Mark 1,497 Posted April 8, 2016 Poole reserves got 17 from 40 at Lakeside tonight. Not sure the formula is right. Poole lost but the reserves should have so much point scoring ability in a meeting. Maybe they need to meet better riders more often ? The Poole reserves will win them loads of meetings. Not anti Poole. Well done for hiring two top riders. But I want competitive sport. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SCB 0 Posted April 9, 2016 Poole reserves got 17 from 40 at Lakeside tonight. Not sure the formula is right. Poole lost but the reserves should have so much point scoring ability in a meeting. Maybe they need to meet better riders more often ? The Poole reserves will win them loads of meetings. Not anti Poole. Well done for hiring two top riders. But I want competitive sport. Reserves move into the main body of the team if they're good enough. And good team managers will know reserves make a huge difference and make sure they sign good reserves. You've hardly made a ground breaking discovery here. Coventry finished 2nd in the league last year with a team about 2 points short of the limit, how? They had an amazing reserve! They made the play-off final the year before despite their 1-5 being pretty ordinary, why? They had a great reserve. It's how it works and always has worked. Very few winning teams have poor, ordinary or average reserves, its so rare that last years Edinburgh team was a really weird anomaly in that neither reserve averaged 4! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
foamfence 2,917 Posted April 9, 2016 Poole reserves got 17 from 40 at Lakeside tonight. Not sure the formula is right. Poole lost but the reserves should have so much point scoring ability in a meeting. Maybe they need to meet better riders more often ? The Poole reserves will win them loads of meetings. Not anti Poole. Well done for hiring two top riders. But I want competitive sport. Davey Watt will soon be at reserve. By the way, Poole lost! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Theboss 727 Posted April 9, 2016 Davey Watt will soon be at reserve. By the way, Poole lost! And this exactly the issue, never should a rider of David's ability and experience be at the reserve position for an Elite League team.... There is no way he is a less able rider than Newman, in fact I would say this strengthens Poole yet again! 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikebv 10,322 Posted April 9, 2016 Always been the way, hence certain teams would pay big money for the next foreign 'four point superstar' off the rank.. He would, as expected, put a couple points on his average from the reserve berth and be replaced by a 'genuine' six point man who had dropped his average by a tenth or two... This merry go round would then continue all season with the team having a high scoring reserve... Rolling averages took the edge off it, and the new reserve process stopped it by only having Brits allowed to ride there... Now that has changed, off we go again.... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Woz01 3,589 Posted April 9, 2016 Having a strong reserve always helps no matter what format is used. Pawlicki for Cov in 2010 and Smolinski for Brum are 2 examples. Having said that I didn't see the need for draft riders to still have protected heats now they can move up. In the coming months we are going to have riders who are heat leaders now being in protected heats. That cannot be right. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Theboss 727 Posted April 9, 2016 Having a strong reserve always helps no matter what format is used. Pawlicki for Cov in 2010 and Smolinski for Brum are 2 examples. Having said that I didn't see the need for draft riders to still have protected heats now they can move up. In the coming months we are going to have riders who are heat leaders now being in protected heats. That cannot be right. I would actually go to the extent of labelling it 'a complete farce' ! 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grachan 7,364 Posted April 9, 2016 Having a strong reserve always helps no matter what format is used. Pawlicki for Cov in 2010 and Smolinski for Brum are 2 examples. Having said that I didn't see the need for draft riders to still have protected heats now they can move up. In the coming months we are going to have riders who are heat leaders now being in protected heats. That cannot be right. Which will take us back to the days of on form reserves coming in to beat heatleaders. I really don't understand why they didn't revert to the old race formula now that reserves can move up into the side. The averages are all over the place at the moment. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Countershaftcounter 360 Posted April 9, 2016 No doubt along with "all forms of social media" they're "looking into it" as well as many other ridiculous decisions. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Theboss 727 Posted April 9, 2016 No doubt along with "all forms of social media" they're "looking into it" as well as many other ridiculous decisions. It does raise the question if anyone in the sport has any foresight? From personal experience I have serious doubts that any analysis or research is completed prior to these decisions being made. 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikebv 10,322 Posted April 9, 2016 It does raise the question if anyone in the sport has any foresight? From personal experience I have serious doubts that any analysis or research is completed prior to these decisions being made. Be interesting what formula they come up with next season given the amount of experienced and not so experienced riders who will potentially be generating averages which reflect more being at reserve for a spell rather than their 'true' capability level... Might need Stephen Hawking to get involved!!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mark 1,497 Posted April 9, 2016 Reserves move into the main body of the team if they're good enough. And good team managers will know reserves make a huge difference and make sure they sign good reserves. You've hardly made a ground breaking discovery here. Coventry finished 2nd in the league last year with a team about 2 points short of the limit, how? They had an amazing reserve! They made the play-off final the year before despite their 1-5 being pretty ordinary, why? They had a great reserve. It's how it works and always has worked. Very few winning teams have poor, ordinary or average reserves, its so rare that last years Edinburgh team was a really weird anomaly in that neither reserve averaged 4! Not trying top break new ground but highlighting again the situation where meetings are won by one reserve pairing being far better than the other pairing. It has too much significance. Davey Watt will soon be at reserve. By the way, Poole lost! Open your eyes lad. I said Poole lost in my post. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tellboy 3,669 Posted April 9, 2016 The reserves should be the worse riders in your team,but with the race format the way it is they become the most relied upon for points scoring. Get back to the old format and the two lowest averaged riders will rightfully be at reserve.Just make teams have 2-3 British riders in their teams. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Theboss 727 Posted April 9, 2016 (edited) The reserves should be the worse riders in your team,but with the race format the way it is they become the most relied upon for points scoring. Get back to the old format and the two lowest averaged riders will rightfully be at reserve.Just make teams have 2-3 British riders in their teams. Problem next year no one will want the Brits in their team as their averages will be unattractive. For example newman or auty could end up with a 7 point elite league average at the end of the season whilst schlein could end up with a 4.5 point average due to never riding at reserve and permanently being outscored as a heat leader racing against heat leaders in every other race. Serious issues ahead which ever way you look at it but with enough planning and for example an immediate emegency meeting by the BSPA to retract the rule which moves the reserves into the main body of the team, they may be able to limit the damagitation. Edited April 9, 2016 by jchapman Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
foamfence 2,917 Posted April 9, 2016 Not trying top break new ground but highlighting again the situation where meetings are won by one reserve pairing being far better than the other pairing. It has too much significance. Open your eyes lad. I said Poole lost in my post. That was my point, they still didn't win with better reserves than their opponents. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
