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TotallyHonestJohn

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  1. Keep dangling that rod IronScorpion you will get a bite eventually LOL Regards THJ
  2. Honestly I haven't got a clue why but for what ever reason the Aussie championships have been brought forward a full month, someone may be able to enlighten us as to why this has happened this year but it hasn't done Worky any favours at all Regards THJ
  3. Honestly Tried to make this as easy as possible to read but stick with it (the worlds longest post) The key points for me; and this is my personal opinion; the following is only the idea to try find a consensus. You need a structure that everyone can see and build teams to compete in. No one wants to go into the top league so there is that issue fr a start and there is the perceived imbalance in the second tier, also I haven't even looked at any other suggestions such as rule changes and limitations as I believe taking out rules rather than adding them in, you cant cheat if there isn't a rule there to break. To me there are 3 Team Options to discuss if we need to propose a change from 7 man teams 5 man format 15 heat rigid 6 man format 15 heat rigid 6 man format 12 heat rigid + last 3 heat multiple choice rider selections to give 15 heats This is pretty straight forward I would suggest Once there has been a decision on the team/race format you need a league structure For the League Structure in my humble opinion there are 3 Options 1 big league (Simple enough however I believe the weaker teams crowds will crash if in the bottom 3 or 4 of the league but riders averages will level out) 2 leagues on a who fancies going up basis with riders on differing averages between leagues and the possibility of doubling up/down (So no change really)(and no real volunteers to go into the top league) 2 leagues on a single league format (eh!) no doubling up or down no average off sets or formulas (The cream will rise to the top but something to keep weaker teams viable) The meat of the proposal is as follows for Option 3 above for two leagues; which sounds complicated but it’s not it’s just one big league split in two. TWO DIVISIONS NORTH AND SOUTH - BASED ON 9 TEAMS IN EACH REGIONAL DIVISION NORTHERN DIVISION SOUTHERN DIVISION 1 Belle Vue Aces King's Lynn Stars 2 Berwick Bandits Somerset Rebels 3 Workington Comets Swindon Robins 4 Glasgow Tigers Poole Pirates 5 Edinburgh Monarchs Wolverhampton Wolves 6 Scunthorpe Scorpions Leicester Lions 7 Newcastle Diamonds Lakeside Hammers 8 Sheffield Tigers Peterborough Panthers 9 Redcar Bears Ipswich Witches Above as an exercise is based loosely on final league positions and this forms the first part of the season to get us to the serious competition stages (and of course if we believe all that we read this may not be the list of teams starting next year) Two leagues form up as Regional Divisions so the money spinner local derbies should encourage fans to travel and the meetings are as follows (Note: This does not include any local challenge matches and only the base line of competitive fixtures) (No end-of or pre-season friendlies included) GUARANTEED FIXTURES (FOR TWO REGIONAL DIVISIONS OF 9); TWO DIVISIONS OF 9 = 16 DIVISIONAL MEETINGS; 8 HOME 8 AWAY THE SEASON STARTS 22ND MARCH AND ENDS 30TH JUNE FOR ALL REGIONAL DIVISION FIXTURES (Final Divisional places dictate which League you go into for the second part of the season) After the first half of the season the better teams will obviously rise to the top positions in each Division as above and the split takes place as follows TOP FOUR FROM EACH REGIONAL DIVISION GO INTO PREMIERSHIP LEAGUE 1 THE REMAINDER INTO CHAMPIONSHIP LEAGUE 2 PREMIERSHIP League 1 1 Belle Vue Aces 2 King's Lynn Stars 3 Berwick Bandits 4 Somerset Rebels 5 Workington Comets 6 Swindon Robins 7 Glasgow Tigers 8 Poole Pirates CHAMPIONSHIP League 2 1 Edinburgh Monarchs 2 Wolverhampton Wolves 3 Lakeside Hammers 4 Ipswich Witches 5 Scunthorpe Scorpions 6 Newcastle Diamonds 7 Leicester Lions 8 Peterborough Panthers 9 Sheffield Tigers 10 Redcar Bears So the second part of the season pans out to end up with the play off teams in both leagues with competition and interest for maximum periods. The theory being meetings should be closer as the strong teams will have split out into the top league and play each other. No doubling up or down or across as you don’t know where you will end up for the second half of the season. Everything is geared to competitiveness and keeping matches as close as possible. It also ensures that the perceived top riders/teams are meeting in the Premiership over the season. It should take the fear factor out of the clubs (northern clubs especially) to go up as travel is minimised (still retaining the regional money generators first half of the season and only 7 away fixtures (4 potential