wandersome

But both reserves were paid 9. Gathercole was plain 8.

To unconfuse you Tina. Speedway is generally thought of as a sport whose entertainment element is riders taking different lines as they go around corners in order to pass each other or stop others passing. It involves a level of SKILL. Drag racing is a sport where people on very fast bikes (or cars) race down some stupidly long straight bit of road to see who gets down the other end quickest. I was making a point that I can't remember cookie doing a pass. If it did happen, I probably didn't notice because it happened down one of our runways and involved no level of skill. Finally I would have Roynon in any team I watch because of the entertainment value he brings and I'd be watching one of Englands brightest talents on a regular basis. That's just an opinion I have that has nothing to do with Leicester's form over the last week or so.

I'd say Roynon has got previous for coming back from injuries pretty well though, much harder injuries to return from to boot. I think it would be a real shame if he didn't end up back in our team for whatever reason and as much flak as i'll get for saying it, up until last week Karlsson has looked pretty average for nearly a year and a half and i'd much rather see the type of rider Roynon is to the type of rider Karlsson is. crowd was about 800-1000 again this week. similar to last week. My favourite option would be to alter one of the bends as the bikerfm guy says and then have Roynon, Bjerre, Doolan & Nieminen in the team providing the passing and entertainment like we all thought we were going to get this year before the season started (and we had a taster of in that Ipswich meeting).

I can't recall anything like that. Cook could have done a doughnut on each corner and would still have won his races by overtaking everyone down the straights.. did he outdrag Nieminen down runway 1? Maybe the excitement of the rest of the meeting has blurred my memory.

That's what i thought until i heard that about Karlsson missing. Anyone know why Karlsson is out of the Sheffield meet? Interesting watching Cook tonight. Made me wonder what we'd been missing with Roynon as he and Cook looked pretty similar in the PL and Roynon looked the better in th EL. And what they have in common is they noticably both seem to have the drive to get near the top. If it wasn't for the injury then i think he'd have been there with Cookie at the top of the PL averages.

it was gathercole who wasn't allowed. he was 4th in the averages and 4th in the scorers behind Cookie, Anderson and Kurtz. They could have put Kling in the top scorers race but not Gathercole!

In the post meeting interview (a great innovation btw that the promotion should be congratulated on) Glyn mentioned that Karlsson will be out on thursday. Does that mean Roynon is back? Mick.

Hopefully the biggest a*se kick was reserved for the guy who designed that abysml track they all had to try and overtake on though

Thought Andersen looked pretty good tonight though his fall whilst the easiest 2nd in heat 12 cost them dearly in the end. I remember seeing him having a torrid time for Birmingham a few years back but then seeing him in a NL meeting, at Weymouth i think, and he looked really promising. Looks like he might finally be getting there about 3 or 4 years late. The entertainment on track tonight was as bad as it gets. I think the crowd looked pretty disheartened by it all as well though i don't suppose the Lions having forgot their gating boots helped. Hemsley was stomping around the pits for most the night. Maybe if he altered the track it wouldn't need to worry so much as Nieminen might then have a chance of passing riders like Jake Andersen.

Anderson paid 9, Gathercole 8

From memory Lemon must be the worst heat leader ever at Bp though

Nightshift, hope you kept your 15 quid in your pocket tonight as 7 heats and a complete action by pass so far worst yet! Jinx! Popple's new rider nicknames may be the most interesting thing that's happened so far!! At least a cup of tea is on its way

What you say is a little sad. There are plenty of riders in the UK who i'm sure would welcome the opportunity to double up in a reserve position in the EL. Picking a couple of UK based riders randomly for my point i will take our own Kev Doolan or your own Christian Henry (i have no idea whatsoever whether they would want to double up though there are similar who would) . If they had the extra income from d/u in the EL and Ludvig Lindgren lost the extra income from riding both EL, PL and both swedish leagues then maybe they would be closer to competing on an equal footing. Equally, if you say it would be the PL missing the riders because Lindgren would still be riding EL then i'm sure riders are available, even if it ends up with you having to promote the likes of Lewis Kerr up to the PL. You never know they might turn out to be a revelation given the opportunity. Either way, it would actually be UK based riders who were benefitting from a rule set up to benefit UK based riders, hopefully making UK speedway stronger for it. I have to say, and don't be offended as it's only my viewpoint, but your answer looks more like promoters fitting decent riders you'd prefer in your team and then making arguments to fit those objectives.

