mikebv

Excellent post... Speedway closing its eyes, putting its fingers in its ears, and screaming "la, la, I can't hear you!" has delivered the position the Sport is in today.. Promoters should forget bringing in new fans for the time being and just try and entice back those who used to go... As someone who runs a business, a website like this would have been 'manna from heaven' for me. Unsolicited, FREE, feedback as to your performance. My Company pays hundreds of thousands for such comments... For the ten years I have been coming on here, day after day, week after week, the current shambles has been predicted by literally thousands of comments by long time followers of the Sport getting more and more disillusioned by what they were seeing.. Did promoters listen? Of course not.. Instead their answer was to increase prices by inflation busting amounts year on year to cover for those who had decided enough was enough, just to pay riders far in excess of what the Sport brings in to try and win Competitions rendered meaningless due to the way they structure and operate them... Result? Even less people now attend. .. Richard Branson must look on enviously at that business plan...!

It's also match planning that keeps top riders out of British Speedway... Last night both KO Cup Semis were scheduled knowing both Lindgren and Doyle would be missing.. Possibly THE two best riders in the world.. So much for them being the drawcard some Promoters seem to think they are to 'save the sport' when some of their colleagues deliberately plan meetings without them?! Cannot be that big an influence on crowd levels then can they?

For me, just get any random 14 riders at each meeting... (Invite say 20 just in case some have to be elsewhere due to unforseen circumstances).. Two Captains get nominated by the Ref (usually the best two riders).... All the other riders line up against a wall... Both Captains turn round while the Ref gives out numbers to those against the wall. (This should be done randomly though, the Ref shouldn't just go Number One from the left, Number Two to the next rider etc as this would quickly be worked out by the Captains) The Captains then take it in turn to shout out numbers, six each team .. When their number gets called the riders stand behind their Captain... When all participants are chosen the Ref can review the level of equality. He, or she, walks in between the two lines of riders and exchanges riders from team to team as he, or she, sees fit, grabbing each rider they want to move by the arm and physically moving them over to the other side. He, or she, then returns to the front of the two line ups, takes a few paces back to review the teams closely one last time, and if satisfied relatively equal, he, or she, then announces the meeting can start... When the moaning has stopped from the Captains about losing some of their best mates to the opposition, the racing will begin.... What does everyone think? Idea inspired by Our Lady's Primary School, Stockport. Circa 1978... 😁

And also not surprising given the FIVE guests for what was supposedly a Semi Final of one of the Sports domestic trophies.. Starting from such a low base was always going to be a struggle to get a crowd...

And then dismantling all their fine work by devising and delivering astoundingly 'unfit for purpose' operating models and business plans...

What amazes me is why Somerset from a business perspective would choose to run this meeting?. One of the few GP riders in the country is guaranteed missing (which surely makes a mockery of some promoters belief that GP riders bring crowds in?) and his team will turn up with only two of their own riders.. Why would anyone go and watch this? Somerset fans will think "we have no chance after the first leg and it's only a Wolves Select" and Wolves fans will think "we are miles in front and it's not really my team so sod the M5 on a Friday".. At an absolute push I can only think that when home teams arrange these ever increasing number of fixtures where the away team is a Mickey Mouse Select team, it is because they think they increase their chances of victory... However, it's a victory in Competitions rendered farcical (therefore of no value) by their very own actions... Couldn't make it up could you..?

If it rains and the SEC is called off again could we have RR for Bjerre instead of a junior guest like Newcastle did for Lambert?

If Bjerre isn't there then British Speedway simply give up... I am sure he will be as surely he must.? Because if he isn't then BSPA you truly are irrelevant to the rest of the Speedway World and they hold you in nothing but complete contempt and ridicule... Notice the meeting wasn't arranged on a Polish play off date...

Didn't know that Saddam's spokesman from the last Gulf War has got involved with British Speedway..? Comical Ali wasnt it? "I tell you here and now, there are no coalition forces in Baghdad" was his line to the Worlds Press gathered about him. As 100 yards directly behind old 'Comical' rumbled 30 or so Coalition tanks heading directly towards him...😅 He could fit in nicely....😂

The saddest thing though Dean is its mostly self inflicted nonsense like this that renders the Sport such a basket case in Britain.. The basis of this whole Forum appears to be thread after thread of discussions around ludicrous self inflicted nonsense...... The current situation the Sport finds itself in has been predicted time after time after time on here over the years, as more and more nonsensical unfit for purpose decisions got made, yet none of the contributors of the BSF would claim to be Nostradamusesque I would imagine.. Everyone could just see it was heading down the pan because it was all so bleeding obvious it couldn't end up any other way... Yet amazingly, each AGM the Promoters, year on year, vote even more ludicrous self inflicted nonsense in to become their jointly owned operating model.... Best of luck to Workington (and other tracks who find themselves in the same situation) but let's be honest as the saying goes.. You couldnt make it up the way this Sport is ran could you..?

