Sgp/bsi And Sec/one Sport It Is War Now

[The Pedaler 149]

When FIM Europe and it's predecessors ran the European Championships (for at least the last 12 odd years) no-one in Britain cared about it, if they even knew about it. It was considered by the authorities as a "Mickey Mouse" competition, in the same way as other European events are treated as "Mickey Mouse", why? Because they had no bearing on (speedway) life in Britain.

 

Now, an promotional organisation grabs the European Championships by the scruff of the neck, puts serious money into it, and attracts riders to it, and everyone is up in arms.

 

Why? Because it's happening in Poland. Plain and simple. How dare they?

 

Much of the sponsorship money for international speedway comes from Poland, or at least before Fogo and Nice pulled out, it did. Many of the competing riders are Polish and other East Europeans, Why on earth should the Poles NOT benefit from their investment in the new competition? Why should the Poles be happy that BSI (Bellamy's Speedway Investment) demand millions of Zloties from the cities of Gorzow, Torun and Bydgoszcz, in return for the SGP being run there? Why should Polish (amongst others) TV companies pay royalties to a British company to show the racing that's happening in their own back yard? Why should Polish riders, if Emil Sayfutdinov is to be believed, be treated like cattle by Bellamy & Co and be made to travel to far off places like New Zealand for little net benefit? And who can blame Emil Sayfutdinov for choosing a competition that has a round in his own country when BSI don't?

 

Now say for instance if Barry Hearne had got control of the SEC instead of OneSport. Would there be any of this xenophobic claptrap then? Everyone in Britain would be saying that it was a great thing that Hearne was going to be able to promote a speedway tournament, It would have been seen as the best thing since sliced bread. My god, someone who knows something about promotion would have been out there promoting speedway. Fantastic, There's another thread lauding Barry Hearne up to the heavens. However, apart from being British, which would have made everything alright, does anyone really think he would have done anything much different to what OneSport have done?

[Trees 2,814]

Poland had to kick up rough one day!

[SCB 6]

When FIM Europe and it's predecessors ran the European Championships (for at least the last 12 odd years) no-one in Britain cared about it, if they even knew about it. It was considered by the authorities as a "Mickey Mouse" competition, in the same way as other European events are treated as "Mickey Mouse", why? Because they had no bearing on (speedway) life in Britain.

 

Now, an promotional organisation grabs the European Championships by the scruff of the neck, puts serious money into it, and attracts riders to it, and everyone is up in arms.

 

Why? Because it's happening in Poland. Plain and simple. How dare they?

 

Much of the sponsorship money for international speedway comes from Poland, or at least before Fogo and Nice pulled out, it did. Many of the competing riders are Polish and other East Europeans, Why on earth should the Poles NOT benefit from their investment in the new competition? Why should the Poles be happy that BSI (Bellamy's Speedway Investment) demand millions of Zloties from the cities of Gorzow, Torun and Bydgoszcz, in return for the SGP being run there? Why should Polish (amongst others) TV companies pay royalties to a British company to show the racing that's happening in their own back yard? Why should Polish riders, if Emil Sayfutdinov is to be believed, be treated like cattle by Bellamy & Co and be made to travel to far off places like New Zealand for little net benefit? And who can blame Emil Sayfutdinov for choosing a competition that has a round in his own country when BSI don't?

 

Now say for instance if Barry Hearne had got control of the SEC instead of OneSport. Would there be any of this xenophobic claptrap then? Everyone in Britain would be saying that it was a great thing that Hearne was going to be able to promote a speedway tournament, It would have been seen as the best thing since sliced bread. My god, someone who knows something about promotion would have been out there promoting speedway. Fantastic, There's another thread lauding Barry Hearne up to the heavens. However, apart from being British, which would have made everything alright, does anyone really think he would have done anything much different to what OneSport have done?

Britiain has not backed the European Championships since day one. So you're wrong.

 

It's nothing to do with Poland.

[Humphrey Appleby 13,974]

Much of the sponsorship money for international speedway comes from Poland, or at least before Fogo and Nice pulled out, it did. Many of the competing riders are Polish and other East Europeans, Why on earth should the Poles NOT benefit from their investment in the new competition? Why should the Poles be happy that BSI (Bellamy's Speedway Investment) demand millions of Zloties from the cities of Gorzow, Torun and Bydgoszcz, in return for the SGP being run there? Why should Polish (amongst others) TV companies pay royalties to a British company to show the racing that's happening in their own back yard? Why should Polish riders, if Emil Sayfutdinov is to be believed, be treated like cattle by Bellamy & Co and be made to travel to far off places like New Zealand for little net benefit? And who can blame Emil Sayfutdinov for choosing a competition that has a round in his own country when BSI don't?