I think a big win for Leicester by 25+ even with Craig Cook in the Plymouth team. Hopefully my predicting skill is better than it was yesterday. BTW was Karlsson a short term injury replacement for Roynon and if so does Roynon then have to return in his place when declared fit. I've never seen the rules about this but from what ive read on here previously it seems that short term injury replacements have dispensation to simply be able to to return to the team when fit irrespective of whether his average still fits within the limits but by the same token i would guess that if you have used this dispensation then you'd have to use him once declared fit. Or is the whole short term injury replacement thing an urban myth and a figment of my imagination! Not sure it would make any difference to Leicester with the decisions they make either way.

Can someone let me know what the exact point of the double up facility is? I was under the impression that is in place so English based riders or riders that base their career around riding in the UK have the ability to compete and make a living equivalent to riders who also have careers based elsewhere (such as Sweden, Denmark, Poland etc). I'm sure i've heard people in high places say this is the case also. That would appear to be born out by the ruling stating that priority should be absolute so as to put off riders who might see doubling up in the UK as another way of supplementing even further their foreign earnings at the expense of a whole bunch of riders who the rule was actually set out to help. That's not pedantic, it's surely being fair to the riders the rule was put in place to help out who currently appear to be missing out. If you are doubling up and then sign for a foreign league it needs to be in your foreign league contract that Britsh leagues take precedence at all times as that is what the rules in the UK state. If you can't do it, don't do it. Tsunami?, White Knight? The twitter comment says it all. Mick.

Well, there is still time! surely i'm more wronger with regards to Graversen, if wronger is a word. 4 rides, beaten no one. Is there a rider with more contrasting home and away form, I thought this was one of his favourite tracks. A modern day Kevin Price no less.. In fact a fairly dismal prediction all round. Well done to our high scoring reserves also. To all you haters & doubters, 'up yours' they said. Bugger, wrong thread.

now you tell me !! I'd actually forgot about that so lets go with him scoring a few more than i thought then and now it's a narrow victory for the mighty Lions!

Hammering it down in Leicester! I think Graversen seems to goes well here. Never been but I can picture him gating and getting that left leg out blocking. Niemenen and Karlsson should do OK but i'm not sure Doolan or Bjerre will quite have the gating to score big all night. Edberg and Branford both look like they have the style to struggle a bit around such a mini track. so i'm going with a 4 point defeat

surely to be taking advantage of our doubling up rules and the extra revenue that gives him against, say, someone like Matty Wethers for example, another Wolves asset (i think) riding in the same meeting he then needed to have made it clear to his swedish club on signing their contract that should a clash of fixtures occur then, for whatever reason, because of the absolute nature of the doubling up rule put in place to help his earnings as a dedicated UK league rider, he would have to drop out of their meetings. At that point the swedish club would then have made a decision on whether it was wise to sign him or not. If that wasn't the case and he still wanted to ride in Sweden to augment his UK earnings then he needed to say the double up rule isn't something i can comply with and someone like Wethers might then be able to take advantage of it.

It's indefensible. The rule was bought in for a specific reason. To help riders willing to dedicate themselves to the British leagues and yet Lindgren hasn't done that. He has put himself in a position that he can't do that by signing for Swedish league teams (as far as i can see he actually rides for 2 of them). It's unfortunate for the lad but it does go against the whole point of doubling up if you then allow him to drop out because he has swedish league commitments, irrespective of the reasons behind that. The rule is there to help the revenue stream of riders that don't ride in other leagues around the world but It's specifically worded as far as i see so as to show the benefit available from doubling up is both to the the rider AND the British leagues. There are plenty of riders who can dedicate themselves to the UK, quite a few were even riding in that Berwick V Newcastle meeting.

Not sure what has lead me down that road but my unreserved apolgies to Mr Howard!