And the biggest talking point of many meetings on here is "who has best manipulated/ignored the rules?"..😁 Doesn't say too much about what's on offer on track does it?😕

The flip side is how much clubs lose leading up to the play offs... The Aces will get around 2300 I reckon for the Semi but have ran in front of 800 or so in the meetings leading up to cram in the required meetings.. Is that one gate of 2300 better than 4 of 5 meetings of reduced attendances due to fitting meetings in and not having much to race for as already qualified..? The 3000 plus final crowd is I would suggest the deal breaker rather than the semi... But obviously, only of any use if you get there... For me Paulco's idea from Ice Hockey re have a full season and then all in a quick cup Comp sounds the right mix... A 'Magic Weekend' for Speedway at the NSS.. Late August Bank Holiday Weekend.. Cut off date agreed to decide the draw based on League position, first play eighth, second versus seventh etc. etc. . Friday night double header starting at 7pm for the first two quaters finals. . Saturday night double header at 7pm for the other two quarters.. Sunday night double header starting at 5pm for the semis.. BHM 5pm start time for the Final... Sell a Weekend ticket for £80, £20 for kids, and an adult and kid gets to see seven meetings at not much over £15 a match.. Surely would sell 2500 adult tickets that way if properly marketed the 12 months prior..? If so, £200k without the kids income... Deals with hotels, sponsors and TV coverage sorted too to make the event "Big Time" School hols still then too.. Carry on with the league after the 'Magic Weekend' with no having to cram meetings in making the fixture list more consistent and Speedway running to October...

Must save quite a few quid on tyres this track as they don't seem to be in contact with the surface much do they?..😂 Great decision by the ref there too...😁😲😁

"You do have people that stay away when you're not winning and it is not helpful in the slightest".. This is a direct quote from the Workington Promoter lifted from this week's excellent Speedway Star... May I respectfully point out that the way the Sport is ran is definitely also not "helpful in the slightest" if Promoters want to get (and keep) crowds attending their tracks... Fans will actually put up with a losing team far longer if they can at least associate themselves with 'their' riders... However, following a losing team made up of 'guests', 'guests' and more 'guests' every week and/or seeing your team getting beat by teams turning up with track specialist 'guests' every week will test the resolve of even the most die hard follower... Any Promoter currently complaining about numbers coming through the turnstiles when they all have delivered collectively the shambles that currently exists won't, I would imagine, have much sympathy from the Sport's followers... No Chris Harris at Peterborough because he was taking part in a seperate Sport, and FIVE guests riding for 'One Man Cradley' are just today's examples of 'planned in complete nonsense' that Promoters still expect people to attend, and pay good money to them for the privilege of doing so.. When such ridiculous goings on are fully endorsed as part of the Sports Operating Model and allowed to happen, public appeals to the Speedway fan base to keep loyally watching must be a very hard sell...

He will face a 28 day ban and serve it in December....😂

The same Promoters who agree to the team strengths at the start of the season. Then their teams start getting beat heavily so crowds drop meaning they have to bring in different riders who knowing the crap the Promoters are in name their price as demand massively exceeds supply... Making the signing of a 'Top Rider' so vitally important to success via the use of averages means they will always have the upper hand in negotiations... When a rider can deliver between 12 and 15 nightly to your score when you need 46 to win they can pretty much name what they want... Almost 33% of a succesful teams score delivered by one man... Maybe making them less of a 'must have' will reduce salaries?

Always wondered why when a track is wet and the meeting goes ahead (just), why don't they have the riders just blasting round to turn the dirt over an hour or so before the meeting, (maybe even have locals on standby so no one gets an advantage).. 4 riders doing 40 laps would replicate ten heats.. Every time I see a meeting like this the racing improves as it slickens off and the thick dirt/mud/slime gets moved out.. It just happens too late to make the meeting entertaining..

