Witches V Monarchs Kocup Final 1st Leg Thurs 16th Oct

[cyclone 943]

Cannot believe the pelters the Ipswich team & Promotion are taking for their overall performance this season, based on tonight's result.

 

Third in the League, including unbeaten at home and 5 away wins. and reaching the KO Cup Final, including dispatching Somerset on the way.

 

Tonight's result was only the Witches second home defeat this season.

 

Some so-called Witches supporters on here, come over as being smug that they have continued to boycott Foxhall Heath, in the light of tonight's outcome.

 

I have every sympathy for the Louis' having to contend with such apathy displayed on here..

 

 

 

 

[Blacksmith 53]

Gino hit the fence in heat 3, but finished the race.

Thank you, clears that one up

[Bezza 20]

I won't knock the Louis's as more often than not they will track a competitive team. Its the riders who let the management down and yet most if you asked all have ambitions for riding elite. I'm sorry - but if you are delivering single digit scores at this level on a track you ride every week, then elite is a few years away yet and any international recognition is simply a pipe dream!

[Nutz 132]

Being poor was bad enough but one of the most monumental piss poor exhibitions of refereeing I've ever witnessed just added insult to injury!

 

The only one of the numerous jump starts he actually pulled back was the only race Cook didn't do it but fell off on the first bend. Cook and Masters had at least 6 rollers between them.

 

Then to exclude Worrall when Masters took a dive in heat 13 was just unbelievable!

 

I've no idea what meeting Mick Posselwhite was watching but it certainly wasn't the same one I was.

 

On the subject of the starts, the only one where anyone was actually moving, was in heat 1 where Sedgmen was rightly warned. None of the other fliers I saw, was anyone moving... This is the age old debate of anticipating the start... If you just make an ultra-quick gate and drop the clutch at the right time, it seems as though they've jumped the start. As long as they're not moving, I don't see the issue. They'll penalise themselves more often than not by either touching the tapes or missing the start.

 

As for the Masters / Worrall clash, it was impossible to see from my vantage point on turn 2 if there was enough contact for Sam to fall. It's one of those that - if it were at turn 1, it would be all 4 back but as it was going into turn 3, someone had to go. It's a pity as it would've been interesting to see if Cook could overhaul Tungate (it was the only time he was headed) - trying to be unbiased, I don't think Cook was in the mood to be beaten last night...

 

I did say that it was harsh on Worrall to be excluded though.

 

As for Ellis? Shame on you...

 

Which ever way you look at it - that one was one shocking team performance........with the exception of Heeps and Ellis who had their moments..

 

We don't need to go through names on the forum, the Foxhall faithful know exactly what to expect from each of the riders when they line up at the tapes and it's fast becoming an all too familiar story when our riders miss the gate.

 

This was supposed to be a Cup Final - plenty of noise made this week in the press, radio and website and yet the public turn up and watch a circus!.

 

I'm not taking anything away from Edinburgh who were excellent but quite honestly the rebuilding job for 2015 starts now for the Louis'

 

It will be a long ol drive tomorrow to Scotland and worse still come next Thursday they will do well to get 250 paying customers for the 16 lapper..

 

Even as an Edinburgh supporter, I was disappointed in the Ipswich performance... However, it's unfortunate they didn't turn up (Heeps and to a lesser extent Hawkins/Ellis excepted) and that they met an Edinburgh side that just don't know how to give in... Maybe the track played into our hands as it seemed a bit slick (due to the previous weather) and not as heavy and deep as previous times I've been there...

 

One side note though... Surprised Manzares was allowed to be replaced in heat 14...

 

Was really nice to see so many home supporters on the back straight, appreciative of the racing last night... NOT! We all like to see our team win and get upset when we don't, but I've never heard such vitriolic abuse from some since the heated Scottish derbies of the Carr/Schott days!!!!

 

And what was with the mass exodus prior to heat 15?!!!

 

Here's hoping we can carry this form into next weekend and finish off with what we've raced for all season...

Edited October 17, 2014 by Nutz

[Gavan 5,050]

well where to start after a shcoking display from the majority of our boys.

