JT 167 Posted September 30, 2012 (edited) Taking away commercial considerations, can anyone think of a single reason to justify having Woffinden in the series next year? Genuine question, because I can't. He's not British Champion (despite the final being held on his home track), he's had a wildcard before (and was woeful) and although he did quite well in World Cup race-off (he was average in Event 2), he was outperformed by MJJ. On the subject of 'commercial considerations', would anyone of us currently watching GP's, stop watching, because a token Brit wasn't included? What are the odds on Woffinden getting a place, the excuse being his 14 point haul (incl. a Joker) in the World Cup race off, and Monster announcing a sponsorship deal? JT. Edited September 30, 2012 by JT Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lucifer sam 3,954 Posted September 30, 2012 (edited) IF Woffinden had a decent team to support his scores he would have won a WTC, as for the GP when he was thrown in last time he was not ready. He is now number one at his club and is a far far better rider than MJJ .... of that there is no doubt at all So this year where was Woffinden in the British Grand Prix? Oh, that's right, he failed to quality despite the British Final being on his home track. You are joking that Woffinden is a better rider than MJJ? What has Woffinden ever won? Evidence please. Being the No 1 at Wolves is no qualification (just means he's least worst of your riders) - if he was No 1 for his Swedish and Polish teams, I'd be much more impressed. All the best Rob Edited September 30, 2012 by lucifer sam Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DougieD 50 Posted September 30, 2012 (edited) So this year where was Woffinden in the British Grand Prix? Oh, that's right, he failed to quality despite the British Final being on his home track. You are joking that Woffinden is a better rider than MJJ? What has Woffinden ever won? Evidence please. Being the No 1 at Wolves is no qualification (just means he's least worst of your riders) - if he was No 1 for his Swedish and Polish teams, I'd be much more impressed. All the best Rob Woffinden would have been British Champion apart from Eddies fall, what is MJJ's average in the Elite, please no first season crap he is supposed to be a WTC champion after all so it should not be a problem, and a GP champion FIVE last places last night in a field a rider of his "supposed" calibre should have waltzed thru ... FIVE ... 0-0-0-0-0 = 0pts .... not that good at all really Edited September 30, 2012 by DougieD Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lucifer sam 3,954 Posted September 30, 2012 Woffinden would have been British Champion apart from Eddies fall, what is MJJ's average in the Elite, please no first season crap he is supposed to be a WTC champion after all so it should not be a problem, and a GP champion FIVE last places last night in a field a rider of his "supposed" calibre should have waltzed thru ... FIVE ... 0-0-0-0-0 = 0pts .... not that good at good really As I thought, no evidence at all. Woffinden "would have been British Champion". Not good enough - he could have still won the rerun. Anyway, that was last year's excuse; he should have still gone out and won it this year. If he can't beat Nicholls and Harris, he's got no chance against the World's Elite. I've got nothing against Tai Woffinden, but he will be humiliated in the Grand Prix next year unless he puts his head down and steps it up big time. He's not ready. Maybe in a couple of years, he will be. But let's have a British rider because we deserve one, not just because of politics. All the best Rob Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
orion 7,619 Posted September 30, 2012 Woffinden would have been British Champion apart from Eddies fall, what is MJJ's average in the Elite, please no first season crap he is supposed to be a WTC champion after all so it should not be a problem, and a GP champion FIVE last places last night in a field a rider of his "supposed" calibre should have waltzed thru ... FIVE ... 0-0-0-0-0 = 0pts .... not that good at all really How did Woffy get on last night ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JT 167 Posted September 30, 2012 (edited) Woffinden would have been British Champion apart from Eddies fall, what is MJJ's average in the Elite, please no first season crap he is supposed to be a WTC champion after all so it should not be a problem, and a GP champion FIVE last places last night in a field a rider of his "supposed" calibre should have waltzed thru ... FIVE ... 0-0-0-0-0 = 0pts .... not that good at all really The importance of the British Elite League pails into insignificance compared to the Swedish Elitserien and Polish Ekstraliga (both neutral grounds). Out of interest, how do the riders compare there? Let me help you... Swedish Elitserien Michael Jepsen Jensen 7.71 Tai Woffinden 6.91 Polish Ekstraliga Michael Jepsen Jensen 7.82 Tai Woffinden 7.15 Sure MJJ was woeful in yesterday's Challenge, but giving his accomplishments this season AND the fact he's better than Woffinden in the world's toughest leagues, then he surely 'deserves' a place over Woffinden every day of the week. JT. Edited September 30, 2012 by JT 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DougieD 50 Posted September 30, 2012 The importance of the British Elite League pails into insignificance compared to the Swedish Elitserien and Polish Ekstraliga (both neutral grounds). Out of interest, how do the riders compare there? Let me help you... Swedish Elitserien Michael Jepsen Jensen 7.71 Tai Woffinden 6.91 Polish Ekstraliga Michael Jepsen Jensen 7.82 Tai Woffinden 7.15 Sure MJJ was woeful in yesterday's Challenge, but giving his accomplishments this season AND the fact he's better than Woffinden in the world's toughest leagues, then he surely 'deserves' a place over Woffinden every day of the week. JT. So why he MJJ NOT so dominating in our "oh so weak" league ??? ..... answers on a postcard please How did Woffy get on last night ? He was injured so could not qualify otherwise he would