Which Brit Should Get A Wild Card?

[MARK246 243]

What utter nonsense!!

 

Harris has had his chance - for a number of years. Sure, he's 100% more deserving than Nicholls but if we have just one place (though I'd guess we will have two...) it HAS to be Woffinden.

 

And I'm sorry, but look at the facts of yesterday's meeting and you CANNOT simply glibly state that Hougaard and Pavlic "performed better in the U21"..!!

 

I've done what you sugested and checked with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individual_Sp...ld_Championship

and it states 2009 1st Ward 2nd Pavlic 3rd Hougaard

[Parsloes 1928 nearly 495]

No it doesn't.Where was he in the GP Challenge Final. Did he qualify, no.

 

Tai will get his chance but 2010 is 1 year to soon. Think about it, he's dealing with a hell of a lot privately isn't he & there is far more to come. I take my hat off to the lad & his Mother how they're dealing with that. The lad will need to deal with & get over that won't he, going into the GP this year will be a mistake, if he fails we may just see his head drop & yet another British superstar is lost to us, do we want to see that? NO. Give the lad another season, that's all i'm saying.

 

Right, well of course I accept that there is an argument there... Might be best perhaps for the authorities to ask the family what they think's best but on any other criteria he really SHOULD be in there in 2010.

 

On the subject of the GP Challenge. great store is being made by posters about those who did or didn't qualify to or from this meeting. I tend to agree, in truth; so why not make all EIGHT places up for grabs the top eight from that meeting!! This is the logical progression of what people are saying and it WOULD make for one hell of a lot more competitive edge to both the qualifiers and the GPs. No safety blanket for those finishing 9th. and 10th. in the GPs; and restoring to us a proper competitive and meritocratic route to contest for the world title...

[Parsloes 1928 nearly 495]

I've done what you sugested and checked with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individual_Sp...ld_Championship

and it states 2009 1st Ward 2nd Pavlic 3rd Hougaard

 

Hmm, so you also think that Joe Haines who won five out of five rides in the GB Under 18s last week was "out performed" by the three riders who finished on the rostrum ahead of him and who the record books will show as the first three..?!

[ladyluck 1]

I'm all for giving Woffinden another season, but not Harris. He's never qualified for the GPs and I doubt he ever will.

[Phil Silvers 59]

Woffinden had a tapes exclusion but that apart was untroubled all meeting. Fair do's to the other three in the U21's but surely Tai should be given a chance? Purely on his ability shown in the EL and Poland this year?

 

If, by not finishing in the top 3 in the U21 jeapordises his chance in the GP's then surely Nicki P by not finishing in the top 8 doesn't warrant a place either??

Edited October 4, 2009 by Phil Silvers

[pandorum 1,259]

On the subject of the GP Challenge. great store is being made by posters about those who did or didn't qualify to or from this meeting. I tend to agree, in truth; so why not make all EIGHT places up for grabs the top eight from that meeting!! This is the logical progression of what people are saying and it WOULD make for one hell of a lot more competitive edge to both the qualifiers and the GPs. No safety blanket for those finishing 9th. and 10th. in the GPs; and restoring to us a proper competitive and meritocratic route to contest for the world title...

How would THAT make the GP more competitive though?

The qualifiers throw up riders who in no way reflect any form of competitive additions to the series.

A rider gets a few tracks he knows and can qualify simply because he has local track knowledge.

Does not mean he is competitive.

And what has merit got to do with it. And yes I did use that very word in my previous post.

Merit depends on who you talk to. We all have our own faves so would argue the merit of having them in the GP.

If I was running the GPs I would allow the top 8 to qualify and do away with qualifiers completely and pick the other 8 based on what would best suit the series in terms of sponsors, TV, geographics and crowd expectations. Let's face it if Emil had performed crap in the GP he would still get a 2010 pick because they want to eventually stage a Russian round so want to engage a Russian audience. They would also like a decent Yank in there to step in when Greg retires as they also want a US round. But sadly there are none at the moment but don't imagine when a half decent one turns up that he will get in on merit.

The level of naivity on display here is mind boggling.

 

The idea that the GP series should be left to a series of silly qualifiers so to allow riders who would bring nothing to it the chance to qualify is silly in the extreme.

