Terry 1,319 Posted June 4, 2015 I would say John. 11+ average in the seventies, something Chris never managed. But Chris 2 times British champion, John 1. John started 10 years later than Chris, so more naturally gifted. Both world number 3. I don't think any father and son have been so closely matched. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bruiser McHuge 589 Posted June 4, 2015 11 plus average in the 70's means little when compared to the era Chris Louis rode in....there were a load of 10 plus averages in the 70's....this doesn't necessarily mean they were better riders than in Chris Louis's era....the 13 heat formula, the non fixed gate positions...I think more teams meant teams were on the whole weaker than in Chris Louis's era where there were some really solid teams ....much stronger than today and stronger than the 70's as well..... It's easy to look back at the 70's and say there were lots of mega averages so the riders were so much better....they weren't ..different era, different team strengths, different formats, no fixed gate positions.....you cannot truly compare the two eras... Having said all that.......I vote for John ! True. Normally after heat 6. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Terry 1,319 Posted June 5, 2015 11 plus average in the 70's means little when compared to the era Chris Louis rode in....there were a load of 10 plus averages in the 70's....this doesn't necessarily mean they were better riders than in Chris Louis's era....the 13 heat formula, the non fixed gate positions...I think more teams meant teams were on the whole weaker than in Chris Louis's era where there were some really solid teams ....much stronger than today and stronger than the 70's as well..... It's easy to look back at the 70's and say there were lots of mega averages so the riders were so much better....they weren't ..different era, different team strengths, different formats, no fixed gate positions.....you cannot truly compare the two eras... Having said all that.......I vote for John ! Good point. Even though I've gone for John, I will always be grateful to Chris for his help in making 1988 the best year of my life! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
foamfence 2,917 Posted June 5, 2015 I would say Chris. John relied almost solely on his gating, Chris was a more complete racer. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SCB 15 Posted June 5, 2015 I always thought Chris was very under rated and didn't get half the recognition he deserved tbh. Such a shame his top class career was ultimately cut short by a rogue pole (note the lower case p!) in Poland. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
John Leslie 3,213 Posted June 5, 2015 I don't think any father and son have been so closely matched. Phil and Jason Crump. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
customhouseregular 1,651 Posted June 5, 2015 I never saw Chris but I was a big fan of John even before he took up speedway, watching him regularly on the Scrambles circuit. As a speedway rider he was excellent and certainly one of my favourite riders of that era. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waiheke1 4,295 Posted June 5, 2015 Phil and Jason Crump.Surely there is no question which crump was better? 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WembleyLion 417 Posted June 5, 2015 Having followed them very closely and both were my favourite rider for most of the time they rode I would say John but not by much. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Terry 1,319 Posted June 5, 2015 Surely there is no question which crump was better? Phil won a lot of 16 lappers as I recall. I remember early in his career Jasons leathers had 'son of the animal' emblazoned on the seat. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The White Knight 9,039 Posted June 5, 2015 John for me. Not by much though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
spiegal 294 Posted June 5, 2015 I would say Chris. John relied almost solely on his gating, Chris was a more complete racer. That is such a load of B***ocks....JL was a true racer...a great team man who carried lesser riders with him...he was an Icon..a great and genuine Captain. Chris was indeed an excellent "Rider"...and was equally an icon at Foxhall...but NOBODY but NOBODY incl Siggy..Cookie..Donc..etc came within light years of JL. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cityrebel 2,960 Posted June 5, 2015 I'd have to say john, he really stood out in those tiger leathers! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mickthemuppet 976 Posted June 5, 2015 I always thought Chris was very under rated and didn't get half the recognition he deserved tbh. Such a shame his top class career was ultimately cut short by a rogue pole (note the lower case p!) in Poland. I think you will find that Chris rode on after the incident with the starting pole in Poland which happened in 2001. He actually rode for Ipswich up to 2008.. The incident that finished his career was the crash at Foxhall with Sam Simota. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BWitcher 12,453 Posted June 5, 2015 11 plus average in the 70's means little when compared to the era Chris Louis rode in....there were a load of 10 plus averages in the 70's....this doesn't necessarily mean they were better riders than in Chris Louis's era....the 13 heat formula, the non fixed gate positions...I think more teams meant teams were on the whole weaker than in Chris Louis's era where there were some really solid teams ....much stronger than today and stronger than the 70's as well..... It's easy to look back at the 70's and say there were lots of mega averages so the riders were so much better....they weren't ..different era, different team strengths, different formats, no fixed gate positions.....you cannot truly compare the two eras... Having said all that.......I vote for John ! Superb post. Sadly many simply don't understand the points you make here and we're beginning to see that already on the thread. I never saw John Louis ride live, only seem some footage. My gut instinct would be to rate him a tad higher than Chris as you do, but there isn't much in it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