I am sure you would know more than me JTS.. I am sure also though that there was a minimum sum published at the time as to what these lads could expect to earn.. Maybe my number is wrong but I do remember thinking when I saw the press release that the number published was considerably more than the £10 a point (allegedly) the same lads got in the NL.. ! I seem to think it was announced in part to answer back critics of the scheme who suggested it was nothing more than a money saving plan.. As I say mate.. You live 'the dream' so you will know more than me..

Four or five years ago a rider I know of guested for a then Elite League team at Number Seven.... He was an experienced second string in the PL.. His deal was a basic £600 and £100 a point for every point over four.. He scored four so just got his £600.. If thats a Number Seven deal then what were the rest on? Wouldn't have thought those numbers have come down any since then.. Didn't the fast track lads get an agreed £450 per match minimum? That's £1800 for both FTR's each team would need to find to pay for the home and away match.. Approx 120 fans worth of income after tax just to pay the reserves? In a crowd of at best at most tracks 1000 - 1200 or so. And the FTR was brought in to reduce coats so how much would two of the old foreign experienced 4-5 point men reserves cost?

You would have to rely on the integrity of the Promoter obviously.. Like any business that runs PRP... I am sure integrity won't be a problem as its Speedway..😁

Great post... Performance Related Pay.... Works very well!.. Many Promoters often bemoan.. "A losing team loses fans and winning at home is key to crowd levels".. Well pay your riders accordingly... A win bonus and a bonus for fan base... eg No1 wants say £200 a point then its agreed he gets it only if they win, his basic is £150 a point and he gets his bonus paid on victory.. eg2, A club I presume bases it's budget on expected income based on previous average crowd level info, therefore, if the average being used is 1000 fans then agree with the riders that if they get this figure to 1200 they then share 100 fans worth of attendance money. And every 100 further increase in attendance delivered the same deal.. It would maybe even bond the team together as a collective which must be hard at present to do with the riders riding for so many different teams..

Spot on... The Promoters surely realise that whoever wins meetings and Leagues under the current Mickey Mouse way the sport is ran that any 'victory' isn't worth having... And therefore why should fans attend such contrived nonsense... Instead of contriving each meeting with any random selection of riders they would be far better advised working together and 'contriving teams' of relative equal strengths, planning in a fixture list well in advance of other Leagues and giving riders a 'take it or leave it' ultimatum.. If they can get two Leagues of ten teams then a DU gets a minimum 72 meetings a season, if teams meet twice home and away.. If that's not enough for any rider then they need to stand aside and let the many behind them who do take their place..

£15 max for top division.. All kids in for free.. When my lad got in for free and it was £15 basically for the two of us I went pretty regular.. Now he is a 14 year old I have to pay for him. Approx £25 in total on average at most tracks we visit.. Add in the usual bit of nosebag, car park and programme at these things and fifty notes can swiftly depart the wallet.. I have to be honest expecting me to attend one of the many Mickey Mouse meetings and pay circa £50 notes every week is a non starter.. Weekly Speedway as has been mentioned with fixed nights would mean circa £200 out of a monthly salary.. For many fans, Speedway isn't their main entertainment fix and is often a 'nice to do' rather than something that you prioritise.. Letting the kids in for free would if nothing else mean more visits from the likes of me (if it has some credibility) and surely its better to have someone visiting say 15 times a year at £10 - £15 that someone attending about five times and paying £25..? Especially if you own your own track and take the bar, food and car park revenue.. And the place wouldn't look so deserted each week...

Then why are the largest crowds for most tracks the £10 BT nights..? If Woffy and Dudek had been there and the tracks charged £25 the crowd would have been almost non existent...

But surely affordable for most teams? Five man teams in the top division dividing up £10k a week for two home and away meetings between them... Six man teams in the second, with it basically being 'four and two juniors' dividing up £6k between them.. Run with fixed nights for both ten team Leagues, two home, two away per team, and a heat leader DU could earn a good few grand a week and race a minimum 72 matches, even in a team with no Cup or Play Off matches... One thing is for sure... Charging circa £17 - £20 entrance fee will NEVER work if you want to bring a crowd in regularly.. Speedway is a tiny, tiny minority Sport which needs to start to build a fan base again either by bringing back those who no longer go or attracting new fans... A maximum £15 price point I would say is the most it can ever reasonably request given its 'status'.. Paying out to less riders per meeting will help it to deliver that and deliver a surplus of talent to replace riders through the Season.. Riding circa 72 times on 'good' pay rates would encourage plenty of riders to take part too I would suggest. .