E I Addio

Perhaps the reason you never heard much is because a lot don't moan , they just walk out and don't come back. There used to be a Lakeside fan of 40 years standing who posted on here and the Lakeside site, who posted after that match, combined with the Belle Vue -v- Poole heat 10 farce he had had enough and was done with the sport. .Lets just think about that. A fan who has supported the sport through thick and thin and in all weathers, for 40 yearsnow gone for good all because of the corruption - and which ever label you put on it , corruption is what it really is. The sport simply can not afford to lose people like that. This really highlights the underlying problem. We have people on this forum like Moxey for example and a few others who just love coming on here moaning for the sake of moaning and the usual suspects who want to go back to the one day World Final, don't want play-offs , want to go back to the old 13 heat formula with second halves, and generally live in the past. You can discount them because whatever you say and whatever you do they will carry on complaining. The real problem is the long standing decent fans who can put up with green helmet covers, poor stadium facilities and all the rest of it put the one thing they cant stand is corruption, cheating, conning the public or whatever other label you want to put on it. Ultimately it is the corruption and the fiddling that goes against the natural instincts of most reasonable people, and they don't normally hang around to complain to promoters or moan on forums or write to Speedway Star, they just pack up and go. Once they have gone they rarely come back. The sport desperately needs to clean up its act, but after last night I am not holding my breath.

That is exactly right. The problem will not be solved by going for squads, number 8s or anything else to do wit team structure. It is far better to take an intelligent approach to fixtures so riders do not finish up with two meetings for different teams on the same night. Unfortunately that is easier said than done partly because the PL are not interested in co-operating with anyone about anything, hence they won't get involved with the fast track for example. The other difficulties are Sky constantly messing about with fixtures and the number of GP meetings, SWC , U/21 championships and the various qualifiers., not to mention difficulties with rain offs. No easy answer but it requires a degree of co-ordination and co-Operarion that the BSPA is not exactly famous for. So if you have a situation like Lakeside last Monday, or Belle Vue last Friday where over half your team are doubling up elsewhere or riding in WC qualifiers where do your riders come from if you can't have guests? As I said in the previous post the real fault is with the fixture list not whether you ban guests.

Absolutely no point in any of that as long as the winner is more or less dictated by the EDR draw.

That's a very narrow minded, even childish attitude. Nobody hates the T/R rule more than I do. I absolutely loathe it, but I have to accept that some people like it and I can't have everything my own way in life, You have to get along with others who have a different opinion and you have to compromise sometimes. It seems to me that one T/R per meeting as we have now is a fair compromise. It is probabably the least unfair version of the T/S-TR rule there has ever been and very rarely changes the ultimate result of the match, so as much as I hate the rule , once per match in the interests of others getting something they like is fair enough. If you insist on no T/R rule then what you are saying , in effect is that your opinion is more important than the opinions of those who like the rule. Life isn't like that. You have to try to get along with people.

Exactly. And those same fans who say they don't go anymore because of the tactical ride still watch it on TV , so what's the. difference ? A tac ride is a tac ride whether it's on TV or watching it live. Oh really ? Who did you hear that from ? A bloke in the pub ? Someone who said he was " in the know"? Someone who knew someone who knew someone whose mate knew something ? I heard that Lakeside were moving to Sittingbourne next year but that wasn't true either. The MC are responsible for the fixtures. Jon Cook is even not on the MC, so yet again more forum gossip is dressed up as fact, meanwhile speedway's real problems rumble on, completely unnoticed by those that just like a good moan.

I totally agree with that, but I don't see any answer while the EL remains in its present form . I love top league racing and would hate to see it go but it may be inevitable. Jon Cook said in his notes that he and Stuart Douglas have no interest in PL in its present form but would be attracted to to some kind of expanded regional competition. I don't quite know what he had in mind but that may well be where it all finishes up.

