Peter Collins In The Star

[bellevueace 917]

Anyway we all have our own opinions but the one thing we have in common is we love the sport warts and all, lets hope the new season can be the turning point. Happy New Year.

[Ray Stadia 1,071]

It is a pity that when Speedway had it's heyday and when Football and Speedway were the popular sports, the 2 sports didn't work together and use the same stadium. I know a few did, have and still do, but most joined up with Greyhound tracks, which I can understand why, due to the shape of the stadium, but Speedway jumped into bed with, perhaps, the wrong bedfellow. All too late now though.

[Guest]

It is a pity that when Speedway had it's heyday and when Football and Speedway were the popular sports, the 2 sports didn't work together and use the same stadium. I know a few did, have and still do, but most joined up with Greyhound tracks, which I can understand why, due to the shape of the stadium, but Speedway jumped into bed with, perhaps, the wrong bedfellow. All too late now though.

 

In speedway's early days didn't greyhound stadiums encourage speedway into its venues. Basically you will find the mindset of football is against sharing with speedway mainly because of the fear of damage to the playing area because of not only bikes running off track on to the football pitch but because of the amount of centre green activity needed for speedway.

And also because of the need in many cases to lift the pitch corners for speedway then have to relay it for the beautiful game?

Edited December 29, 2013 by Guest

[Ray Stadia 1,071]

 

In speedway's early days didn't greyhound stadiums encourage speedway into its venues. Basically you will find the mindset of football is against sharing with speedway mainly because of the fear of damage to the playing area because of not only bikes running off track on to the football pitch but because of the amount of centre green activity needed for speedway.

And also because of the need in many cases to lift the pitch corners for speedway then have to relay it for the beautiful game?

I understand why they wouldn't want Speedway now, but may have had a different view all those years ago, when both had good crowds. Agree it has no chance now.

[Humphrey Appleby 13,983]

HA is either on a wind up or there really is nobody in. Someone with over 9000 posts on a speedway forum cannot be that badly informed, unless the other 9000 posts where bullshyte as well?

No-one is questioning PC's record (or greatness) as a rider, but I ask again, what promotional or administrative success does he have that raises his views of how the sport should be run above those of anyone else? Would you equally think Wayne Rooney is qualified to run the Premier League because he's good at scoring goals in it?

It is a pity that when Speedway had it's heyday and when Football and Speedway were the popular sports, the 2 sports didn't work together and use the same stadium. I know a few did, have and still do, but most joined up with Greyhound tracks, which I can understand why, due to the shape of the stadium, but Speedway jumped into bed with, perhaps, the wrong bedfellow.

British football stadiums were/are generally not conducive to speedway. Football stadiums tended to evolve in an ad-hoc way, crammed into whatever space was available in towns, which did not lend itself to spacious oval layouts which are in any case poor for viewing field based sports. To get a track around a football pitch generally means it's going to be in the order of 400 metres which isn't ideal for racing or viewing.

 

I suspect football didn't really need speedway anyway.

[iris123 21,094]

Thats a fair comment as regards to stadia, but lets take Cardiff for example, a huge modern facility in the middle of a major city staging the biggest world speedway event of the season and it barely sells half its capacity, so even if this type of stadia was present in major cities the public interest in the sport is not there.

For sure it is clear to see that speedway has simply lost it's position of importance in society for a number of reasons.Stadia being one.But imo it was back in the heyday of speedway that the seeds were sown.At that time pretty well no promoter of the sport went out and bought or built a stadium.They were happy to rent from another sport.You take a fairly small football club like Dulwich Hamlet who couldn't have attracted anything near the attendances of the local speedway clubs.But they had a stadium that was decent for the time and when it became delapidated they had something to bargain with,sell off and get a modern,smaller stadium built.If speedway promoters had have had the forethought to do the same i think the sport could be in a better situation now.Ok,a fair number might have just sold the stadium and kept the money......basically as a tenant you don't get the best conditions.Pick of which day you run,all the takings from food and drink etc.If they had have had the forethought back when crowds were on a par with football things might look a little bit better now

It was also about the time of the 60,000 crowds that Sweden started their own speedway league and it was really the head in the sand approach from Britain in the decades that followed that(not only the threat from Sweden,but the FIM and then Poland and the other emerging countries) has produced another big headache for the sport now

[george.m 3,063]

in reality the tv coverage has not encouraged any increase at the turnstiles, changing racing formulas that worked so sky could always have a last heat decider has been detrimental as we now see with the ludicrous T/R and joker. Hopefully the sport can somehow grow again and become more than the minority interest it is yoday.

 

You say TV coverage has not had an effect on crowds. If we are to take that point seriously could you show us :

 

1. Where you got the figures from to deduce this? I never knew speedway attendances were published.

2. Where we can see what the forecasted crowd figures without TV are so we can compare these with the actual ones?

 

How else can we tell if TV coverage has had an effect?

 

 

Not referring to you in these points below bellevueace.

 

I cannot understand how some on here think about the general interest in speedway.

You are clearly missing the point.

People viewing speedway is not measured by crowd figures alone.

It is an aggregate of TV audience and crowds.

So in the "good old days", the viewing figure was the aggregate of all the crowd figures in week/month/season.

 

Nowadays we need to add the TV audience to this figure.

Because that is how many people are watching/interested in speedway is measured.

I'm fairly confident, today's total figure is much higher than the "good old days".

 

I'd even go as far as saying the general level of interest in speedway is higher nowadays than in the past.

Shock horror!

How could it not be with all the TV coverage we are now lucky to have?

