Belle Vues National Speedway Stadium

[Grand Central 2,654]

 

 

Are you sure about that? I thought MCC were funding the stadium with the club paying it back over 60 years.

 

Whatever the funding though with the perilous state of the sport in this country the council are likely going to be left with a £6,000.000 white elephant long long before the money is repaid.

 

I wonder if any Speedway promotion in the history of the sport has ever made the equivalent of £4.5M to £6M profit.

 

I doubt that THF (and their predecessors) ever did that at the old Zoo.

[mikec 412]

I wonder if any Speedway promotion in the history of the sport has ever made the equivalent of £4.5M to £6M profit.

 

I doubt that THF (and their predecessors) ever did that at the old Zoo.

I genuinely detect a desire for the project to FAIL from several posters on this forum. It probably contributes to why so few Aces followers contribute on the BSF any more & stick to their own forum. Because the project has been delayed due to 12 months+ of additional consideration by MCC (confirmed by New East Manchester) & there have been periods of no news, contributors decide to fill in the blanks themselves. What would you negative speculators on here get out of the Belle Vue scheme failing? Some warped sense of satisfaction? Please enlighten me & other Aces fans as it would be interesting to know.

[SCB 15]

I genuinely detect a desire for the project to FAIL from several posters on this forum. It probably contributes to why so few Aces followers contribute on the BSF any more & stick to their own forum. Because the project has been delayed due to 12 months+ of additional consideration by MCC (confirmed by New East Manchester) & there have been periods of no news, contributors decide to fill in the blanks themselves. What would you negative speculators on here get out of the Belle Vue scheme failing? Some warped sense of satisfaction? Please enlighten me & other Aces fans as it would be interesting to know.

This is just typical of speedway. No news is the fans fault. Well maybe if the club/managment actually updated us it would not be an issue and nobody would speculate. But no, we can't possibly let the fans know whats going on!

[oldace 1,678]

I wonder if any Speedway promotion in the history of the sport has ever made the equivalent of £4.5M to £6M profit.

 

I doubt that THF (and their predecessors) ever did that at the old Zoo.

 

To be honest the way THF leisure ran the zoological gardens was the business model most speedway promoters would later follow.

 

They spent zero on the grounds allowing them to deteriorate year on year believing the public would still come in their droves, paying the same, or more, for more and more substandard facilities. By the late 70s the grounds were an ancient relic of a bygone era, the crowds all gone never to return.

 

Sound familiar!!!!!

[mikec 412]

This is just typical of speedway. No news is the fans fault. Well maybe if the club/managment actually updated us it would not be an issue and nobody would speculate. But no, we can't possibly let the fans know whats going on!

You're dead right SCB, the promotion should update us. Does that justify only negative speculation to fill the gaps?

[oldace 1,678]

What would you negative speculators on here get out of the Belle Vue scheme failing? Some warped sense of satisfaction? Please enlighten me & other Aces fans as it would be interesting to know.

 

What on earth are you wittering about. If people express concern that this project seems unlikely then that means they dont want it to happen ? What an idiotic comment

 

I would wager that not 1, not 1 single person on this forum wants this to fail and to a man would be delighted if it ever comes off.

[SCB 15]

You're dead right SCB, the promotion should update us. Does that justify only negative speculation to fill the gaps?

Possibly, possibly not. But the easiest way to stop it is to give the real information. People will always fill gaps when they're not given information.

[Derwent 271]

The Council are borrowing from 'Prudential Borrowing' (what is this?) themselves so that it is not coming out of Council Revenues.

 

Prudential Borrowing refers to the Prudential Code which all local authorities must by law adhere to for capital projects. Its all very complicated but basically it means that councils need to fund projects the cheapest way possible, and where possible the project should be self-funding over a period of time - i.e. the initial capital is repaid via revenues from the project.

[mikec 412]

Possibly, possibly not. But the easiest way to stop it is to give the real information. People will always fill gaps when they're not given information.

True. Be great to read positive speculation about the young British speedway talent that will be brought through on a facility available 7 days a week. Or the young apprentices who will gain skills & work through the classroom/workshop facilities on site etc etc...... all far too dull for many I know. Never gonna happen SCB I accept that. In amongst the doom I thought I'd offer an alternative angle....