have won it As I thought, no evidence at all. Woffinden "would have been British Champion". Not good enough - he could have still won the rerun. Anyway, that was last year's excuse; he should have still gone out and won it this year. If he can't beat Nicholls and Harris, he's got no chance against the World's Elite. I've got nothing against Tai Woffinden, but he will be humiliated in the Grand Prix next year unless he puts his head down and steps it up big time. He's not ready. Maybe in a couple of years, he will be. But let's have a British rider because we deserve one, not just because of politics. All the best Rob He IS ready, he can gate and is fast in front .... and thats half the battle on some of those gaters paradise tracks they race on Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JT 167 Posted September 30, 2012 So why he MJJ NOT so dominating in our "oh so weak" league ??? ..... answers on a postcard please Sorry I must have missed the season where Tai Woffinden 'dominated' the British Elite League... JT. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ghostwalker 1,859 Posted September 30, 2012 Think TNT has the wilcards spot on ... as for MJJ he won on a track where he has ridden since he was 8, he holds the track record and the track conditions were more suited to him than some of the stars. Last night he showed us what he IS capable of in a much weaker field. That alone will have cost him any chance of a wildcard. That didn't Help Pavlic yesterday.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DougieD 50 Posted September 30, 2012 (edited) Sorry I must have missed the season where Tai Woffinden 'dominated' the British Elite League... JT. I aint touting Tai as the next Messiah am I ... just worthy of a GP place, if MJJ is so good he should be walking our weak league, after all he is a star in the much more powerful foriegn leagues so this should be easy for him Edited September 30, 2012 by DougieD Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JT 167 Posted September 30, 2012 I aint touting Tai as the next Messiah am I ... just worthy of a GP place, if MJJ is so good he should be walking our weak league, after all he is a star in the much more powerful foriegn leagues so this should be easy for him But you are touting Woffinden as a more worthy option than MJJ for a GP place. Unfortunately from a British perspective, Elite League average aside, Jepsen Jensen beats Woffinden in every single category, as many of us have demonstrated. This won't stop the Speedway Star and SKY taking a blind eye to the facts, and lauding the decision to give a Brit another wildcard, but most of us can see he'll only be in there because of his nationality. Here we have a rare opportunity to have arguably the best 14 riders in the world AND the likely World U21 Champion lining up for the GP's. I hope BSI don't throw this opportunity away. JT. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ghostwalker 1,859 Posted September 30, 2012 (edited) So why he MJJ NOT so dominating in our "oh so weak" league ??? ..... answers on a postcard please A few posts ago you said that MJJ's win at Vojens was due to track knowledge since he have been riding for Vojens for many years. My question for you then, who says that Tai's higher average is EL is the merit for including Tai in SGP, is how long have Tai been riding for Wolverhampton and how many years in the Elite League? How many meetings per season have Tai had at those tracks and how many meetings have MJJ done at Vojens per season? Regarding their Swedish averges, Tai started riding in Sweden in 2008 and MJJ started in 2010. yet MJJ have a higher average then tai, Then their correct averages for 2012 should be 1.726 for MJJ and 1,636 for Tai. That is the same as an 8,054 points per meeting average for MJJ and 7.198 for Tai. The first is average points per heat and the second is heats divided by number of meetings * average points per heat. Edited September 30, 2012 by Ghostwalker Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DougieD 50 Posted September 30, 2012 (edited) We shall see, Woffinden WILL be in the GP next season if he chooses to do so. As a Brit I do not give a monkeys about whether a Dane, Swede, Pole etc gets in or not. If this was any other country and one of there riders were likely to be given a spot they would be getting massive support .. as they say "only in the UK" Edited September 30, 2012 by DougieD Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JT 167 Posted September 30, 2012 (edited) We shall see, Woffinden WILL be in the GP next season if he chooses to do so. As a Brit I do not give a monkeys about whether a Dane, Swede, Pole etc gets in or not. If this was any other country and one of there riders were likely to be given a spot they would be getting massive support .. as they say "only in the UK" Valid point BUT the problem is greater than a token Brit embarrassing himself in the GP's every season. The most dangerous effect of a British wildcard every season is those running British Speedway see us having a rider in the series as evidence that everything is fine at international level. They all know it isn't, and that we're only there thanks to BSI charity, but simply having someone in the series means every winter they can have the same crappy conference, alter the rules a little and totally ignore the lack of world class talent in this country. IF BSI had the balls to give the wildcards out on merit, rather than nationality, the BSPA and co may be forced into change. Again, I won't hold my breath.. JT. Edited September 30, 2012 by JT Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
comebackkings 113 Posted September 30, 2012 I will tout Woffinden for next years GP's, only because he IS the best British option at the moment. Once we lose the single Brit it will take years to get it back, so you can take your, "it doesn't matter if there is a Brit in the GP's" and shove it. If there is not a Brit in the GP's I will not be watching the GP's. If that makes me a little Englander then so be it. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