Some random quotes from 3 Leicester threads in our opening season...firstly from a MAY 2011 thread (just a month after opening) - Crowds probably 2000-2500 Glyn Taylor Posted 08 May 2011 - 01:22 PM Hi, I feel I must defend myself here. Last night I had put 20 tons of new dirt and the riders are telling me there is too much . The problem is in the track shape the surface is good. You who say on here there is no dirt I invite you to come with me on a track walk before and after the meeting. We are going to change the shape over the next few weeks. Both Doc and Graham have been and agree with what I have said. The Redcar Manager Jittendra Duffill Posted 08 May 2011 - 06:56 PM l have to agree with Glyn here, the track preparation last night was superb with plenty of dirt around the outside. Watering was perfect and all the Redcar riders were impressed. The track was smooth and consistent, a great achievement for the amount of time it has been laid, so I'm 100% confident this is not the problem. The reason you are not seeing good racing is definitely the track shape, the straights are far too long IMO and its pretty square going into the turns so its hard to race anyone into the turns. Great to hear that the shape will be altered because I believe that if they took 10 metres of each bend it has the potential to be one of the best racing tracks in the country. Bilbo baggins Posted 07 May 2011 - 11:53 PM All week, I have been reading that the watering problems have been solved and the track and, racing were going to be much better. HOW WRONG WAS THAT!!!!!!!!! The track is appalling PT Preece Posted 08 May 2011 - 07:15 AM I think the track needs the corners pulling in few feet, so you can get an inside line, and some shale Barrow Boy Posted 08 May 2011 - 08:13 AM Could be the best trier in the world but he won't be any good on Leicester's track if he can't gate Hazzman Posted 08 May 2011 - 08:36 AM I honestly think I'll give it a month before returning again. Harsh to say but I just don't find it entertaining. Flagrag Posted 08 May 2011 - 11:27 AM I made another visit to Leicester last night as was already in the area for work, I must say I was very disappointed with what I saw the track is no better and hardly any racing Squall Posted 08 May 2011 - 05:16 PM Too tight going into the bends. So Father Squall says anyway Halifaxtiger Posted 08 May 2011 - 05:43 PM One thing that is certain is that Glyn Taylor is a good track man and hasn't become a bad one overnight. The difference in racing when he was at STMP and since he has left is marked. If he says it is the shape of the track I have no reason to doubt his word Nobrakeshere Posted 10 May 2011 - 02:42 PM The presentation needs sorting quickly, but not as quickly as the track. Most of us can take losing but watching gating practice wears a bit thin. I was in the pits last match and looking from that position the fourth bend looks flat, which won't help, but general opinion is that the bends need to be taken in a bit. The strange thing is, that before the fence went in it seemed to look ok with a wide entry to the bends, but in practice it has not worked out. Time to change the shape before we lose more support I feel. I hope it gets sorted as DH has put so much effort (and money) into the venture and has some good people around him, I'm sure it will all come good, just needs to be sooner than later. Ian T Posted 11 May 2011 - 08:10 AM Unfortunately all the points raised in this thread are perfectly valid (apart from the usual childish comments) The racing has been non-existent and really very tedious From a SEPTEMBER 2011 thread - Crowds probably 1800-2000 Robert72 Posted 12 September 2011 - 08:03 AM first out won in nearly every race, rumours are David is NOT going to change the track over the winter, bad move i and many others think 40-38 Posted 12 September 2011 - 08:24 AM I hope that isn't true. I really don't want us to have a crap track reputation Me Posted 12 September 2011 - 09:37 AM I’d guess the rumour emanates from David Hemsley's interview on BBC radio Coventry and Warwick where he basically said the track now rides well and that the racing is now as good as anywhere in the country. He was pretty much blaming the standard of racing earlier in the season to certain riders dictating the preparation of the surface to suit themselves and since we have gotten in a better class of rider and stopped individual riders dictating how the surface is prepared the racing is up there with the best. I really hope some work is done in the winter in widening the entry to both bends as i think the 'corridor' (that David was questioning) is definitely there Bornagainlion Posted 12 September 2011 - 10:02 AM I started worrying a few weeks ago when the "best racing in the country" quote was heard in the programme notes LionsDen Posted 12 September 2011 - 10:54 AM To say the racing is as good as any he's ever seen, as Hemsley did in his Glasgow match programme notes, simply beggars belief and makes you wonder what the hell he's watching! Boulger fan Posted 12 September 2011 - 04:15 PM To be honest the last meeting I went to was Plymouth and after that I thought I am wasting my money watching processional unexciting racing 90% of the time Jackson2 Posted 13 September 2011 - 05:48 AM Don’t blame you Bouger Fan for not going any more i don’t a waste of money just seems that Hemsley does not want good racing just your money For a balanced view - Pixel8 Posted 12 September 2011 - 07:35 PM Overall I would say that the track and the racing have improved as the season has progressed. I am lead to believe that the inside line will be pulled in over winter which will give a choice of lines entering the turns, thus improving the overtaking possibilities. 　 