 

It seems to me the "good old days" are just a mental state of mind of forum members of a certain vintage!

 

Well I have news for those who think the past was better.

 

You've had your "golden years".

For many of us this is our "golden years" .... our "good old days".

And I for one love every minute of going to speedway, smelling it, hearing it.

I love every minute of being able to watch it on two TV channels, sometimes as much as two meetings a week.

So if you don't like it fine.

 

But move over and let the rest of us who have a more positive outlook on life get to the trackside and see the action without you blocking the view and making more noise than four 500cc GM engines!

Edited December 29, 2013 by george.m

[Guest]

 

It seems to me the "good old days" are just a mental state of mind of forum members of a certain vintage!

 

Well I have news for those who think the past was better.

 

You've had your "golden years".

For many of us this is our "golden years" .... our "gold old days".

And I for one love every minute of going to speedway, smelling it, hearing it.

I love every minute of being able to watch it on two TV channels, sometimes as much as two meetings a week.

So if you don't like it fine.

 

 

I wonder how they miscounted the 70,000 crowds at Wembley and West Ham or the 20,000 crowds that went to New Cross and Wimbledon in the immediate post-war seasons from 1946 onwards?

It's amazing to think this never happened but are just figments of older fans who also stood by the sport when it nearly died in the late 1950s were merely part of 'golden years' imagination. I also used to think that Tommy Price was the first English rider to be world champion in 1949. Now I learn it is all a dream.

Oh dear! How the memory can play tricks as one gets older and to learn there were no 'gold old days.'

[george.m 3,063]

 

I wonder how they miscounted the 70,000 crowds at Wembley and West Ham or the 20,000 crowds that went to New Cross and Wimbledon in the immediate post-war seasons from 1946 onwards?

It's amazing to think this never happened but are just figments of older fans who also stood by the sport when it nearly died in the late 1950s were merely part of 'golden years' imagination. I also used to think that Tommy Price was the first English rider to be world champion in 1949. Now I learn it is all a dream.

Oh dear! How the memory can play tricks as one gets older and to learn there were no 'gold old days.'

That has absolutely no relevance whatsoever to the points I'm making and you know that fine well!

I'm talking aggregate total "viewing" numbers across the UK.

And, in reference to the original point made by bellevueace, in recent times!

Not individual meetings, not in the 1940s!

 

If you want to continually be negative, pore scorn, and don't have facility of a "Dislike" button as you requested from the mods, at least keep up with the play and stay on topic. Or would that be out of character and too much to ask?

 

Not your memory that's playing tricks!

 

As I said, this is our Golden Years.

Some of us weren't even born then so how could we have been there!

Bully for you!

Let us enjoy our speedway for what it is rather than put everything down!

Edited December 29, 2013 by george.m

[Guest]

 

 

If you want to continually be negative, pore scorn, and don't have facility of a "Dislike" button as you requested from the mods, at least keep up with the play and stay on topic. Or would that be out of character and too much to ask?

 

 

You are a little behind with happenings. I withdrew that "Don't Like' request several days ago. Here's the Link to update yourself:

http://www.speedway-forum.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=75457

I have a negative attitude - not if you read ALL my Posts on the BSF. But then, to cry 'negative' is a trait of some Posters who use that ploy on the BSF when they meet a contradictory opinion to their own.

Debate is about providing when needed an alternative view to a subject. Did you know that? There is often two sides to everything - hopefully in the end reaching a compromise.

Didn't a famous politician once say something akin to: "I don't agree with what he says but will defend to the end his right to say it"?

Edited December 29, 2013 by Guest

[george.m 3,063]

You are a little behind with happenings. I withdrew that "Don't Like' request several days ago. Here's the Link to update yourself:

http://www.speedway-forum.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=75457

I have a negative attitude - not if you read ALL my Posts on the BSF. But then, to cry 'negative' is a trait of some Posters who use that ploy on the BSF when they meet a contradictory opinion to their own.

Debate is about providing when needed an alternative view to a subject. Did you know that? There is often two sides to everything - hopefully in the end reaching a compromise.

Didn't a famous politician once say something akin to: "I don't agree with what he says but will defend to the end his right to say it"?

i'm not behind, I knew you withdrew it.

The point is you made it in the first place!

But let's stay on topic shall we and not get into long winded personal discussions, there's enough of that on BSF already, let's leave that to Norris123.

[Humphrey Appleby 13,983]

Then despite a noticeable drop in attendance figures he continued to co-promote, risking more of his own money until the transition was established before handing it to his friends.

 

Like I said, I originally asked what his involvement at Belle Vue was, but people preferred to respond with silly comments. My recollection was he was part of a consortium at Belle Vue, but fine if he was actively promoting rather than being a figurehead then it gives more weight to his opinions.

 

This said, he ultimately didn't stay promoting, and wider sport still continued its decline after 1988 even though there was still a KOC and no 'playoffs' for many years afterwards.

Edited December 29, 2013 by Humphrey Appleby

[pandorum 1,259]

If someone of the stature of PC says these things then only an idiot would disregard what he says.

 

Because if Peter Collins stops going to speedway, it would make no difference what so ever. However, if I stopped going to speedway, a club would be making £17 less every week.

That is indeed a fair point.

[george.m 3,063]

If someone of the stature of PC says these things then only an idiot would disregard what he says.

That is indeed a fair point.

Time to pack up and go then, 13 pages wasted.

Last person to leave put the lights out please.

[SCB 15]

If someone of the stature of PC says these things then only an idiot would disregard what he says.

What stature? What sport has he made more popular? What's his record?