Testing Riders

[THE DEAN MACHINE 4,748]

3 minutes ago, Tsunami said:

Any rider can be tested if there are strong reasons to believe he would be dangerous in a racing situation. What would be the point  of just testing random riders and finding them drug free, when others could strongly suggest another rider would definitely fail the test.

That's probably why most of the guilty have got away with it over the years 

[Tsunami 10,219]

7 hours ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:

That's probably why most of the guilty have got away with it over the years 

NO not true. One Aussie in the 90s at Brough was obviously under the influence, and the club withdrew him when he "sprained his back" getting the tools out of the van. it would be ludicrous if he wasn't picked and rode whilst 2 others were tested and clean. Now that would be when he would have got away with it.

Edited August 10, 2022 by Tsunami

[THE DEAN MACHINE 4,748]

32 minutes ago, Tsunami said:

NO not true. One Aussie in the 90s at Brough was obviously under the influence, and the club withdrew him when he sprained his back getting the tools out of the van. it would be ludicrous if he wasn't picked and rode whilst 2 others were tested and clean. Now that would be when he Ould have got away with it.

This is what I was told at the weekend by someone in the FIM  a rider was suspected of taking drugs and the testing people were alerted and they were told you can’t target a rider on a tip off (well not officially anyway ) it has to be random or appear to be 

Edited August 10, 2022 by THE DEAN MACHINE

[TotallyHonestJohn 3,078]

1 hour ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:

This is what I was told at the weekend by someone in the FIM  a rider was suspected of taking drugs and the testing people were alerted and they were told you can’t target a rider on a tip off (well not officially anyway ) it has to be random or appear to be 

Wokeism... athletics and swimming meetings are random and drawn by lots... the three rugby matches I was involved in were exactly the same and it was done via a blind raffle with three players drawn to be tested from each team... it was a random raffle draw on a selective few or they had to test everyone taking part which was unfeasible... its done blind so the tester can't be accused of picking on somebody or the sporting federation can be accused of a witchhunt in what is a very litigious society these days...

Im only guessing but I suspect Speedway is no different... the anti doping rules are fairly standard...

Regards 

THJ

[Racin Jason 72 1,283]

Considering the maximum amount of riders contesting a league fixture is 14 why not test them all.  Fairest way to do it. 

[Humphrey Appleby 13,958]

5 minutes ago, Racin Jason 72 said:

Considering the maximum amount of riders contesting a league fixture is 14 why not test them all.  Fairest way to do it. 

Probably down to the cost. 

[Debbi 111]

I don’t care what drugs were in his body, high dosage prescription/illegal/or as first suspected alcohol) what troubles me most about this whole saga is that Ben knew  what he had taken before arriving at the stadium and he should know if it is or not against the rules. Knowing this he still intended to ride and would have if the test hadn’t been carried out, it is the complete lack of respect for safety, not only for the other riders, but the medics, track staff everybody in the pits as well as the crowd. Just recently there have been a few crashes  where the bike has gone over the fence, that is what I find indefensible. It’s not okay to then say it was medical prescription and the gp can back this up - it still doesn’t make it right and anybody that knew he was doing this is equally guilty.

Edited August 10, 2022 by Debbi

[HGould 2,213]

47 minutes ago, Debbi said:

I don’t care what drugs were in his body, high dosage prescription/illegal/or as first suspected alcohol) what troubles me most about this whole saga is that Ben knew  what he had taken before arriving at the stadium and he should know if it is or not against the rules. Knowing this he still intended to ride and would have if the test hadn’t been carried out, it is the complete lack of respect for safety, not only for the other riders, but the medics, track staff everybody in the pits as well as the crowd. Just recently there have been a few crashes  where the bike has gone over the fence, that is what I find indefensible. It’s not okay to then say it was medical prescription and the gp can back this up - it still doesn’t make it right and anybody that knew he was doing this is equally guilty.

How times change. 

45 years ago Peter Collins made a valiant attempt to retain a world title with a huge hole in his shin. 

38 years ago, at Cowley no less Kenny Carter won a British WC semi final with 2 broken legs

No doubt both full of morphine and painkillers. 

You make an accusation about alcohol that is completely unfounded but again 40 years ago Kelly Moran would famously or infamously (take your pick) arrive at matches so drunk that they'd throw him in a cold shower for half an hour to sober him up. 

Over the decades and now speedway riders take large amounts of painkillers, some take illegal substances, depending on their popularity often a blind eye is turned. 

Some rude with well documented mental health issues that require medication that they have been brave and honest to open up about. 

Who hasn't driven with excess alcohol or painkillers in their system. Is a speedway track any more or less dangerous than the M25? 

Barker will be dealt with according to the severity of what he is proven to have done. 