From a OCTOBER 2011thread - crowds probably 1700-2000 Glyn Posted 13 October 2011 - 08:11 AM I have spoken to Dave and we are going to make some changes to the track. So please lets move on. Lucifer Sam Posted 08 October 2011 - 09:35 PM Let's give Leicester a fair crack of the whip. They are still in their first year of opeartion. Let's see what the track is like next year, as I believe it will undergo a fair amount of work during the winter months 40-38 Posted 09 October 2011 - 12:57 AM It was dire again Nobrakeshere1 Posted 09 October 2011 - 06:51 PM Glyn wants to change the track, he's said so. Not so sure DH feels totally the same way, he wants to put more banking in but is non commital about moving drains etc which would be needed to take the bends in. I'm sure if I rode around the place on my own it would feel OK, and I know people who have and say it feels fine, but in racing mode it's not wide enough entering the turns to allow riders to race, you have to follow the leader Shadders Posted 09 October 2011 - 07:42 PM Been there a couple of times and after my first visit way back in April I posted that the track was the wrong shape... The bends are too tight for such long straights Halifaxtiger Posted 09 October 2011 - 07:46 PM When I have been it hasn't been good but lets give them the winter to sort it out Lion tamer (my guess is this is Dave Howard of timekeeping and LSSC face book fame and still one of the true believers) Posted 09 October 2011 - 09:41 PM Whenever a new track has opened up in recent years all we hear from the so called speedway fans is "brilliant", "fantastic", "we need all the tracks we can get re-opening", but for some reason which I can't for the life of me understand, Leicester has been the constant brunt of snide remarks & criticisms. If I was David Hemsley I would seriously feel like saying f*** you, demolish the whole lot, & let's see lots more tracks closing down. Speedway fans? Don't make me laugh. Neilbv Posted 09 October 2011 - 10:27 PM Instead of demolishing the place in a huff why not just do the bleeding obvious thing & change the shape?? I know 3 of the current Leicester team personally as well as many opposition riders & all bar 1 have commented on what a crap shape it is. Yes the fans do love speedway but wouldn't you rather watch racing with overtaking than follow the leader stuff you get at BP? Like someone has said on here the honeymoon is over & if DH choses to ignore GOOD advise then the man's a fool Nightshift Posted 10 October 2011 - 09:53 AM I think DH has been somewhat fortunate, in that the crowds at Leicester have held up pretty well. I really can not believe the one most important thing to get right, the track, was so badly designed. It really is a monumental clanger... If it is not changed I'm afraid Leicester speedway will struggle to survive. I have been to just about every home meeting and to be honest standing there in the hope of a decent race is now, for me, becoming hard work. I really can't say how many times I have walked back to my car and said to my self that was the last time. I think it will start to become a bit of a chore next season for many people if something isn't done Paulr Posted 10 October 2011 - 11:13 AM 1. People make mistakes - the critical thing for Leicester is to recognise & accept there is an issue with the track and do something about it Ballroom Posted 10 October 2011 - 01:03 PM As others have said, fairly, there are issues with the track and the standard of racing. We look to those being addressed in time Crash Test Dummy Posted 10 October 2011 - 02:03 PM Interesting posts for and against DH. The proof of the pudding will be this winter, ie. will DH plough more finance into altering the track and getting it right or will he press on lemming like, thinking he knows best and no one else's opinions count cos he's the big cheese who's put up the cash and got the outfit running Marky Posted 10 October 2011 - 07:47 PM i've been to Leicester twice and hardly seen a passing move. unless they change the track for next year crowds will go down Nightshift Posted 11 October 2011 - 11:06 AM If he doesn't change the track he wont have any funds Tiberon Posted 12 October 2011 - 09:10 PM IMO they need to take in the inside going into turn one (and possibly three). Neb Posted 12 October 2011 - 09:46 PM in fact the whole thread is more boring than leicester's track,yes we all know the track is not the best and yes it will be changed over the winter says glyn so lets just look forward to 2012 and drop this dull subject Impartial One Posted 13 October 2011 - 07:48 AM I can honestly say that watching a Leicester meeting on updates is more exciting than watching it at the track. Hopefully that's not the case next year although some are suggesting that despite Glyn's willingness to change things, Hemsley believes the track is fine. Make no mistake, if the product isn't improved next year they will lose customers Montie!! Posted 13 October 2011 - 08:16 AM But is BP any worse racing than some of the other tracks in the UK?? Big Fat Dave!!! (don’t count your chickens) Posted 14 October 2011 - 03:10 AM I've only been to Beaumont Leys once but I'll be back for sure, and when the first year's teething troubles are out of the way and the track is conducive to good racing I'm sure many more will be in attendance

