enotian

Some Prague SGP stats since 2015 Top point Scorer - Jason Doyle 99 (17 wins) then Woffinden 97pts and Janowski 93 pts (23 wins!) Gate Points - Blue 29%, Red 28%, White 22% and Yellow 21% Gate Wins - Blue 32%, Red 30%, White 21% and Yellow 17% Best Line Up Position - #7 105 points (Janowski today) then #8 100 points (Woffinden) Worst Line Up Position - #6 52 points (Kvech) Most semi's - Jason Doyle 6, Lindgren and Woffinden 5 each Most Finals - Jason Doyle 4 (2 wins) Woffinden 4 (1 win) since 2015, Dudek 3 finals no wins, Zmarzlik 2 finals 2 wins Apologies for any inaccuracy.

Looks like I'll be watching the Champions League Final tomorrow night if this is the state of the track.

It's about product development though isn't it. The product being SGP, SON and SGP. I imagine Rickardsson in particular has identified a huge gap in Swedish talent. Maybe they think Hellstrom Bangs will make it anyway. Maybe with Lambert and Bewley being young they don't see the need to develop another Brit. Maybe not enough Brits have bought Discovery Sport + packages so why give a spot to a Brit. Or vice versa. Lots of factors feeding into the decisions beyond having the best available field. Regardless everyone had the chance to qualify so can have no complaints if they didn't secure their place on track.

first goal counts double (in the event of a draw at full or extra time). Rangers would have won or Frankfurt would have needed to score another to win. Penalties only for nil nil games. Sorted. [also England would have won Euro 2020 on this basis] as for speedway it's all become a bit like WWF hasn't it. they might as well just ensure every match ends 46-44 because that's what everyone wants. I exaggerate. too many instances of riders missing fixtures because they're here or there or just don't fancy riding a certain track as they don't think they'll score enough to make it worthwhile, to have any workable alternative. Plus the standard of #8's compared to the standard of CL heat leaders wouldn't make much of a spectacle. To the extent there are now guests for reserves!!! I've wondered in the past if a match points handicap system would be a better alternative to guests. For example if you have a 6 point rider missing, replace them with a 2 point #8 but add 4 points to the teams match score. R/R in the first instance of course Depends on what you want to see. A genuine team sport or matches with the best possible 14 riders available? Regardless the current lack of riders and the numerous reasons for riders missing matches mean that guests are inevitable.

I'm almost certain that back in the old National league days, when I was a lad, there weren't any guests. R/R for heatleaders only and if both teams were operating R/R the #8's were promoted into the 1 to 7 at reserve with the top reserve promoted to the 1 to 5. Imagine the sales of pens at the track shop!! I'm sure a doctors note had to be provided as well. And all this before air fences and all the advancements in safety equipment. Of course the riders were probably riding on average twice a week so the probability of getting injured was less. Trouble is that guest riders are good news for promoters and riders alike so I guess they're here to stay despite the manipulation and lack of credibility they bring.

you're not wrong but how much more money would a replacement ask for compared to Congreve? It's not just a rubbish team because of a lack of riders. It's 3 points under the limit for a reason.

Looked gash in one of the televised Polish 3rd? division matches recently and wouldn't become an asset. Get well soon Rene. So unlucky with injuries.

but do two swallows make a summer?

Honestly, my mate got his picture taken with him recently at some event in Newcastle and I thought it was William Shatner!!! His suit looked like it was from C&A. So despite the Iron's sad demise and Keegan's apparent need for readies, I don't think he could do a job up front anymore.

Yes, I think Janowski credits riding in the UK as aiding his development. Smektala, Predpelski. the Pawlicki's and even Zmarzlik had brief toe dips as the brightest of prospects at the time. Not sure the likes of Miskowiak would consider it beneficial now. But you might think those lesser riders, not good enough for the Polish leagues, might seek to re-build a career elsewhere rather then 'retire'. A bit like Keegan signing for Scunthorpe. The UK wouldn't be an option anymore but they don't appear to try their luck anywhere else.

interesting. I've often wondered what happened to the 'turnover' of Polish riders. The U21 top division reserves don't always progress beyond that and presumably drop down the leagues but there's bound to be some displacement i.e. a surplus of riders. imagine that!!! often thought it could be a good business opportunity for someone to act as an agent for Polish riders without team places to come and ride in the UK, on British Licenses of course. But if the Poles are paying riders not to ride then I guess it's not feasible. Academic now as they're unlikely to get work permits anyway, I'd have thought.

like tramps picking up fag butts to pull a team together. whose to blame? the tramps or society for turning their back on them? don't worry if you don't get the analogy.

Aye an even better point. Should do him the world of good. They're even struggling for riders at that level.

when did Harris ever win a world pairs title? when did Lambert ever win a SGP (home) round? If he does win one I think he'll have surpassed Harris' achievements on a world stage. He has time on his side.

