StevePark 2,783 Posted February 25, 2014 (edited) Josh Bailey and to be fair Danny Phillips unless he is classed as having ridden a season for Scunthorpe. RTD does have some experience but guesting not declared although that was questionable. I suppose it depends on what you are classing as experienced. All the best with your project and hopefully more will follow. It's to be hoped that PL take the bull by the horns to as I think that is where the problem has lay in the past PL or scrap heap and it is notoriously difficult to get a PL spot without the pressures put on reserves by underperforming foreign 2nd strings but the tide is changing. I would take it a step further and allow a certain number of foreign riders in the NL give the Brits a fair playing field could show a few of the overseas riders in a truer reflection :-) No!!! There are too many in the PL and EL as it is! Edited February 25, 2014 by The Abbott 7 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Swift Saint 186 Posted February 25, 2014 Josh Bailey and to be fair Danny Phillips unless he is classed as having ridden a season for Scunthorpe. RTD does have some experience but guesting not declared although that was questionable. I suppose it depends on what you are classing as experienced. All the best with your project and hopefully more will follow. It's to be hoped that PL take the bull by the horns to as I think that is where the problem has lay in the past PL or scrap heap and it is notoriously difficult to get a PL spot without the pressures put on reserves by underperforming foreign 2nd strings but the tide is changing. I would take it a step further and allow a certain number of foreign riders in the NL give the Brits a fair playing field could show a few of the overseas riders in a truer reflection :-) What a dreadful idea and they will ride for £10 per point? The places in the League have to be for British riders after all it is the National Development League not the International Development League. For too long we have encouraged very average foreign riders the tide is turning and it must not turn back. Whilst I am sure the Elite League introduced the measure of national League reserves to help with costs, British riders benefit with experience and working with top riders close by to guide them. It is a major step forward. It would never be agreed to allow the National League to go back to any overseas riders. Lets not forget we had Aussies and Kiwis once. Nothing against them but those 63 places are to develop our lads and help Brits returning to the sport. It is imperative that they be retained for that purpose. Malcolm Vasey 12 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scunny Stag 72 Posted February 25, 2014 (edited) Josh Bailey and to be fair Danny Phillips unless he is classed as having ridden a season for Scunthorpe. RTD does have some experience but guesting not declared although that was questionable. I suppose it depends on what you are classing as experienced. All the best with your project and hopefully more will follow. It's to be hoped that PL take the bull by the horns to as I think that is where the problem has lay in the past PL or scrap heap and it is notoriously difficult to get a PL spot without the pressures put on reserves by mediocre foreign 2nd strings but the tide is changing. You are right I forgot to include Josh Bailey but Danny had a full season with Scunthorpe in 2012. Of course the league should definitely allow second and third year riders to continue their development. Josh Bailey and to be fair Danny Phillips unless he is classed as having ridden a season for Scunthorpe. RTD does have some experience but guesting not declared although that was questionable. I suppose it depends on what you are classing as experienced. All the best with your project and hopefully more will follow. It's to be hoped that PL take the bull by the horns to as I think that is where the problem has lay in the past PL or scrap heap and it is notoriously difficult to get a PL spot without the pressures put on reserves by underperforming foreign 2nd strings but the tide is changing. I would take it a step further and allow a certain number of foreign riders in the NL give the Brits a fair playing field could show a few of the overseas riders in a truer reflection :-) I like your idea of the PL doing something more for British riders but dislike the idea of introducing foreign riders into the NL What a dreadful idea and they will ride for £10 per point? The places in the League have to be for British riders after all it is the National Development League not the International Development League. For too long we have encouraged very average foreign riders the tide is turning and it must not turn back. Whilst I am sure the Elite League introduced the measure of national League reserves to help with costs, British riders benefit with experience and working with top riders close by to guide them. It is a major step forward. It would never be agreed to allow the National League to go back to any overseas riders. Lets not forget we had Aussies and Kiwis once. Nothing against them but those 63 places are to develop our lads and help Brits returning to the sport. It is imperative that they be retained for that purpose. Malcolm Vasey Well said Malcolm and if the league reduces the points