 19, 2011 (edited) I don't think it is getting your point that is the problem. I think it is casting certain aspersions.......Youngsters are more intereted in the latest Mobile Phone....Riders would rather have new covers than chains...... The question of commitment...... etc etc etc. I think if you had just put your point people may have tended to agree with you more although some do. I'm sorry Dean I don't believe you work a 60 hr week AND THEN start on your bikes (on your own) aswell as getting to the isle of wight. and last year Plymouth and Weymouth. An argument needs to be credible But I stand corrected if I am wrong well i dont ride for the isle of wight its buxton and i dont work 9 to 5 hours ,i work any hour day or night, week or weekends and who else does my bikes ?,on a sunday i get back from buxton around 7pm and my bikes are washed and prepped before i go bed and just for good measure i also work for hynek stichauer as mechanic (but he was injured in august ), i will admit i dont get much time for anything else but i fit it in , i do sacrifice pretty much everything else in my life , and if you are that interested in my work habits, on race days you will see that most of the time i working in the area of the track im riding at ,be it plymouth ,weymouth or wherever,yes im lucky in that respect but its still work, also about commitment of SOME youngsters im not trying to get people to agree with me im just saying what i see ,if you dont agree with me then thats fine Edited October 19, 2011 by THE DEAN MACHINE Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