Perhaps it's you that is as thick as two short planks and living in cloud cuckoo land for not checking the calendar and jumping in feet first. A quick look at the calendar and fixture list will reveal that one meeting in five weeks is the result of two back to back GP's a week reserved for rain-offs and the SWC. Most EL clubs are in more or less the same situation with intermittent meetings, to the frustration of all fans but one of the problems with modern Speedwáy is that domestic fixtures are wrecked by the SWC, the GP's, World u/21's and the various qualifiers. He didn't say he needed to be told by others that the fans wanted more meetings. Talking in the context of the club having its own stadium , which now seems to at least be a possibility the complete sentence which you have chosen to misquote says "a regular race night , certainly a Saturday, IF WE HAVE OUR OWN HOME (I hope you read that bit), and more meetings are an absolute requirement from the views expressed" That was the context of the meeting, which lasted two hours, and which the report is only a summary. Then we're do you get the idea the report was trailed? The Speedwáy Star article says they contacted him , not the other way round as you imply then said "Cook politely declined to talk about the meeting and says he will update the fans in the race day programme" How is that, by any stretch of the imagination,trailing the report like some sort of Gettysburg address as you claim? On what basis is he portraying himself as an evangelist for change ? The context is about plans for a new stadium without being beholden to a stock car club. I agree Cook is no angel, and I go along with what had been said for example about the crazy man on man KO cup races, but the other side of the coin is that too many people jump on the keyboard with wild exgerrations and miss the point of what is being conveyed, which takes the discussion nowhere. It's interesting that of all those who jumped on the bandwagon of critcism not a single one has dais something like " I hope for the fans sake Lakeside get a new stadium , Speedwáy cannot afford to lose another club" but no interest in that aspect has been expressed at all. The unfortunate truth is thst the usual suspects who are not capable of sensible adult constructive criticism are as guilty of self interest as the body they love to complain about.

Jon Cook has said that any fan can go and see him at any time up to 7pm on race days. Can you imagine a website with two way communication ? It would be jammed with the P-takers on here whose only pleasure in life is moaning. Look at the sequence of events. A fans forum has been called to quash rumours about the future of the club. Rumours which gained traction on a Speedwáy forum. Cook meets the fans face to face in a two hour meeting. Spedway Star publish what are basically a few comments towards the end of the meeting that are very remote from the main thrust of the discussion. The main points of the discussion are then published in the programme. Cook says in his programme notes that the best suggestion from the floor was that every promoter should meet with the fans before the AGM and he would be passing that suggestion to the powers that be. Nobody who has posted on here complaining about the sport has said that is a good idea so presumably they think it is bad one. . A two way communication on a website in no way compares with a face to face discussion. I am not saying Cook is right in everything he said but he is the only promoter to meet the fans this side of the AGM. I am surprised nobody has come on here and said they would like the opportunity to meet with their promoter prior to the AGM. Of course you got it wrong . Your first complaint was that it was not on the Internet but it was on the Internet. When you realised that you had got that wrong you back pedalled and said it was not on soon enough which is rubbis. Cooks first duty above all else is to his own fan base, not all of whom are on the Internet but a more sizeable portion don't sit at home trawling Speedwáy sites. It's prefectly reasonable that the notes should go on within 24 hours of the programme notes, and a week after the meeting. I notice you have no comment on the notes themselves. If the worst thing anyone can say is that the notes went on the Internet a week after they should have done then Speedwáy has a lot less problems than I thought. BTW. You have no idea whether I get the "Internet thing" as you call it or not. Scratching round for attempted insults detracts from the main thrust of your argument (at least it would if you had one) Cricket, Athletics, wrestling , F1, various classes of saloon car racing, and I also heard something or other on the news the other day that there is some sort of suggestion of corruption in football, heaven forbid.

No chance of that Bryn. Easy to put jump in feet first and get it wrong. It takes someone with a bit of backbone to apologise and it pretty clear from Mr Westons persistent whinging he hasn't got one.

I think they would have got a better pick but it's logical to pick Ellis because he is an asset and nobody could really have foreseen that Ellis would have more or less gone backwards this year. He is banging the maximums at Brum and breaking the track record but his EL form is very hit and miss. Equally nobody could really have predicted that Birks would be so far down on his 2013 form. Therein lies the problem . If your top tier reserve is failing there is very little to choose from by way of replacement.

From where I stood I thought Adam nicked but I wasn't at a particularly good angle. However as they slowed down after the race I noticed Ben punched the air so he clearly thought he got it, and Adams body language didn't particurly suggest anything so who knows. Can't argue though because Adam passed Ben several times but instead of closing the door on him he stayed wide and kept letting Ben back . That seems to be a continuing problem with Adam . In the second reserves race he had what should have been a controlling lead and if he had moved over to the White line Ben would have been shut out , but instead he once again last a gap and Ben came through, then shortly after that Adam had his obligatory fall with nobody near him. This happens so often it is a worry.. Ben is an enigma. He rides Lakeside with the maturity, grit and determination of a far more experienced rider , I have seen him in PL meetings at Rye House and he seems to be going through the motions, without making any impression on the race, almost a completely different rider. I have to add though that Heat 2 was probably the best race of the night which shows that the fast track system can be very entertaining with evenly matched riders, but instead the powers that be have completely messed it up by including riders like Auty and Blackbird who are far too good for that system and just clear off and easily win the reserves race from the gate .