It's a business designed to sell a product. By your method a top draw name could have a bad couple of meetings and miss out whilst a complete twonk could get through because he happened to ride regularly at the track. Or NOT in the case of Chris Harris.

The GP challenge is simply a sop designed to placate fans who cannot or refuse to see the bigger picture.

Do you honestly believe the organisers want guys like Walasek, Ulamek and Zetterstrom in the GP?

Edited October 4, 2009 by pandorum

[iris123 21,133]

The level of naivity on display here is mind boggling.

Welcome to the BSF.

 

Good to have you on board.For the most part your well thought out posts will be ignored and people will keep on banging on with the same old crap.......you'll either end up with half the forum on ignore or you'll go insane Best get out while you can......

[sjm-racing 0]

Me & my step father have been saying it for a long time, Tai Woffinden is the best chance of britain lifting the GP title no doubt about it. The only worry i have is that when his father passes it might mentally effect him & loose the concentration needed in the GP series. Kennett i dont think will do anything apart from be in the mix the competion is to strong & i think he will be another Lee Richardson.

As long as Tai keeps his emotions in order & i personally feel he will because he will want that world title for all the sacrific his father has made to get Tai where he is. I would have Woffy in as wildcard to get him used to riding as a GP rider because its only a matter of time before he gets in.

 

Si.

[Parsloes 1928 nearly 495]

How would THAT make the GP more competitive though?

The qualifiers throw up riders who in no way reflect any form of competitive additions to the series.

A rider gets a few tracks he knows and can qualify simply because he has local track knowledge.

Does not mean he is competitive.

And what has merit got to do with it. And yes I did use that very word in my previous post.

Merit depends on who you talk to. We all have our own faves so would argue the merit of having them in the GP.

If I was running the GPs I would allow the top 8 to qualify and do away with qualifiers completely and pick the other 8 based on what would best suit the series in terms of sponsors, TV, geographics and crowd expectations. Let's face it if Emil had performed crap in the GP he would still get a 2010 pick because they want to eventually stage a Russian round so want to engage a Russian audience. They would also like a decent Yank in there to step in when Greg retires as they also want a US round. But sadly there are none at the moment but don't imagine when a half decent one turns up that he will get in on merit.

The level of naivity on display here is mind boggling.

 

The idea that the GP series should be left to a series of silly qualifiers so to allow riders who would bring nothing to it the chance to qualify is silly in the extreme.

It's a business designed to sell a product. By your method a top draw name could have a bad couple of meetings and miss out whilst a complete twonk could get through because he happened to ride regularly at the track. Or NOT in the case of Chris Harris.

The GP challenge is simply a sop designed to placate fans who cannot or refuse to see the bigger picture.

Do you honestly believe the organisers want guys like Walasek, Ulamek and Zetterstrom in the GP?

 

But the GP Challenge currently only throws up such qualifiers BECAUSE the top guys don't bother with it - safe in the knowledge that they'll be 'picked' anyhow or if they finish 9th. or 10th. in the Series it doesn't really matter coz they'll be given another chance..!

Make it cut-throat like sport is MEANT to be and they'll be no dodgy qualifiers from the Challenge and no easy rides in the GP either.

You have sensible views but you insult others by accusing us of being totally naive...: we DO know what we are talking about..

The GP is a hopelessly flawed concept and the most flawed thing about it is that people are 'picked' for it and there's an enormous 'comfort zone' once one is in it.. This makes for meaningless racing in the series and a below standard qualification process to get into it..!

And "when Greg retires"...!! Are you 'aving a laugh!!!

Edited October 4, 2009 by Parsloes 1928 nearly

[HenryW 1,178]

But the GP Challenge currently only throws up such qualifiers BECAUSE the top guys don't bother with it - safe in the knowledge that they'll be 'picked' anyhow or if they finish 9th. or 10th. in the Series it doesn't really matter coz they'll be given another chance..!

I'm not convinced the top guys would be taking part in the qualifiers even if there weren't selections.

Of the riders currently outside the top 8 in the GP series, Lindgren, Holta, Walasek, Harris and Ulamek opted to take part in the qualifying rounds. Kenneth Bjerre, who is inside the top 8 at the moment, also chose to take part. The only rider who is currently guaranteed not to get a top 8 place who didn't race in the qualifiers was Scott Nicholls!