Brilliant idea. The draw could even be done as part of the GP aftershow. Like a trailer for the next round. Interview each rider about their performance on the night and then ask them to pick their 1 to 16 position.

all rather academic. it would have just meant the Diamonds would've been 5 points under the limit rather than 3. Then in reality given Congreve's scores that's 7 points under the limit. Potentially 9 points if Wilson Dean had not been cruelly injured riding round at the back. but a valid point to make as it raises an interesting question? Can the Diamonds sign work permit riders or not? Presumably Wilson Dean was granted one having ridden in the UK previously but new foreign riders are probably the only hope the Diamonds have of strengthening their side. most of the best one's will be riding in Poland but I'm sure by now some won't be getting much track time and might just fancy a spell in Britain on a newly laid track for as much sausages as you can eat!!

Exactly why you can't use averages for team building, in that scenario. Wouldn't Woffinden come back in on his previous top division average which was about 7.50 or something ridiculously low. So even if riders did drop points you'd have the likes of Sam Masters on a higher average than him. If they can attract the GP stars back, even if Poland allow it, just grade them. They're already doing it with rising stars. Of course a riders average would play a part in defining the grade but averages to 2 decimal places just aren't accurate enough to rank individual riders. They're only even an indication

where you conjuring the extra higher averaged riders from then? So that all teams can have a team average of 45 points? Otherwise you'll have some teams averaging 45 points whilst others average maybe 39 points, if you're building from the existing pool of riders.

Didn't it have something to do with riders manipulating lower averages from the first six matches of the following season such that a 2.00 rider could then be replaced by a 5.00 as the other six riders had collectively dropped 3 points between them, for example. As at the start of a new season the first set of new averages was based entirely on that seasons scores. Making it easy for a 9 pointer to 'take it easy' over the first six matches and lower their average before miraculously rediscovering their form and finishing the season as a 9 pointer. By introducing rolling averages it was then much more difficult for a rider to reduce their average at the start of the season (or at any time) because they'd need to 'take it easy' over 20 matches which is difficult when points = money. I've really no idea why they'd reduce this to 10 matches? That's worse than pre rolling averages. At least then a riders starting average for the following season was based on their performance across the whole of the last season, in which there used to be plenty of matches. Aside from manipulating lower averages for the start of the following season a team guaranteed a play off spot could actually manipulate their averages to have a stronger reserve for the play offs. Say Belle Vue have a commanding lead in the PL with even six matches to go. Could Charles Wright, for example, have six bad matches and find himself at reserve for the play offs?

well that'll give plenty of riders the opportunity to reduce their average to grab those lucrative Poole and Glasgow contracts in 2023 would love to hear the rationale behind this.

no I have no problem with the play offs. my point is if you only have six teams good enough to make those play offs then why bother with the league competition. There's little or no Jeopardy. Especially if the league competition features numerous massive home wins of little or no entertainment value. I don't follow Poland and Sweden closely enough to know if they have the same problem of uncompetitive teams but some of the Extraliga matches I've watched seem evenly matched.

Heat 15 does count in a riders average. It's just that the riders average is based on 4 rides not 5. i.e. if you score 15 from five every match your average is 12.00 not 15.00. Therefore based on 4 rides each for seven riders the total team average is based on 14 heats. Of which 6 points are available so if you want equal team strengths 42.00 is the magic number. However, I do agree that the averages are a farce. They are certainly not accurate to two decimal places to suitably rank riders in order or ability. On the basis that all riders don't meet each of their opponents an equal amount of times and any rider can benefit from an opponents misfortune. They can only be used as a guide to ranking riders of similar ability.

two teams that I think were expelled from the league for fielding under strength teams. as a result of the league expanding too much due to its success. so yes it wasn't perfect and there'll always be the chance that some teams will be rubbish. I remember Newcastle signing Neil Evitts, former British Champion, as #1 and he was garbage, it can happen. But in divisions of so few teams where the top six make the play offs if you have a couple of teams which aren't competitive it all becomes a bit academic. We can probably name the top 7 in this years CL already. Poole, Leicester and Glasgow have probably done enough to qualify already. To the point that we might just as well skip to the play offs.

Wow. Massive mistake if they have. It's early days for Discovery Sports but they've identified that the product is great but only if you have great riders and they don't want to leave that to chance. Hence SGP2, 3 and 4. And of course that's more content to fill their schedules. You'd imagine they'd want a structure to aid that strategy which would be exactly what is required in this country. I genuinely don't know but do any promoters make money from speedway operations at present? I thought it was basically a vanity project for small businessmen or enthusiast's? Which begs the question, why wouldn't they let someone else take the strain. Especially as I imagine their small businesses are under pressure as it is without having to worry about how much the best available guest wants as a guarantee!!

Agree. And those youngsters progress is totally being stifled by the structure. Of those mentioned only Brennan and Gilkes looked to have made progress this season. The rest are being drained of confidence. As soon as they progress from a CL reserve birth they're up against established riders with, most likely, bigger budgets and far greater experience. I do think the young kids need to earn success but at present it's like putting the winner of the Red Bull Rookies straight into MotoGP, on the same bike. Those are a great crop of talented youngsters but yet again we have zero riders in SGP2 (World U21) so the system clearly isn't aiding their progression. There also seems to be some great talent at 250cc level. Let's hope there's a career path for them before they become disinterested due to lack of opportunity.