 

The fact that Cook cheats time and again and gets away with it has no bearing on the score as even if he was chucked out of a few races we still wouldnt have got close.

The decision to exclude Worrall in 13 was a joke as well.

 

However awful the ref was had no bearing on the final score.

 

Tungate - dont want him back on that average

Heeps - keep him

Risager - not bad 3rd heat leader but will stay as is 'family'

Manzares - has to stay

Worrall - would keep him

Hawkins - keep

Ellis - possibly

 

I think we need a Danny King to spearhead us and possibly can see Lanham back maybe at reserve on a low average

[CardinalSin 346]

Well King is riding in the 16 lapper next week. Doesn't mean he'll definitely be a Witch next year, but I think it's looking odds on to be honest.

[Baldyman 6,243]

Just cos morten is family is not the reason to keep him, unfortunately I think you are right, and the same mistakes with team building will be made again.

[lucifer sam 3,953]

Well King is riding in the 16 lapper next week. Doesn't mean he'll definitely be a Witch next year, but I think it's looking odds on to be honest.

 

 

Surely he'll ride for Birmingham in the PL, if they are back.

 

All the best

Rob

[Baldyman 6,243]

What is the line up for the 16 lapper?

[TheScotsman 2,483]

Not wishing to be smug, but John Louis, Chris Louis, Brian Messenger, Mike Bacon - your boys took a hell of a beating!!

 

I, like probably the majority of Monarchs fans, hoped the boys could keep it close - single figure defeat would have been ok - so that we could finish it off at the Dale.

Then we heard Stevie was out and r/r would apply, with 2 rides to be taken by our reserves, and I felt the job had got that bit harder.

 

But 15 heats later we've only gone and taken a 16 point lead back with us and provided 12 of the 15 race winners.

And this against an Ippo team who since June have been unbeatable at home and in that time have knocked in 65, 57 and 57 against the mighty Somerset.

And we've done it with our reserves being outscored by 16 paid 20 to 4 paid 5.

Our heat leaders were amazing - 41 paid 43 compared to Ippo's 13 paid 15.

 

For Ippo, the 3 heatleaders were, as mentioned, DIRE!!

Only Tungate put up much of a fight and that was only in heat 10 against Max Fricke, when he was pretty brutal on him on turn 2 lap 1 (surprised Max was able to stay on the bike - if he had come off there must have been a good chance of Tungate being excluded) and briefly in heat 13 when he was leading Cookie when the race was stopped on lap 1.

Worrall was maybe slightly unlucky - a) fuel problems cost him a point in heat 4 and the exclusion in heat 13 for bringing down Sam Masters was probably harsh.

Risager - what was he all about? Tried hard when behind in a couple of rides then was comfortably being beaten by Aaron Fox in heat 12 when the race was stopped and awarded due to Ellis deciding to sit it out on bend 3 when comfortably last.

Was Ellis trying to get the race stopped and rerun? Looked that way to me and if so, that's a really poor show.

 

Having said that, if Worrall was unlucky to have been excluded, Tungate was maybe lucky not to have been!!

 

The youngsters Heeps and Ellis rode well for their points and were each rewarded with a heat 15 outing - though maybe not much of a reward against Cookie and Sam!!

 

Hard to know what to say about Manzares. Was he really fit enough to have started the meeting? He certainly was going well in his first ride till his bike seemed to play up going into the 3rd bend and he clouted the bouncy castle on bend 4, but he continued the race and took his second outing before being pulled out of the meeting and sent to hospital.

Was it an old injury that he aggravated? Should he have been allowed reserve replacements in both his other rides? Who knows.

 

Hawkins rode with a fair bit of spirit for his 7 +2. Most of his team mates should have taken note. Having said that, he did only beat Monarchs reserves (plus a team mate) all night.

 

For Monarchs - crikey!!

Cookie was flying and righted the wrong on the Ippo website where he was not credited with a share of the track record!! Now he has it by himself and equalled the old one in heat 5. May have been very slightly lucky in the running of heat 1 because he possibly went down on bend 1 without much assistance, but the same probably applied to Hawkins in heat 7.