Until then may be people shouldn't be holier than thou. 

Then go and look up "snus" widely used in British Speedway. Illegal in most EU countries. 

Edited August 10, 2022 by HGould
Snus

[Debbi 111]

52 minutes ago, HGould said:

How times change. 

45 years ago Peter Collins made a valiant attempt to retain a world title with a huge hole in his shin. 

38 years ago, at Cowley no less Kenny Carter won a British WC semi final with 2 broken legs

No doubt both full of morphine and painkillers. 

You make an accusation about alcohol that is completely unfounded but again 40 years ago Kelly Moran would famously or infamously (take your pick) arrive at matches so drunk that they'd throw him in a cold shower for half an hour to sober him up. 

Over the decades and now speedway riders take large amounts of painkillers, some take illegal substances, depending on their popularity often a blind eye is turned. 

Some rude with well documented mental health issues that require medication that they have been brave and honest to open up about. 

Who hasn't driven with excess alcohol or painkillers in their system. Is a speedway track any more or less dangerous than the M25? 

Barker will be dealt with according to the severity of what he is proven to have done. 

Until then may be people shouldn't be holier than thou. 

Then go and look up "snus" widely used in British Speedway. Illegal in most EU countries. 

If you read my post it says I don’t care what was in his system be it one of the three mentioned or all of them. At the stadium it was rumoured to be alcohol at first then drugs. The point is that he had officially failed a test (non-negative), if the ref had felt he was safe he wouldn’t have withdrawn him. I am not being judgemental I am simply stating that as we do not know what effect this would have had on him, he was risking not only his safety.

Times have changed health and safety (sometimes bunkers) of everyone at a track is at risk

As for the comment on the M25 if you want to ride a bike on the M25 at 70mph without brakes good luck. Times change, 45 years ago the bikes reacted differently, engine was an up right, machines go faster. I have seen to many serious crashes over the years (Ales  Drmyl’s being one of the worst). At the end of the day he has failed trackside and lab samples.

The fact that he intended to race is what annoys me.

 

[Diamondboy 677]

5 hours ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:

This is what I was told at the weekend by someone in the FIM  a rider was suspected of taking drugs and the testing people were alerted and they were told you can’t target a rider on a tip off (well not officially anyway ) it has to be random or appear to be 

Don’t think that is correct at all, tip offs will be looked at. Under the influence of drugs/drink, will not be ignored, lives are at risk. Organisations would be sued if they ignored tip offs and the sh!te hit the fan.

[Fortythirtyeight 841]

6 hours ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said:

This is what I was told at the weekend by someone in the FIM  a rider was suspected of taking drugs and the testing people were alerted and they were told you can’t target a rider on a tip off (well not officially anyway ) it has to be random or appear to be 

“ appear to be “ is the correct phrase.

It clearly isn’t as a suspected user was ‘randomly selected ‘ in all his teams 5 checks in one season and when the testers were asked how the ‘ random selecting’ was done no response was given, even when asked to test all 14 riders present to make it ‘ fair ‘ but the request was turned down.

The individual passed every test.

[Fortythirtyeight 841]

3 hours ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

Probably down to the cost. 

It costs pennies for a kit, the cost is the one/ two individuals doing the tests.

[THE DEAN MACHINE 4,748]

2 hours ago, HGould said:

. Then go and look up "snus" widely used in British Speedway. Illegal in most EU countries. 

Oh Don’t get me started on that filthy habit, it’s disgusting

[THE DEAN MACHINE 4,748]

1 hour ago, Diamondboy said:

Don’t think that is correct at all, tip offs will be looked at. Under the influence of drugs/drink, will not be ignored, lives are at risk. Organisations would be sued if they ignored tip offs and the sh!te hit the fan.

Riders actually clearly affected by drugs at a meeting is a rarity, but taking drugs socially between meetings is not 

[Tsunami 10,219]

59 minutes ago, Fortythirtyeight said:

“ appear to be “ is the correct phrase.

It clearly isn’t as a suspected user was ‘randomly selected ‘ in all his teams 5 checks in one season and when the testers were asked how the ‘ random selecting’ was done no response was given, even when asked to test all 14 riders present to make it ‘ fair ‘ but the request was turned down.

The individual passed every test.

Likewise for checking engines. A ride with a suspected 'big' engine tends to be tested more by careful selection. I think it still gets out and the rider puts another engine in that conforms. A well known rider at the top of his game reputed to be riding a big engine. Sure enough he was selected, but he just smirked his way throughout the examination. I suggest his club tipped him off. Our rider that was chosen was Dickie Juul. He knew why the other rider was suspected but as he claimed, why should it cost me £400 to put my engine back together when I only get £50 as the rules dictated. I must admit for the first time I agreed with him.