You need to view matters in a non-nationalistic way. Firstly, whilst BSI might nominally be a British company it's ultimately owned by an American corporation (IMG). Regardless of whether you consider them a British or US company though, they appear to put no money back into speedway so it's somewhat irrelevant where they're actually from.

 

There are indeed questions to be asked about why BSI has such a long-term deal with the FIM, how much they charge cities to host GPs, and no doubt many other things. Those are questions though, that should be raised by the Polish promoters with the FIM - who incidentally also include the PZM who were presumably party to the original agreement.

 

Do you really think OneSport is some of benevolent organisation that will donate its profits to Polish speedway though? Without addressing the underlying issues of the way international competition is set-up, then you're just going to end replacing tweedle-dum with tweedle-dee, possibly after you've alienated a few sponsors along the way.

[waiheke1 4,295]

Surely the msin point is that bsi pay 1.5m quid a year to the fim to have rights to run the world champs and swc.

If one sport want to run a rival/parralel competition/s ( euro champs and world psirs) surely they should be paying fim an almost equivalent amount.

Possibly you could argue a smaller fee as there are less meetings, but then others seem to think bsi make too much money and have therefore been undercharged?

 

And then people would stop the ridiculous claims that this is an anti polish thing, and instead ask the important question, what do fim do with the money.

[A ORLOV 8,628]

Surely the msin point is that bsi pay 1.5m quid a year to the fim to have rights to run the world champs and swc.

If one sport want to run a rival/parralel competition/s ( euro champs and world psirs) surely they should be paying fim an almost equivalent amount.

Possibly you could argue a smaller fee as there are less meetings, but then others seem to think bsi make too much money and have therefore been undercharged?

 

And then people would stop the ridiculous claims that this is an anti polish thing, and instead ask the important question, what do fim do with the money.

Part of this point was commented on earlier. Why should one sport pay anything to the FIM, who it appears do not to put any of the fees charged back into the sport. Another organisation could run a World Championship, pay the riders more, the federations more and still make money.

 

BSI and the FIM have got themselves into this situation with One Sport who may now decide to set up a rival World Championship and other competitions. If they share the money around in a more acceptable way the riders and National Federations might prefer this.

 

The above is not ideal but if it happens BSI and the FIM have only got themselves to blame.

Edited February 17, 2014 by A ORLOV

[PolskiZuzel 329]

If one sport want to run a rival/parralel competition/s ( euro champs and world psirs) surely they should be paying fim an almost equivalent amount.

 

 

The truth is that they do pay licence fees to FIM. The problem is that it is FIM-Europe, not FIM, and the latter doesn't like it :-)

 

It's nothing to do with Poland.

 

If its nothing to do with Poland, then what it is do with, or with whom?

Poland had to kick up rough one day!

 

You're Trees.

[PolskiZuzel 329]

There are indeed questions to be asked about why BSI has such a long-term deal with the FIM, how much they charge cities to host GPs,

 

How much do they charge cities to host GP's ? It is widely known fact that BSI are asking much more from Polish cities than from any others.

 

Gorzow city council already last year wanted to renegotiate unfavourable (in their opinion ) contract with the BSI . Torun does not want to pay for their contract extension even half of what is expected by the BSI . The British/American Company wants 5 years contract extension for astronomical sum of £2’500’000 which is a half of a million GB Pounds for a year The Tourn City Council is prepared to pay £200’000 and for no more than three years.

 

Polish speedway club are no longer so eager to stage SGP rounds. For many reasons. One of them is that their City Councils have lost interested in this form of promotion. Bydgoszcz speedway for this year license is paying around £220’000 GBP, with their own money. Another reason is that profits from such an event are falling drastically . Bydgoszcz in 2010, when Tomasz Gollob was crowned on his home track as the world champion, earned short of a half a million GBP. It was a record . Earlier gains hovered at less than half of that . Wroclaw on each event earned an average around 200’000 GBP. Last year, Bydgoszcz earned only around 80’000 GBP and Gorzow a hundred K.

 

Now when there is an alternative in the form of Speedway European Championship and Speedway Best Pairs, Poland will think twice whether to stage SGP as well as SEC. SEC organizers’ asking fee for a licence is around £120’000. This is in theory , because in practice, none of last year's assignees have paid that much. In any case, Torun is wondering whether to replace SGP with the SEC, and this means that come 2015, Poland will stage only one SGP round, at Gorzow .