big travels) in the top league to reach a potential play-off position) (Ippo, Boro and Lakeside had 8 big away days this season) GUARANTEED FIXTURES (FOR LEAGUE 1 OF 8 TEAMS); = 14 PREMIERSHIP MEETINGS; 7 HOME 7 AWAY GUARANTEED FIXTURES (FOR LEAGUE 2 OF 10 TEAMS); = 18 CHAMPIONSHIP MEETINGS; 9 HOME 9 AWAY TOP FOUR IN EACH LEAGUE TO PLAY OF FOR LEAGUE CHAMPIONS STRAIGHT KNOCK OUT (or top 2 in League 2 to reduce fixtures) (if required) THE LEAGUE SEASON STARTS NO LATER THAN 1ST JULY AND ENDS 30TH SEPTEMBER PLAY OFFS CONCLUDED BY 31ST OCTOBER KNOCK OUT CUP PRELIMINARY MATCH 1 HOME 1 AWAY (1st Draw North & South in region then last 8 teams pot luck) KNOCK OUT CUP REGIONS START EARLY IN THE SEASON COMPLETED BY 30TH JUNE QUARTER, SEMI FINAL & FINAL BEFORE 1ST OCTOBER GUARANTEED MINIMUM NUMBER OF 32 MEETINGS 16 HOME 16 AWAY FOR EVERY CLUB The figure of 32 assumes a team gets in to League 1 but misses the play offs and goes out of the cup at the first stage (League 2 team 36 meetings) The potential maximum number of competitive fixtures for a successful team could be For a Division 1 team winning the Cup from a preliminary round and the League play-off is 42 (21 Home 21 Away) For a Division 2 team winning the Cup from a preliminary round and the League play-off is 48 (24 Home 24 Away) This is one big league just split into two and and set to a region and it then allows the stronger teams to have a go at each other for the second half of the season and pick your own preferred race day/night. Everyone meets once in the Regional Division and once in the League and the stronger teams will rise to the top With this scenario weaker teams will be able to minimise the impact of being in the bottom two or three of a big league and shouldn’t experience many home losses Riders averages will not need any adjustment as no doubling up/down required and team ability should be closer Following season you are back in your regional group and going for the top slot in that division again so no promotion or relegation This Division/League format gives every club in the country a chance to be the top team in the country if they want to and it is purely performance and success driven The bottom two/three teams in the premiership must feel the impact of being bottom of that league with nothing to play for My only view/fear on the format would be some teams will potentially ride/build (deliberately) to be 5th in the regional table to really have a go at Division 2 (Maybe that’s me being a little bit cynical however it would/could/should be difficult to do!) (possibly) Also the bottom three (should be 4) this year in the Premiership; would they be happy if they were in that position at the midway point of the season and then have to drop into the Championship for the second half of the season as that would be the scenario if they were in those positions in their Regional League. Although they would then have the opportunity to win that 2nd league of course You are dealing with Marmite some will love it and others I suspect will hate it however it is all about finding a common position that everyone can work to and with, also to give the opportunity to maximise the local fixtures and the returns from these meetings in the first half of the season and again the benefit to Belle Vue should be clearly measurable racing against their nearest promotions in the first half of the season. Once the decision is made on 5 or 6 man teams (or staying at 7) and the meeting format over the 15 heats, the set-up of the teams is the next critical factor and what exactly can be achieved from the rider pool of available riders and what the rider averages will settle at in the preferred league structure. The options above dictate as to how the leagues will be set-up for future seasons going forward. In this and previous seasons the rider pool has been 2016 season 150 riders were used by the 21 Teams in two leagues 8 teams Div. 1 and 13 teams Div. 2 2017 season 125 riders were used by the 18 Teams in two leagues 8 teams Div. 1 and 10 teams Div. 2 2018 season 119 riders have been used by the 18/19 Teams in two leagues 7/8 teams Div. 1 and 11 teams Div. 2 With no Doubling up/down the following number of riders are required 18 x 7 man teams = 126 Riders 19 x 7 man teams = 133 Riders 20 x 7 man teams = 140 Riders 18 x 6 man teams = 108 Riders 19 x 6 man teams = 114 Riders 20 x 6 man teams = 120 Riders 18 x 5 man teams = 90 Riders 19 x 5 man teams = 95 Riders 20 x 5 man teams = 100 Riders How many riders will retire, leave, not come back or just commit to other leagues reducing the rider pool? Also how many riders will come up from the national league and how much will the quality be diluted and will the step up be too great for NL riders. Depending on how many riders are in the team and what the leagues are like the team build options and benefits I believe are as