Chris, that would be fantastic. I totally agree with you regarding the track work needed as well. I've heard similar ideas with just doing one bend to shorten the straights muted by others as well and if ever there was proof that it may work that way then the meeting vs. Ipswich was the proof, when a slower track suddenly resulted in a whole deal of overtaking in places we'd never seen before. Something definately needs to be done. Last weeks crowd, easily our second best of the season i would say, was 1000 if it was that. That's a huge amount of the fans gone, probably forever. Of the people who still go we surely cant afford any more to walk, but if nothing is done there is nothing so sure to happen in my eyes. Although i'm probably seen by all as an agitator, i'm sure some would say of the worst order, and David Hemsley probably doesn't want my money for just that reason, if we actually got someone in who knows what they are doing, someone like Glyn Taylor, and i knew for a fact that the track is where the money is going and the figures for doing it were realistic to the job being done then i'd still be quite happy to put a sizable donation into a fighting fund to make this happen. All the best, Mick. The Interestingly point that i thought with regards to the Ipswich meeting was that just slowing up the racing and the bends suddenly didn't seem so sharp anymore. Making the straights shorter i do think would work. bend 1 and 2 produced plenty of passing left just as it was when riders were just going that little bit slower. It's never produced any at all, ever, with the speed they currently go around it.

Sounds good Neb. He was definately back on it on Saturday. It's the first time i've seen him in a long time where he hasnt appeared to be hanging on to his position in a race, for once he was actually looking pretty fast out front. It looks like he was just as fast at Glasgow and If that is the case that his problems have been mechanical then you may be right about us regretting it.

It may seem 'precious' but i honestly believe there is a difference between the dull racing we get a BP and the dull racing that you might see at another track. I was talking to my Uncle about this earlier today and we both agreed that on Saturday night Lasse Bjerre provided the perfect example of why that is. He was faster than riders in front of him all night. I don't mean he was a bit quicker, he was MILES quicker. Unfortunately as quick as he was he couldn't find a way past the rider in front. This again would have been OK if the rider in front was blocking his run or riding defensively but nobody needs to do that at BP. The riders in front of him were just armchair riding their line. To go around them he was carrying too much speed and just ran out of corner to complete the manouvre (i think he hit the fence a couple of times) and the inside line just left him having to slow up too much in the cut back. There is literally no way by. By the fourth lap of most races he seemed to have given it up as either a waste of time or else not worth the seemingly increasing chance it would all end in tears for him, his bike or both. That's the issue i can't get around. It's nothing to do with the issue of whether you can fill in your programme after the second bend of the first lap. There was plenty of dirt down on saturday as there was the week before so you can't really blame the slickness or not of the track. The excitement we get each week is the thrill that someone has actually passed someone (or more usually not as the case may be) without having the huge accident that almost always looks likely to happen. Hand on heart neither of us have seen this in speedway before at any track. It's just not right. I've been going to Speedway since 1980 and followed Leicester, Long Eaton & Peterborough. When i followed Long Eaton i used to go to 40/50+ meetings a year home and away. My Uncle has been going regularly to Speedway since 1968. I don't think we're alone in those views either and i'm sure that's the issue most people have. If you've not been and witnessed it then it's probably hard to understand what i'm trying to convey. As far as i see it with such huge straights the riders all carry way too much speed for the bends. We did see a decent meeting last week against Ipswich though. The track was wet to the point of being waterlogged and with the racing slowed down by 3 seconds odd a race it gave us passing in places we've never seen before in two and half years. The track actually worked. The problem i'd see with providing that kind of racetrack each week is that we'd have half of them called off by the ref before they started. This is my effort at a reply that is not trying to be precious or righteous or whatever else you might be trying to convey me as.