limit so that more spaces are filled by prospects then the resulting cost reduction and increased chance of a club actually finding someone of value then more clubs might enter the league. It is a simple pyramid. The more we attract new talent at the bottom the more Craig Cooks, Worrall brothers and Matt Williamson's the league will find. Is it coincidence that lower budget clubs like Buxton, Kings Lynn and Scunthorpe have found more talent than others over recent years? Edited February 25, 2014 by Scunny Stag 6 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TMW 533 Posted February 25, 2014 (edited) I agree with you both in principle. I'm just saying what I would do I'm not saying it should be done. I don't want to name riders as I don't think it's fair but there were some reserves given places last season at reserve in the PL over young British riders who may not have been had they been given a year in the NL. In other words ifMohammed won't come to the mountain but the tide is turning hopefully. If riders aren't going up from the top there is always going to be a section squeezed out.....If I'm honest I'm not the best in expressing myself in the written form so I don't blame you for missing my point Edited February 25, 2014 by TMW Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hector Austin 51 Posted February 25, 2014 I agree with you both in principle. I'm just saying what I would do I'm not saying it should be done. I don't want to name riders as I don't think it's fair but there were some reserves given places last season at reserve in the PL over young British riders who may not have been had they been given a year in the NL. In other words ifMohammed won't come to the mountain but the tide is turning hopefully. If riders aren't going up from the top there is always going to be a section squeezed out.....If I'm honest I'm not the best in expressing myself in the written form so I don't blame you for missing my point I prefer Proud and Stags view point man, you are backtracking and going round in da circles man , NL ain't fer overseas riders end of Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TMW 533 Posted February 25, 2014 I prefer Proud and Stags view point man, you are backtracking and going round in da circles man , NL ain't fer overseas riders end of No not backtracking at all ever heard of the word ........analogy? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mossy666 54 Posted February 28, 2014 (edited) No one has mentioned Steve Jones joining the Stags 2014 as our No1 on a 5.33 averageGood luck Steve.This is going to be a very interesting year,what do u all think. Edited February 28, 2014 by mossy666 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EC Rides Again 143 Posted February 28, 2014 No one has mentioned Steve Jones joining the Stags 2014 as our No1 on a 5.33 averageGood luck Steve.This is going to be a very interesting year,what do u all think.Although I must admit that he wasn't first on my list of experienced riders to lead the new team, Steve was very good in that ill-fated one-off appearance for the Saints a couple of years ago. Will he be riding in the Amateur meeting tomorrow? I'm hoping to get down to the EWR after lunch and see the lads go through their paces. It seems like there are team places up for grabs and the meeting is a final "Boot Camp" to see who will go to the "Live Shows" ! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Halifaxtiger 5,318 Posted March 1, 2014 Josh Bailey and to be fair Danny Phillips unless he is classed as having ridden a season for Scunthorpe. RTD does have some experience but guesting not declared although that was questionable. I suppose it depends on what you are classing as experienced. All the best with your project and hopefully more will follow. It's to be hoped that PL take the bull by the horns to as I think that is where the problem has lay in the past PL or scrap heap and it is notoriously difficult to get a PL spot without the pressures put on reserves by underperforming foreign 2nd strings but the tide is changing. I would take it a step further and allow a certain number of foreign riders in the NL give the Brits a fair playing field could show a few of the overseas riders in a truer reflection :-) I agree, as long as it is no more than one per club. Although the NL is a development league, for at least half of the teams its a business too and its one that has to be viable (or at least with sustainable losses). The introduction of one foreigner can act as a draw card for paying spectators, and I need only to point to Cameron Heeps for that. I know people who went to speedway meeting just to see him ride - a brilliant 15 year old whose reputation was certainly proven by the performances he gave. Putting the foreign riders on a 7.00 average will mean that they don't take the places of British youngsters, more those riders who have been in the NL for years and have made no progress whatsoever (because, lets face it, the league is full of them). As an example (and no offence intended) a young Australian like Brady Kurtz could replace David Mason in the Kent line up. That in no way affects the development of young British riders and will almost certainly lead to more spectators going to meetings. Win win, I'd say. No!!! There are too many in the PL and EL as it is! The NL has been foreigner free for about 3 seasons now (and mostly foreigner free for years before that); its made absolutely no difference to the numbers of foreign riders in the EL & PL. There's absolutely nothing to suggest that having a British only policy in the third tier has encouraged the two more senior leagues to bring British youngsters into their teams. