Warsaw Gp Saturday 18th April

[The White Knight 9,039]

 

 

Your inability to see some matters from another's perspective is unfortunate.

And does not seem confined to this topic.

I think I can see things from other people's perspective. I can also stand my corner in a discussion, as can Bewitcher and others - I can hold an opinion though even if you don't like it.

 

Numbers speak.

 

Speedway racing takes place all over the country every week.

 

40,000 don't turn up to it though.

 

Your argument is nonsensical as we are discussing attending a speedway meeting and what draws fans to a SPEEDWAY meeting. If there isn't a meeting, its not relevant and not part of the discussion.

I meant that the Speedway Weekend would be exactly that without Speedway - irrelevant.

 

Therefore the most important thing regarding the Weekend is the Speedway.

 

Surely, you have proved my point for me.

[waiheke1 4,295]

How about you tell me?

 

EDIT: Oops - I can answer the first question.

 

Less than the number that used to go to Wembley years ago. I hope that helps.

Wembley. Another of those temporary tracks you hate. You must have been delighted when world finals moved to a permanent track at odsal.

[The White Knight 9,039]

Wembley. Another of those temporary tracks you hate. You must have been delighted when world finals moved to a permanent track at odsal.

Sigh......................

 

I mentioned Wembley in response to being questioned about Numbers - not Tracks. :rolleyes:

IF there was no speedway racing it wouldn't be a speedway weekend would it?

Which also proves my point - Thank you for that Phil.

Edited May 8, 2015 by The White Knight

[PHILIPRISING 7,298]

Sigh......................

 

I mentioned Wembley in response to being questioned about Numbers - not Tracks. :rolleyes:

Which also proves my point - Thank you for that Phil.

NO it doesn't... what many of us are trying to point out that because of the venue and the whole package the British GP draws a far bigger crowd (more than double the last World Final held in the UK) than it would at any regular speedway track you care to mention.

[BWitcher 12,453]

I think I can see things from other people's perspective. I can also stand my corner in a discussion, as can Bewitcher and others - I can hold an opinion though even if you don't like it.

I meant that the Speedway Weekend would be exactly that without Speedway - irrelevant.

 

Therefore the most important thing regarding the Weekend is the Speedway.

 

Surely, you have proved my point for me.

 

You have no point WK and the more you try to argue it, the more foolish you look.

 

For there to be a comparison they both have to be speedway events. That is the constant between the two.

 

Now, you claimed the standard of racing, note that, the standard of racing was most important. You also tell us that temporary tracks don't provide good racing.

 

So tell us, by your OWN argument, how is it that the temporary track attracts the highest attendance if the 'standard of racing' is the MOST important thing.

[Grand Central 2,654]

I would agree with that, however, it is inconceivable to me that someone should go to Cardiff for the GP and not consider the Racing to be the MAIN part of the weekend BC. Everything else, to me, is on the periphery.

 

I just can't get my head around that.

Your inability to see some matters from another's perspective is unfortunate.

And does not seem confined to this topic.

I think I can see things from other people's perspective. I can also stand my corner in a discussion, as can Bewitcher and others - I can hold an opinion though even if you don't like it.

 

.

Oh for goodness sake.

At least keep up with your own argument, even if you cannot follow others.

 

It was YOU that first said you couldn't understand people who had a differing view than yourself.

I was just sympathising with your - self confessed - inabilities.

Edited May 8, 2015 by Grand Central

[The White Knight 9,039]

I am obviously not explaining my self very well. I had probably better give up on this.

 

I know what I meant anyway.

[BWitcher 12,453]

 

 

The Racing is the reason people attend - nothing else.

 

It's quite clear what he meant. He underlined it and put it in italics.

 

He is wrong.

 

The 'racing' is on offer at every single speedway meeting there is.. so clearly that isn't the reason why more people attend one event over another.

 

He used the argument in an attempt to justify moving away from temporary tracks.. ignoring the fact that the attendances for meetings held at temporary tracks quite clearly show that the 'track' isn't the primary concern of the paying public.

 

It's really not even a debate.

 

Next we'll get that old myth that 'great racing' is what brings the crowds in... followed by how 'great' the racing in the PL is... oblivious to the fact that there isn't something quite right there....

[E I Addio 15,845]

The ship that reportedly transported the shale from King's Lynn to Gdansk does not appear to have docked at either port in the 2 or 3 weeks preceding the GP. One therefore wonders whether it was delivered earlier and sat somewhere, which of course would then not explain why there appears to be have been a delay in starting work on the track. Maybe something went wrong with the storage, and some local shale had to be found in a hurry?Even if the shale was shipped just before the GP, I can't see that transporting it a damp maritime environment is ideal.