Even that one was more believable than the one about the speedway rider who said he only had two drinks and was still drunk when breath tested the next day

Sad to hear that. Never saw him ride but his was one of the reputations I used to hear about when my interest in the sport was getting started.

It wasn't a swap of assets though. My understanding is that Adam went to Eastbourne to rebuild his confidence and/or because he couldn't be fitted in a Lakeside and Lewis went to Lakeside because he didn't want to go back to Eastbourne, probably some sort of quid pro quo thing without loan fees being paid on either side but certainly Lewis never became a Lakeside asset.

Its almost as true as the Sunday Sport story (or whatever rag it was) about a London Transport bus being found on the moon. In other words to a rational thinker its a most unlikely rumour, but to the BSF rumour mill it's highly likely. Take your pick.

Yes I missed the point about Fricke and Nielson, but that doesn't affect the point being made . The point was that it was said that EL should move away from weekend meetings to avoid guests and my reply was why should the top league move to accommodate the lower league. The fact remains that two of the missing riders are riding in PL matches and nobody has yet said why the EL should move to accommodate the PL double uppers. The other thing is that Ipswich have booked a guest for Nielson on Saturday so even if theEL moved away from weekend race nights Nielson would still not be available for his PL club on Saturday. The bottom line is that the root of the problem is poor fixture planning and nothing to do with the EL having a Friday race night

And the other two have PL fixtures. Kim Nilsson missed the Wolves meeting on Monday because of a GP qualifier so not having EL meetings on Friday/Sauturday would not avoid that. The biggest problem with riders missing , apart from injuries is fixture clashes with D/u riders. Cook and Grajconak both ride for PL clubs that race on a Friday so they are always going to miss a Lakeside fixture. That is a DU problem. I don't think Cook has ever been to Lakeside because he is always at his PL club, nothing to to with international duty. The fact that Fricke and Neilsson are not available is bad fixture planning. It simply needs proper fixture planning not stopping EL clubs racing on a Friday.

Except that there are no riders on international duty. The reason Belle Vue have half a team of guests is that they have riders piddling around in the PL . It the problem is the double uppers not the international riders. Well come on then explain to me why PL fixtures should take precedence of EL fixtures. ? Matej Zagar and Andreas Jonsson are down to ride. The PL double uppers are missing.

Why should the EL drop weekend racing instead of PL ? Why should the top league play second fiddle to the lower league ?

Sounds like there could be an opening for Lewis Bridger here

Lakeside fans have long given up trying to fathom out how Neil Vatchers mind works when it comes to picking riders for heat 15 !

Four of those will already have ridden one meeting before they get to MG, They have a fairly tight time limit and are probably not going to be there much before the start, hardly the best preparation. It seems incredible the fixture was ever approved in the first place, even more so that it is still going ahead.

But you didn't post what was going on. You posted what wasn't going on Jon Cooks comment at the fans forum in November was that they were looking at a site close to the present location and had consulted a company that specialises in these things.. Nothing was said about moving to Kent. At the forum last week the position was still the same, i.e. that they were looking at a site close to the present locnation , not Kent. I don't know whether 83 year old Len Silver grasped the point you were making or whether something was lost in the question and answer between you but the fact remains that the Lakeside fans were told the same thing last week as they were told in November, except that in November he was cautiously optimistic, now he seems to have got Thurrock Council on board. Nothing has been acieved by spouting this all over the forum other than causing a lot of discontent among the fans who thought they were going to,lose their speedway. It's fine posting things that fans want to know about but it's easy to go off at half cock and get it wrong,

No, I didn't pick him, and not a single member of the crowd picked him. It was purely Neil Vatchers daft idea, and there was a terrible fuss about it among th fans afterwards. Having said that, I am an big fan of Freedie, for years wanted to see him guest for Lakeside and when he did it turned out to be about his worst meeting since he was a junior! I 'd give him another chance though.