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Islander15 1,065 Posted March 1, 2014 I agree, as long as it is no more than one per club. Although the NL is a development league, for at least half of the teams its a business too and its one that has to be viable (or at least with sustainable losses). The introduction of one foreigner can act as a draw card for paying spectators, and I need only to point to Cameron Heeps for that. I know people who went to speedway meeting just to see him ride - a brilliant 15 year old whose reputation was certainly proven by the performances he gave. Putting the foreign riders on a 7.00 average will mean that they don't take the places of British youngsters, more those riders who have been in the NL for years and have made no progress whatsoever (because, lets face it, the league is full of them). As an example (and no offence intended) a young Australian like Brady Kurtz could replace David Mason in the Kent line up. That in no way affects the development of young British riders and will almost certainly lead to more spectators going to meetings. Win win, I'd say. The NL has been foreigner free for about 3 seasons now (and mostly foreigner free for years before that); its made absolutely no difference to the numbers of foreign riders in the EL & PL. There's absolutely nothing to suggest that having a British only policy in the third tier has encouraged the two more senior leagues to bring British youngsters into their teams. I know you only used it as an example HT but I think Kent missed the experience of Mason when he left and I don't think it was coincidental that they improved massively when he returned. From their point of view how does Kurtz improve the other riders? He may pass on experience etc but even if he ends with a 12.00 average I very much doubt that he will be able to give as much information to Freemantle, Blake and Chessell etc that Mason would. Good luck to Jones. I hope the score he posted in the illegitimate Scunthorpe meeting will be more like his scoring this season as opposed to what he posted for the Islanders. But having said that, he experience will be massively beneficial which is what the management want Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Halifaxtiger 5,318 Posted March 1, 2014 I know you only used it as an example HT but I think Kent missed the experience of Mason when he left and I don't think it was coincidental that they improved massively when he returned. From their point of view how does Kurtz improve the other riders? He may pass on experience etc but even if he ends with a 12.00 average I very much doubt that he will be able to give as much information to Freemantle, Blake and Chessell etc that Mason would. Good luck to Jones. I hope the score he posted in the illegitimate Scunthorpe meeting will be more like his scoring this season as opposed to what he posted for the Islanders. But having said that, he experience will be massively beneficial which is what the management want I am a big supporter of having an experienced rider in the team - it was a bad day when Dean Felton quit. But do you need Mason for that purpose when you have Lambert, Compton (both of whom have been around for 10 years or so) and a team manager who used to be a rider himself ? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rockets 61 Posted March 3, 2014 One foreigner per NL. When Rye signed Jens Rasmussen ( one of my favourite riders by the way) it was said that we would only have one or two foreign riders in the PL - now look! Actually what we should do is artificially inflate british kids prospects by giving them a start rookie average of say one point in the PL providing at least four other team members are british. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Islander15 1,065 Posted March 6, 2014 Arron Mogridge makes it 4! Leaving it a bit late for the last 3 to prepare aren't they? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fozzie4388 679 Posted March 6, 2014 Arron Mogridge makes it 4! Leaving it a bit late for the last 3 to prepare aren't they? Are they? As long as they are lined-up for the first meeting whats it matter? I remember in the Hull days one year they left it till the P&P Day to announce their final rider. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Islander15 1,065 Posted March 6, 2014 Are they? As long as they are lined-up for the first meeting whats it matter? I remember in the Hull days one year they left it till the P&P Day to announce their final rider. But that rider would have known he was in the team. The press release suggests they haven't decided who the final 3 are yet so the riders themselves won't know, and in terms of the added costs involved in league racing compared to just practices and second halves I'd have thought the riders would want to know that they have a team place for longer than a couple of weeks before the start of the season. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