Edited February 17, 2014 by PolskiZuzel

[waiheke1 4,295]

Part of this point was commented on earlier. Why should one sport pay anything to the FIM, who it appears do not to put any of the fees charged back into the sport. Another organisation could run a World Championship, pay the riders more, the federations more and still make money.

 

BSI and the FIM have got themselves into this situation with One Sport who may now decide to set up a rival World Championship and other competitions. If they share the money around in a more acceptable way the riders and National Federations might prefer this.

 

The above is not ideal but if it happens BSI and the FIM have only got themselves to blame.

In what way have bsi got themselves into this? They have a contract with fim, what other business can you nsme would say "I think we are making too much profit, and the company we pay our license fee to doesnt seem to be shsring it sround equitably, so lets just pay out some extra money?

The only way I can see an argument thst bsi is perhsps to blame is by asking too high a fee to host events, as pz alludes to.

However, surely the answer is for cities to say"no thanks not at thst price." Yet Bsi dont seem to be lacking in venues willing to pay to host events though, albeit the large losses in nz making it unlikely to continue here beyond 2014.

[Humphrey Appleby 13,974]

They have a contract with fim, what other business can you nsme would say "I think we are making too much profit, and the company we pay our license fee to doesnt seem to be shsring it sround equitably, so lets just pay out some extra money?

It's not BSI's fault, but the manner in which things have been set-up by the FIM. They're not in fact making a huge profit anyway, although if you combine that with what's paid to the FIM, then it's a reasonable sum.

[The Pedaler 149]

Is there an internet forum like BSF in Poland? I'd love to see what they have to say on the matter. I'm sure that there will be plenty of people willing to do 15 x 5-minute rounds (of debate of course) with Mr Appleby!

[Humphrey Appleby 13,974]

It is widely known fact that BSI are asking much more from Polish cities than from any others.

Then more fool them to agreeing to pay it. They should have done their sums and worked what was a reasonable fee, or even based it on a percentage of the profits.

[A ORLOV 8,628]

In what way have bsi got themselves into this? They have a contract with fim, what other business can you nsme would say "I think we are making too much profit, and the company we pay our license fee to doesnt seem to be shsring it sround equitably, so lets just pay out some extra money?

The only way I can see an argument thst bsi is perhsps to blame is by asking too high a fee to host events, as pz alludes to.

However, surely the answer is for cities to say"no thanks not at thst price." Yet Bsi dont seem to be lacking in venues willing to pay to host events though, albeit the large losses in nz making it unlikely to continue here beyond 2014.

The BSI are responsible for agreeing the amounts paid to the FIM, which it then passes on to the venues. If an alternative organisation runs its own World Championship the amounts asked from the venues could reduce, amounts paid to riders increased and to get the federations on side, make a payment to them as well. If you keep all parties happy they are more likely to support and stay with you.

 

As Polski Zuzel has posted certain venues in Poland are refusing to pay what BSI wants. Others may be willing to pay what is asked but if an alternative cheaper option is available they may switch.

 

BSI has become too greedy and any organisation that is more efficient than one charging too much and provide an almost identical product will win out in the end.

 

£1.5 million is paid to the FIM, money that if shared around a bit could encourage riders, federations and venues to go with a new organisation.

 

Even the F1 midget had to reduce his charges for tv showing F1 GP in a couple of Countries because they refused to pay what he was asking.

Edited February 17, 2014 by A ORLOV

[PolskiZuzel 329]

BSI has become too greedy and any organisation that is more efficient than one charging too much and provide an almost identical product will win out in the end.

 

 

And that is exactly what is happening.

 

I go along with Humphrey who said : "They ( Polish rounds organizers) should have done their sums and worked what was a reasonable fee, or even based it on a percentage of the profits". I think they learned that the hard way and are no longer as foolish as before.

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[iris123 21,070]

Also the case that BSI were asking far too much money and conditions from Togliatti.As we saw last year and for years before with 'open' meetings,there is no problem getting riders in and out of Togliatti.Jeez,even Ice Speedway can do it.So some of the stuff we have heard about why there has been no SGP in Russia is just propaganda.

 

We have heard from Mr Rising that there is a queue of tracks in Poland wanting to host an SGP.This has surely in the past caused themselves problems as BSI can raise the price if a few tracks are competing against each other.Think it is fairly obvious that they were not asking the same price and conditions of Italy for instance as they were for Poland