Would have been very contentious if either race had been anything other that all 4 back in.

Sam was also flying. One slight blip in heat 13 when he and Cookie got in each others way on bend 2 lap 1 before he then came down on bend 3, but other than that totally untroubled.

Same goes for Max - flew out of the gate in 5 rides but barged out of it on turn 2 by Tungate which dropped him to the back and he took a couple of laps to then get past Foxy.

 

So 12 wins (14 paid wins) between them meant the others didn't need to do much.

But Justin maintained his superb recent form and was untouchable by an Ippo rider in his first 3 - his drives up the inside of turn 2 lap 1 doing the damage.

He was then caught out by the Ippo youngsters in heat 8 but ended up with a fine 8 paid 11.

Don't know the figures but his bonus point tally must be phenomenal this year and he is averaging well over 7 even though he is riding with Cookie and started the season on a sub 5 point average.

 

The Monarchs reserves struggled, as expected.

Derek never really got going and has picked up an injury from his heat 7 fall.

Foxy was gating well but not managing to keep position - until the race against Risager and Ellis.

 

 

The tracked looked to be in excellent condition, especially given the recent weather. Much smoother than I usually see, though probably less grip around the outside.

 

The crowd looked pretty sizeable too though some got a bit vociferous when Worrall was excluded.

 

Really surprised at the mass exodus after heat 14 though. Nearly got knocked over by the stampede.

Was there a lock in at the local pub or something?

No good moaning about the cost when you choose to leave before the end.

 

 

There seem to be a number of moans about Monarchs gating - why?

They were just so much quicker away than Ippo in most races.

And this was the whole Monarchs team, not just Cookie.

Justin was warned for moving in race 1 but the rest were just perfect starts.

 

And this from a fans of a team with arch-roller Tungate in the side!!

 

 

So let the Ippo witch hunt begin (See what I did there!!)

 

I'll just continue to enjoy what has been a sensational year for Monarchs, the like of which we'll probably never see again.

[CardinalSin 346]

 

Surely he'll ride for Birmingham in the PL, if they are back.

 

All the best

Rob

I suspect he'll already have a deal in place for next season.

 

On Manzares, the poor kid has had a nightmare last couple of months of the season.

 

Several nasty looking falls resulting in more than one hospital trip, a blown engine to his best machine and mechanical problems with his other one.

 

The poor lad has had the stuffing knocked out of him recently but thankfully, we'd already seen more than enough from his this year to know we have a real gem.

 

Comfortably Witch of the year for me, excellent debut season.

What is the line up for the 16 lapper?

Danny King, Rory Schlein, Jason Garrity, Ricky Wells, Richard Lawson and the 7 Witches. Edited October 17, 2014 by CardinalSin

[Baldyman 6,243]

Mmmmmmm interesting, as I've previously mentioned having Wells in our team next season, and what would Rory average be? Would have been nice to have seen covatti again also.

[Bash 496]

What a dire performance that was last night. Was saying before the meeting started that we had to take advantage in the reserve department as that is Edinburgh's weakness but didn't expect the two reserves and Cam to be the only ones to turn up! Richie W was unlucky with bike problems and a dodgy exclusion, Gino should never have started the meeting, too many knocks in recent weeks taking their toll. Morten wasn't even at the races and I feel needs to look elsewhere for next season (Louis' future son-in-law or not). Rohan had one good race, not good enough for a number 1. Oh well at least Edinburgh won't have very far to move the trophy after tonight's parade.

 

On the subject of the jump starts how can you say that Cookie never moved all night when he had to turn his front wheel sideways to avoid hitting the tapes in heat 11. Apart from that and Sedgmen moving in heat 1 the Monarchs were just quicker out of the starts even with Cookie on his "Polish 600", sounds so much different to anybody else's.

[TheScotsman 2,483]

Excuse me?

 

It's a 650 not a 600.

 

And you haven't mentioned his rocket fuel.

[CaptainAudi 147]

Excuse me?

 

It's a 650 not a 600.

 

And you haven't mentioned his rocket fuel.

And nitrous injection system