albyhere 51 Posted December 3, 2013 I recently had a chat with an old friend who is sports mad, like me. We got around to speedway as is my way, and although he has been to meetings, he isn't a supporter as such. When we got round to who rides for who ( whom ? ) etc he laughed out loud when I tried to explain the way riders can ride for two different teams, in two different leagues, at the same time. To compound the matter even further, when I said riders can also ride for different teams in DIFFERENT countries....at the same time, he nearly fell out his seat. I heard later he had passed the information around and got the same response from everyone. " You must be joking. " You know what, when you look at it like that, he has a point. It IS farcical. What other sport in the world allows that to happen? Imagine footballers say, one plays for Man. Utd. AND plays for Reading Town AND plays for Galatasary. And he's not alone, not by a long chalk. It looks utterly preposterous. It's little wonder we don't get the credo we actually richly deserve. To those of us who are supporters, we see nothing wrong with that, but to outsiders, we must look like the provincial aunt Sallies who are just playing at being " a sport " in the accepted sense. We have little credibility. What to do about it ? Not a lot I fear. Being the dangerous sport it is there's not a lot of riders to go round, hence the current setup, but my goodness, it does look plain daft. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Elephantman 196 Posted December 3, 2013 Understand your point but it only looks daft when there is a competitive pyramid within the sport. So in football for example Teams from different leagues can compete against each other in Cup competitions, European competitions and through promotion and relegation. None of this really applies to speedway allowing the self employed rider to earn his crust wherever he is wanted. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John Leslie 3,213 Posted December 3, 2013 (edited) A friend asked if I knew a plumber who could look at his boiler. I said "Why don't you try Bob from down the road, he always does any plumbing I need". He said "Isn't that a bit silly? After all he's your plumber. Wouldn't it appear ludicrous if he's working for you and then doing another job for me in a different street" I said "No. Working for me on a Monday shouldn't stop him doing an entirely unrelated job for you on Tuesday. He's just a self employed contractor and they're his own tools" He said "Yes. you're right" He said "I'm glad we've had this conversation" I said "Ah, but have we really had this conversation? Or is it in your mind?" He said "What do you mean?" I said "Well, I've heard that sometimes that people make up pretend conversations, just to post on the internet to try to make a point that doesn't really have any substance" Edited December 3, 2013 by John Leslie 13 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SCB 15 Posted December 3, 2013 My mate explained Tennis to me the other day. the guy who wins the most points can lose the set and the guy who wins the most sets can lose the game and the guy who wins the most games can lose the match. Madness I tell you, madness! I saw a football match the other day but a goal was disallowed because the player had the nouse the stay ahead of all of theres. Madness. All sports have their weird quirks. The trick is NOT to go into them with a newbie. I swear speedway fans love telling their mates about TRs, guests and rider riding in more than one country. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Humphrey Appleby 13,974 Posted December 3, 2013 You know what, when you look at it like that, he has a point. It IS farcical. What other sport in the world allows that to happen? Imagine footballers say, one plays for Man. Utd. AND plays for Reading Town AND plays for Galatasary. And he's not alone, not by a long chalk. It looks utterly preposterous. It's little wonder we don't get the credo we actually richly deserve. Why is it farcical? Not everything is like football, and playing for different teams is not entirely without precedent in other sports, or even within football for that matter. Cricketers can play for several teams during the same year - county cricket, provincial/state cricket, IPL, grade cricket, before you even take national sides into account. I believe table tennis players also go around playing for multiple teams in different national leagues at the same time, and happens in motor racing as well (also less than it used to). Even in football there are examples of players competing in summer and winter leagues for different teams, albeit not at the same time, but you can certainly find players in the lower echelons of non-league football who'll play for Saturday and Sunday teams. Riding in multiple competitions is a practical necessity in speedway to make a living, and until the sport can pay sufficiently for a rider to commit to a single competition, then the situation is not going to change. Even before foreign leagues came along, riders took guest and open bookings or disappeared off to the longtrack/grasstrack scene to supplement their earnings. Until speedway really wants to run a serious Champions League-type competition, then I don't really see the problem. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