follows One big league or two smaller leagues that come together later will mean there is no need for complicated offsets or multipliers the rider will find their own average Smaller teams mean Higher averages potentially so instead of continually setting a lower build figure a team build to 45 points or more could be achieved Potential to band riders so everyone gets a chance of picking up signings (however this can prove to be complicated when you start applying restrictions) 5/6 man teams could have been achieved this year without the need to double up or down If many of the top riders or foreign riders walk the bottom end of the rider pool will need strengthened with a larger pool and the build average slightly lowered possibly. There is a great deal to take in here with much to discuss however the time is right to get the whole thing out in the open and formulate a plan for the next 5 to 7 years and possibly beyond this so continuity and consistency can prevail and the fans/public can see what the BSPA are trying to achieve. I believe there is a need for an independent chairperson at least to throw things around and stimulate debate and hopefully reach a positive outcome. However I honestly believe it will be a hard slog and sell to pull everyone roughly together as I can imagine there will be a fair bit of resistance and ultimately I don't hold out much confidence that anything will change any time soon due to self interest. Right get your guns out and start shooting its open season Regards THJ
  4. TotallyHonestJohn

    Workington 2018 .

    Actually the blow up and whole fixture fiasco stemmed from a Scunny Sunday fixture as it happens, but that is all history now. Lets hope the weather holds up and the 7 meetings Worky have to fit in over the last 13 days of the season from this Fridays meeting with Lakeside at Rye House with only two weekends left is going to be a real squeeze. The last thing Worky need is bad weather. Regards THJ
  5. In your case Jenga you can use all four thumbs nine fingers and fifteen toes, count the webbed ones as two. Regards THJ
  6. For those who asked here it is in simple (LOL) terms what Ty has to achieve in that last Championship fixture against Lakeside As stated by Yellow and Black it will be "such an uphill task to get that 7.00 figure." Regards THJ
  7. Double Double header, or a Double Double Double header, or how about a Speedway-athon, Bring your sleeping-bag and we will start at 8 in the morning and just keep going until it finishes even if that's 8 the following morning. Yeah!!!! Regards THJ
  8. Think you are right however there looked to be more fans in total at the Workington meeting than the Glasgow one. From where I was in the pits it didn't look like there was over 600 fans in at Ashfield and they seemed somewhat subdued, but appreciate it is deceiving, and there must have been double the fans travelled to Derwent Park than went the other way. It needs to be said both clubs have a good away following and it does make for a better meeting when you have fans from both sides cheering their side on Regards THJ
  9. Sorry couldn't help myself Regards THJ
  10. Honestly Cami Brown can you hear me "Your boys took one hell of a beating" Nicola Sturgeon, Alex Salmond are you listening "your boys took one hell of a beating" Manse. Sharpenrake, Cinderfella, Cami Brown, Cami Brown, "Can you hear me", Robert Nagy, Shane Parker, James Grieves, are you listening "Your boys, your boys, Oh Your Boys took one hell of a beating" Jim McMillan Jimmy Beaton Charlie Monk, Tommy Miller, Shane Parker, Dorothy58, Tapeworm, OMG are you listening Oh!!! Donald Dewar, Trent Leverington, David Nagel, Paulco, Cami Brown Roary The Tiger"Roary OMG" Kenny Dagleish, Jock Stein, Bobby Murdock, Roy Aitken, Jinky Jimmy Johnstone, Your boys got one hell of a beating, one hell of a beating. Can you hear me Robert the Bruce, William Wallace, Mary Queen of Scots, William the Lion, Bonnie Prince Charlie, Robert Burns, Can you hear me your boys took one hell of a beating. Regards THJ Oh and just for context and those not around in 1981 see below and thanks to Bjørge Lillelien
  11. Do not disagree whatsoever, what's Chris now 36? Robbo has just called it a day! I think many of these guys who are getting to an age will call it quits, rather than race in one league for one team, which is sad as they still have in my opinion a great deal to offer, however will their ego's stop them from going "part time" or "semi professional" for want of a better phrase, I don't honestly know but it will be interesting to see what happens next year Regards THJ
