steve roberts

Yes I remember Briggo's Golden Greats Meeting at Brandon in 1988...all good fun and at least it gave me the chance to see the great Ove Fundin put in a few laps!

Never liked the fix gate ruling...on occasions it gave a team (or rider) an advantage when they had a run early on with inside gates and then vice versa (as the dirt began to move out) The outside gate at Oxford early on was often a killer (Simon Wigg on at least one occasion confirmed) what with there being a short run up to the first bend. If fixed gates meant alternate gates then it would even things out somewhat but the formula wouldn't obviously allow for that with every rider requiring a share of the gates throughout the meeting. Choice of gates also allowed some tactical play which I was always in favour of and unfortunately, in my opinion, the role of the Team Manager and tactical awareness had become restricted over successive years during my time going to speedway. Of course the argument for introducing fixed gates was to stop the 'star' riders from picking the best gate, which of course often happened, but wasn't always the case and it's interesting when reading articles how common it was that riders of a lesser ability were offered the better choice on occasions in the hope to gain some advantage for the benefit of the team. I recall when England won the World Pairs in 1980 Dave Jessup was instructed to take the more difficult gate and Peter Collins the more advantageous so as the get the desired result which in this case obviously worked. I do remember some years ago Ole Olsen coming up with a theory of riders starting slightly staggered so as to give everyone one a fair chance but can't recall the detail.

Think we'll have to activate a 'Sidney the Robin' and 'Steve Roberts' thread! Do you recall the race between Hans (then Birmingham) and Phil Crump around Swindon (1981?) when they passed and re-passed numerous times? I think that Phil nicked it on the line but a great race!

Tommy could be quite ruthless round the first and second bends and some of his encounters with Hans were hand ringing stuff...no quarter asked or given on both sides. I was at the 1986 World Final and admit that Hans rode a very tough fourth bend and the decision could have gone either way. Personally I felt Tommy was riding his usual 'square' bend and left a gap and tried to close it but unfortunately, for him, Hans had filled it...now if Frank Ebden had been in charge!

Reading on a Bank Holiday Morning...dust flying everywhere and as you say slick as a board. To think that maybe none of those tracks will exist if the situation isn't soon sorted at Blunsdon and Cowley. A real shame and with the apparent demise of Coventry and long gone Dudley Wood all the local derbies that I once enjoyed very much a thing of the past. As regards you're reference to Tommy Knudsen...not one of my favourites I have to say although I would enjoy an interview with him in 'Backtrack!'

However I used to hate that 3TT Easter 'thingie' (the worse heat formula in my view). We always used to get turned over by either the Reading 'Berks' or the Swindon 'Budgies' but then again we had to leave some scraps for you uns to fight over! Per was a master stroke signing and really turned our season round (thanks to Swindon re-introducing the fit again Finn Thomsen?).

Hi Sid! I enjoy having a good old chat/debate about the good old days with you...and perhaps disagreeing on some aspects.. but that's the beauty of having opinions that may differ especially you being a 'Budgie' and myself a 'Rebel/Cheetah!' PS Just sent you a PM! ...nothing quite better than winning a last heat decider. Some we lost...some we won...all added to the drama!

Interesting post and there are aspects of that to which he referred to in his book (quoting Uncle Len) that is very familiar. A bit different to suggesting that he was wrong as has been stated but only that he was stating his preference and his dislike of the double points scenario which is what I was trying to imply when I posted a quote from his book. Thanks for your input and clarification regarding what John had implied and your view on the matter.

Very sad what happened to Billy and John Berry carried that mental burden for years...probably to his dying day...thinking that he could have done more.

Morning Sid! I once recall eavesdropping on a conversation between John and some initially irate Oxford fans at Cowley. He came across as both articulate and thought provoking and they ended up shaking hands generously as they parted. It's interesting reading other people's personal experiences with him and it appears that there was two sides to a very complex and private person. Regarding the quote from John that I placed on this particular thread I think that some people need to read it again as it clearly indicated that the tactical Substitute ruling had it's flaws in his view.

Fascinating piece of work...thanks for the information. Thanks...I remember reading something at the time.