I find the shale story very difficult to believe. Admittedly there is a big difference between ELracing and GPs but EL clubs struggle with even the cost of transport so are we to belive that they can barely afford to hire the stadium for a week to get a decent track laid but can afford all these shipping costs every GP in addition to a complete track load of shale (as opposed to the EL simply toping up, and then they chuck the whole lot away afterwards? I find that very difficult to believe.

[Trees 2,814]

Important detail you'll never get to know!! I'm sure Phil knows the answer though!

[Humphrey Appleby 13,960]

Admittedly there is a big difference between ELracing and GPs but EL clubs struggle with even the cost of transport so are we to belive that they can barely afford to hire the stadium for a week to get a decent track laid but can afford all these shipping costs every GP in addition to a complete track load of shale (as opposed to the EL simply toping up, and then they chuck the whole lot away afterwards? I find that very difficult to believe.

Isn't the official story that the same shale does several temporary circuits during the season? I suppose being the first GP of the season, it could have been brought straight from Britain, but you do have to question how cost effective that can be. Surely Poland must have suitable sources of shale as well?

 

However, even if the shale is re-used, bits of the story as reported don't add up, and not for the first time either.

[PHILIPRISING 7,298]

Important detail you'll never get to know!! I'm sure Phil knows the answer though!

NOT quite sure what detail you are referring to. The material used at Warsaw was indeed sourced in the UK, the same as is used at Cardiff, Copenhagen and Stockholm, and transported from Kings Lynn to Gdansk. The cost is around £250,000. the material is stored for future use.

 

Humphrey has made reference to the ship used to transport the material to Poland as the ghost ship because there is no reference of it docking in Gdansk. I'm not sure that the name of the ship was ever officially revealed but I will enquire as to when whatever ship was used arrived in Gdansk.

 

The material last used in Copenhagen has been in storage and will be used in Horsens.

 

The material used in Cardiff last year was new and has been in storage in a facility nearby where it is being regularly monitored for its moisture content. Some moisture is, of course, vital. If the material was bone dry (which would be relatively easy to achieve) it would not bind. When you walk on temporary tracks they have a very tacky feel and are a little springy, like a trampoline which provides the grip that speedway bikes require.

Edited May 9, 2015 by PHILIPRISING

[Humphrey Appleby 13,960]

NO it doesn't... what many of us are trying to point out that because of the venue and the whole package the British GP draws a far bigger crowd (more than double the last World Final held in the UK) than it would at any regular speedway track you care to mention.

That's being slightly disingenuous because other than Wembley, Bradford was probably the largest capacity stadium that could stage speedway at the time. It could only hold less 25,000 though, but it must have been near to capacity for the 1990 World Final.

 

I think few would disagree that 'big' city venues are more attractive for the casual spectator (even if Bradford is actually a much bigger city than Cardiff), but there's still only so many times you can let people down, as with Gothenburg which died a slow death after the 2003 fiasco. In fact, screwing-up at these venues does far more damage than if it happened out in a field in front of a few thousand diehards.

Edited May 9, 2015 by Humphrey Appleby

[PHILIPRISING 7,298]

Isn't the official story that the same shale does several temporary circuits during the season? I suppose being the first GP of the season, it could have been brought straight from Britain, but you do have to question how cost effective that can be. Surely Poland must have suitable sources of shale as well?

 

However, even if the shale is re-used, bits of the story as reported don't add up, and not for the first time either.

NO, each venue has its own supply. The material is a blend which Olsen has specified after a lot of work with some labs in Denmark. At one stage, before the first GP in New Zealand, BSI were even contemplating shipping the material from the UK to Auckland. But after several trips to NZ and trials with various local mixes he came across a blend that worked.

 

Which bits of the story don't add up?

[Humphrey Appleby 13,960]

Humphrey has made reference to the ship used to transport the material to Poland as the ghost ship because there is no reference of it docking in Gdansk. I'm not sure that the name of the ship was ever officially revealed but I will enquire as to when whatever ship was used arrived in Gdansk.

Well the Polish media apparently named it as the 'Celtic Warrior', which was reported earlier in this thread.

At one stage, before the first GP in New Zealand, BSI were even contemplating shipping the material from the UK to Auckland. But after several trips to NZ and trials with various local mixes he came across a blend that worked.

I suspect an alternative version of the story is that Bill Buckley balked at being asked to cough up £250K (presumably excluding the costs to ship it halfway around the world), when there were perfectly good sources of shale in New Zealand.