Edited July 25, 2013 by mikec

[Grand Central 2,654]

 

I genuinely detect a desire for the project to FAIL from several posters on this forum. It probably contributes to why so few Aces followers contribute on the BSF any more & stick to their own forum. Because the project has been delayed due to 12 months+ of additional consideration by MCC (confirmed by New East Manchester) & there have been periods of no news, contributors decide to fill in the blanks themselves. What would you negative speculators on here get out of the Belle Vue scheme failing? Some warped sense of satisfaction? Please enlighten me & other Aces fans as it would be interesting to know.

 

I forgot that golden rule relating to projects like this.

Blind optimism helps immensely in bringing it to fruition.

Whereas the airing of concerns, pragmatism and realism are always to be avoided.

 

To be honest the way THF leisure ran the zoological gardens was the business model most speedway promoters would later follow.

They spent zero on the grounds allowing them to deteriorate year on year believing the public would still come in their droves, paying the same, or more, for more and more substandard facilities. By the late 70s the grounds were an ancient relic of a bygone era, the crowds all gone never to return.

Sound familiar!!!!!

 

Oh, yes, you're quite right.

I was actually referring really to the Speedway operation at Hyde Road in the almost 60 years it ran.

We always called that The Zoo.

Not the actual Zoo.

 

That had, probably the best chance of being the most profitable Speedway operation in the Uk.

But did it really ever bring in the level of earnings that are going to be required to pay off this debt now being taken on?

Edited July 25, 2013 by Grand Central

[Humphrey Appleby 13,983]

True. Be great to read positive speculation about the young British speedway talent that will be brought through on a facility available 7 days a week.

 

There's little point speculating before work on the place has actually started.

 

I don't think anyone wants these sort of projects to fail, but how many times have fans been strung along by promises that never materialised (Reading and Swindon come to mind here)? The proposed Belle Vue development is undoubtedly well intentioned, but it's quite apparent the stated timescales were excessively optimistic, and some simple inquiries on the Internet reveal many of the necessary things have yet to be put in place.

 

Given that this scheme is actively soliciting money from the public as well, I think it's entirely appropriate that pertinent questions are asked about when/if construction is actually going to start.

[The White Knight 9,039]

Personally I may be tempted to buy a Brick. I would not even consider it until the construction of the proposed Stadium was under way. I am optimistic that the new Stadium will be built - BUT - I will wait and see.

 

I do agree that there should be more information put in to the Public domain by the promoters.

[oldace 1,678]

There's little point speculating before work on the place has actually started.

 

I don't think anyone wants these sort of projects to fail, but how many times have fans been strung along by promises that never materialised (Reading and Swindon come to mind here)? The proposed Belle Vue development is undoubtedly well intentioned, but it's quite apparent the stated timescales were excessively optimistic, and some simple inquiries on the Internet reveal many of the necessary things have yet to be put in place.

 

Given that this scheme is actively soliciting money from the public as well, I think it's entirely appropriate that pertinent questions are asked about when/if construction is actually going to start.

 

It isn't just the money though. Can the council justify giving over a piece of land to a speedway stadium that will attract 800 to 1200 people on approx 18 nights a year. Even as a speedway fan who would love it to happen In my heart of hearts this whole project seems far fetched

[Humphrey Appleby 13,983]

It isn't just the money though. Can the council justify giving over a piece of land to a speedway stadium that will attract 800 to 1200 people on approx 18 nights a year.

 

Councils give over land to athletics stadiums that would be lucky to pull that sort of crowd on one night a year, and there are probably numerous other 'minority' sports that get similar sort of support. There is value in supporting community facilities and the fact they're even considering accommodating speedway can probably be taken as a positive, even if the figures seem a bit unrealistic as pointed out.

[oldace 1,678]

Councils give over land to athletics stadiums that would be lucky to pull that sort of crowd on one night a year, and there are probably numerous other 'minority' sports that get similar sort of support. There is value in supporting community facilities and the fact they're even considering accommodating speedway can probably be taken as a positive, even if the figures seem a bit unrealistic as pointed out.

 

I am not aware of too many "Athletic Stadiums" being constructed in the past 10 years or so (Olympics excepted) Maybe plenty of land is used for Athletics but that is rather more aimed at participation than spectating. Even as a school field (and the school next door were given to believe it would be used as such) it would get much more use.