  12. Honestly While I am on a role I will tell you something else that boiled my bladder a tad, that was seeing Cami Brown walking down the track whilst Rasser was being attended to after his fall and Cami having a go at "Staring Marshall George" berating him for what he though as George having a go at his riders whilst sitting at the start. Surely he should have been ringing the referee not standing over "laal George" pointing and poking, no one likes a bully, However the best laugh was Cami had a go at Ty in the pits at Ashfield and 5 foot 6 and 9 stone soaking wet Ty stood up to 6 foot 4 and 22 stone Cami when debating the "state of the track" which Ty was less than impressed with and Cami definitely dropped his bottle and even went crying to Jacko at one point PMSL, made of feisty stuff these little Aussies Regards THJ
  13. Chris stated earlier in the season when Rye went under that he was seriously considering his position and if Poole hadn't come in for him he would have given serious consideration to hanging up his "Racing Jacket" If doubling up goes next year and "one big league" will put pay to that, then I believe you will see some of the "older guys" retiring fully from the sport. Many of the top riders rely on racing for two, three or four teams to earn a living full time out of the sport and doubling up in the UK was always an easy option for many riders. Regards THJ
  14. As it stands at present if Ty doesn't reach the number of points required in the Lakeside league match to take his average above 7 then he will potentially need to go home to race in the Australian championships and if he does need to go home along with Mason then both will be deemed to be with-holing their services and Workington will receive a facility as per the rule book. So rider average or average + 5% at home for each rider. However the added problem to this is most riders have packed up for the season so the choice of guest is severely limited and of course next year the two returning Aussie riders (should they qualify) will receive 28 day bans for the start of next season. However there will be (sorry Jenga) ""more to follow" on this as I can see it developing further and the league match has to run no matter how meaningless people perceive this meeting to be. Eh!!! considering the Scottish Cup was a "meaningless match" on Friday the 5th of October and then Glasgow flatly refused to come to Workington on Saturday the 6th of October "surely" it would have made more sense to have the Play Off matches that weekend, especially when it was warm and sunny allowing Workington another weekend to fit their fixtures in, or at least the 6th at Derwent Park and the one meeting on Sunday the 14th at Ashfield rather than Glasgow prevaricating and procrastinating trying to "buy time" for an injured rider, on an ever diminishing time scale, but alas time stops for no man and certainly cant be bought. Isn't Karma a bitch!!!. Pity the match wasn't run the previous week in the sunshine without the track pre-soaking and who knows the result may have been totally different as the weather had a major bearing on both meetings in my opinion. However on a glorious late Autumn day up at Ashfield which was more like a "Tatty Field" with deep wet shale on a heavily rutted surface, that at one point, this wet shale built up and stuck so fast behind Rasser's spark plug that it pushed the cap off causing his engine failure, and caused most of the riders no amount of problems with the "grippy" surface. Then back to Derwent Park that due to its clay make up meant that the surface was really slick and resulted in a "gater's" paradise with all the riders chasing the same line which definitely impacted on the result But then again as this only happens in British speedway LOL here's an daft idea!!! Due to Glasgow not accepting any of the dates proposed by Workington and they will potentially be the main reason "the actual league match didn't go ahead" and "Worky who would undoubtedly face sanctions for not finishing their matches in a competition in which they reached the final without having to have completed all their league matches" Glasgow can meet any sanctions or fines levied eh? now that's fair isn't it? Regards THJ
  15. Haha No a had the day off after that epic contest yesterday. Back in the office tomorrow and much prefer posting from my lap top rather than the phone, mainly because I am short of lamp oil and to vain to wear glasses so struggle to see this laal screen. However fixture wise Lakeside in the Shield Friday at Rye Lakeside double header at DP on the Saturday with the Shield being the first one and the League match the second one. Then it's off to Scunny on Sunday for the first leg of the Cup. These meetings are confirmed. We need the other Semi between Boro and Lakeside sorted before we can put that one to bed. There was a great post put up about what Ty had to do to reach a 7 average and I will find that tomorrow and post on it again as it was spot on. None of the Cup Shield or Play Off matches contribute to a riders averages. Regards THJ
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