I suggest you read my comment above whereby I respected Davealian's findings but that was never my issue and never doubted that the Tactical Substitute Regulation was flawless in whatever guise as I have quite clearly stated in my previous posts on the subject...as for internet troll? Then we'll leave it at that then. Time to move on I think.

Thanks for that. I respect your findings regarding recent years however I have no working knowledge or understanding of current speedway regulations and have stated all along that my views and opinions were based on my experiences of attending speedway up until 2003. Interesting all the same.

But what are the facts? As I have indicated heat formulae have altered over the years so it's very difficult, if impossible, to compare like with like as the examples I gave in an earlier post indicated. Personally I'm not sure why people have an issue with tactical moves in sport...in football a defender maybe replaced by an attacker in the hope of pulling a goal back or vice versa. I'm sure that tactical ploys are also active in other sports. I just didn't like the 'double points' scenario later adopted in speedway...wasn't the system abused during a Speedway World Cup Final or something? I can't recall the facts (after my time!).

...that scenario wouldn't have taken place under the tried and tested 13 heat formula. In fact subsequent heat formulae have varied considerably since with both fifteen and sixteen adaptations over the intervening years (The National League operated a 16 heat formula during the late seventies early eighties). During the late 80's/early 90's (?) heat 14 was often a reserve only heat prior to the last nominated 'top scores race'. In fact I do recall one season at least whereby the last three (?) heats were all nominated thereby negating that scenario. ...I recall having the misfortune of standing next to a Wolves fan at Monmore Green who continually barked at all those surrounding him if they dared to disagree or contradict him. Sound familiar?

...never said I did however I prefer to take on board what John Berry had to say than your good self!

Have to agree...his books and comments in the 'Backtrack' Magazine were always worth reading. Sometimes controversial but personally I feel he was up there with the best! Yes all genuine promoters who knew the sport inside out. Interesting comments Humph! Remember, with relish, the two matches when Oxford came from eight points down with four heats to go if I recall (perhaps Rob can clarify) during the 1984 season at both Wimbledon and King's Lynn (much to Martin Rogers' disgust!) On both occasions 'The Cheetahs' claimed three 5-1's in the last four heats using tactical moves and riders raising their game to achieve narrow wins! Brilliant stuff! Of course it happened against us on occasions when 'we wuz robbed' during last heat deciders but I remember reading ivan Mauger's book when he commented how satisfying it was to pull a match out of the bag with a last heat 5-1!

Agree Sid! He would have been the right man for the job but when his name was put forward he did the sensible thing and backed off because he soon realised that he wouldn't get the necessary backing from the Promoters of the day to implement his recommendations...an opportunity lost in my view. As regards the Tac.Sub. rule I do remember Exeter occasionally naming Ivan Mauger as number two at the County Ground to deflect any possible tactical moves by the opposition! That was the days when you could declare your 1-5 in any order and not based on average. Number Four was another that was used to that effect, especially when riding away, to give the team a strong last heat pairing. Both Exeter and Belle Vue (amongst others) used that tactic often.

To quote John Berry (who I admired and corresponded with on a couple of occasions) from his most excellent book 'More Confessions' "...the tactical substitution rule was there to keep interest in a match when it was becoming one-sided. It would have been pointless had it not allowed a team the opportunity to actually get back into a winning position but merely closed the gap a little...I find the current replacement (c2006) for the tactical substitute to be a poor alternative. I am not one of those "purists" who screamed about Mickey Mouse aspect of the new rule. After All, the Tac.Sub. rule itself was hardly 'equitable'. No, I just think the new rule is transparently artificial as to look silly"

It was interesting, however, that when Arena Essex (as they were then known) first entered speedway (1984) with a fenceless track it proved unpopular with some riders (Barry Thomas in particular) who argued that they were unable to gauge the exterior of the track often over running. I well recall the sight of marshals having to dismantle the starting tapes post and running with it to the centre before the bikes entered the second lap!

That 'Flying Pig" is having a whale of a time at the moment!

Great image...but look at that safety fence! Some great looking motorcycles!

Sad news indeed.

If I recall the Speedway Star used to quote the British attendance figures during a short trial basis?

Interesting article in the recently published magazine 'Broadslide' which has an article about "Board Track Racing' in the States and how it was deemed too dangerous and a loose surface was soon adopted and, as they say, the rest is history!