Obviously I am just guessing, but without any selection process I would have been surprised if any more than 2 or 3 extra riders took part this year...Hans Andersen, Scott Nicholls and Emil Saifutdinov would be my guess at the ones that would also have tried them.

 

The qualifiers basically had the best riders outside the GP series plus virtually the entire lower order of the current standings, and Zorro still got through....

 

The GP is a hopelessly flawed concept and the most flawed thing about it is that people are 'picked' for it and there's an enormous 'comfort zone' once one is in it...

As I have said before, find me any other top line world motorsport series that has ANY qualifiers? All entrants are selected...

 

Personally, I think the single biggest problem with the SGP just now (other than the track surfaces ) is that it is restricted to a 15 man permanent field. That is far too limiting. Things were much more interesting when there were 22 permanent members in the series. That offered much more scope for the young hopefuls to get in and mix it.

I'm not sure that the format used back then was ideal, but the larger field was certainly preferable.

 

[Humphrey Appleby 14,000]

It's a business designed to sell a product.

 

Remind me what it's selling again?

 

[Humphrey Appleby 14,000]

As I have said before, find me any other top line world motorsport series that has ANY qualifiers? All entrants are selected...

 

Well generally they're team based, and it's the teams who choose who they want to represent them, not the international federation or the rights holders. At one time though, the likes of F1 did have qualifiers whereby almost anyone could turn up and try to get into a race, but expense and safety concerns eventually put paid to that notion (although not so long ago).

 

This said, speedway does not have the same traditions as other motor sports, and the World Championship was historically based on the principle of every rider having a chance of winning it at the start of the season. Okay, I know in practice that didn't happen, but there were probably 300 or so riders who started out on the qualification trail each year.

 

I'm not sure that the format used back then was ideal, but the larger field was certainly preferable.

 

But obviously too expensive...

 

[HenryW 1,178]

But obviously too expensive...

Yep...Pretty sad that they dropped it for the sake of a few thousand pounds.

Maybe I am an exception, but I thought the product was much more attractive and marketable with a larger field.

 

[spook 28]

great post Pandorum but the thing that bothers me here is that people are getting carried away............. we have seen Emil saunter into the GP pits and rip everything up.... so therefore anyone can right? ... wrong of course ............ the level of support behind Emil in his maiden season is frightening.... from the carefully arranged team around him to the level of equipment (HOW fast are those bikes?!) ....... to the obscene obscene amount of cash behind him (just who is in his pits again and needs paying throughout the season?)

 

Chris Holder should have been in this year's series based on him being an exciting talent but IMO he did the most sensible thing and in effect 'saved up'.......... maybe if enough people were queueing up last season to back him and make promises he would have been in this year but even then it wouldnt have guaranteed him the year he would have wanted

 

I agree with the majority of posters that we should be looking towards Tai being in the GP series but do we want him to be successful in it? and for a number of years? I am not doubting Tai's will, confidence, or talent but that alone will not ensure that his first GP season will go well enough for him to stay in it............. with the GP field looking the strongest it ever has been... statistically there is a chance that he could become a whipping boy and there is absolutely no point in that..... over the years we have seen some riders confidences destroyed on the world stage and Tai is the kind of talent that needs protecting until the right time

 

so we know what IMG would prefer but i'm not sure they would be holding the riders' best career interests at heart..............IF GB are to have two permanent WC's then does it really make sense for Tai to have one this year? Or would it make sense that Rico is rewarded for a good season and takes a turn instead?

Edited October 4, 2009 by spook

[spook 28]

Yep...Pretty sad that they dropped it for the sake of a few thousand pounds.

Maybe I am an exception, but I thought the product was much more attractive and marketable with a larger field.

 

no I liked that format as well.... even if it was painful to watch Jason Lyons, Bo Brhel and later on Loramski get sucked into their vicious circle of fortnightly financial losses, low confidence and pants machinery

 

there is also something to say about the format we have now though and the fact that all riders get 5 opportunities a meeting as it was frustrating to watch someone eliminated after only two rides