topaz325 1,862 Posted December 3, 2013 Jockeys are one of the nearest equivalents of Speedway riders.... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jonny the spud 2,281 Posted December 3, 2013 Maybe if punters could pay the £60+ a ticket that football charges, clubs could then pay riders enough so that they don't need to ride all over the place ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Halifaxtiger 5,318 Posted December 3, 2013 Imagine a rule in speedway where a rider can only go on certain parts of the track at certain times and that is dependant on the position of the opposing riders. I am sure we can all start laughing now - but football has it, its called offside. That's not to be critical, but to make the point that any comparison between the rules of different sports are flawed from the start. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Humphrey Appleby 13,974 Posted December 3, 2013 I saw a football match the other day but a goal was disallowed because the player had the nouse the stay ahead of all of theres. 'Away goals count double' claim the commentators, erm... except they don't. Can't score a goal (even own goals) from some types of free kicks, but you can from others. What a daft sport.. the guy who wins the most sets can lose the game Erm... I'm not sure that's true... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Humphrey Appleby 13,974 Posted December 3, 2013 Imagine a rule in speedway where a rider can only go on certain parts of the track at certain times and that is dependant on the position of the opposing riders. At least two bikes have to be between you and finish line to not be offside in speedway, and you can only pass backwards... 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SCB 15 Posted December 3, 2013 Erm... I'm not sure that's true... Damn, the guy who wins the most sets can lose the match. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John Leslie 3,213 Posted December 3, 2013 Damn, the guy who wins the most sets can lose the match.Still wrong! Think you're trying to say that the guy who wins most points can still lose a set, and the guy who wins most games can still lose the match. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MrMungo 708 Posted December 3, 2013 My mate explained Tennis to me the other day. the guy who wins the most points can lose the set and the guy who wins the most sets can lose the game and the guy who wins the most games can lose the match. Madness I tell you, madness!Did he tell you why it goes from 15-30-40? That has always bugged me far more than it should! 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray Stadia 1,071 Posted December 3, 2013 I do think the original thread poster has a bit of a point. I think we are at the stage in Speedway where the sport is trying to hang on to being a team sport, but pressure is there for it to be individual only. Until the sport is able to field, virtually, the same team of riders week in, week out and season in, season out, the grumbling will continue. It is getting worse and looking through my rose tinted glasses, didn't happen to the same degree, in the not too distant past. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skthecat 90 Posted December 3, 2013 Why is it farcical? Not everything is like football, and playing for different teams is not entirely without precedent in other sports, or even within football for that matter. Cricketers can play for several teams during the same year - county cricket, provincial/state cricket, IPL, grade cricket, before you even take national sides into account. I believe table tennis players also go around playing for multiple teams in different national leagues at the same time, and happens in motor racing as well (also less than it used to). Even in football there are examples of players competing in summer and winter leagues for different teams, albeit not at the same time, but you can certainly find players in the lower echelons of non-league football who'll play for Saturday and Sunday teams. Riding in multiple competitions is a practical necessity in speedway to make a living, and until the sport can pay sufficiently for a rider to commit to a single competition, then the situation is not going to change. Even before foreign leagues came along, riders took guest and open bookings or disappeared off to the longtrack/grasstrack scene to supplement their earnings. Until speedway really wants to run a serious Champions League-type competition, then I don't really see the problem. Do you think that riders with multiple team in the UK has in someway assisted in the downfall of our sport? What I mean is when clubs are looking to fill team places, rather than pick a kid, they go for the quick fix option of a rider from another club wanting to double up/down? Therefore closing one of the doors that younger riders or the less experienced riders would have/could have used to get onto the club/league ladder....?? 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
