Fundin Olsen Nielsen Would They Have All Won More World Title's If There Had Been A Gp Series Around.?

[Sidney the robin 4,735]

Silly topic really as different times always have different circumstances and will always create arguments and controversy.

 

Who never won a GP but became World Champion?

 

Who should have won the Individual One off World Final but was not allowed to compete?

Answer is say nothing move on and say nothing ? IF you have a good point to make lets here it can't wait.!!

[secsy1 215]

Point made and all you so called speedway know it all, failed to answer a simple question, 1 nil to the bird brained sex, Sidney the (bird brained robin) !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[waiheke1 4,295]

Point made and all you so called speedway know it all, failed to answer a simple question, 1 nil to the bird brained sex, Sidney the (bird brained robin) !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

In what way was norbolds answer wrong KKS?

[Sidney the robin 4,735]

Point made and all you so called speedway know it all, failed to answer a simple question, 1 nil to the bird brained sex, Sidney the (bird brained robin) !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You are a Prick 😀 Sorry.!! Edited June 14, 2016 by Sidney the robin

[norbold 7,154]

Jack Milne also never won a GP but became world champion.

[waiheke1 4,295]

As did Peter Collins.

[norbold 7,154]

As did Peter Collins.

Indeed he did. This could go on for some time.

 

Perhaps people should be more specific with their questions!

[lucifer sam 3,955]

 

Who never won a GP but became World Champion?

 

 

 

Actually it was Mark Loram

 

Incorrect. Mark Loram won two Grand Prix rounds - one in 1997 and one in 1999.

 

There's plenty of World Champions who never won a Grand Prix, but Mark Loram is not one of them.

 

All the best

Rob

[BL65 658]

Ove Fundin is an interesting one. I think he could well have won every year from 1956 to 1963, though Briggo would have been a good bet maybe for 1958. Similarly Peter Craven for 1962. He would almost certainly not have won in 1967. So he actually won five, but could have won eight on the trot, though two doubtful, making six more likely, so, yes, one more than he did win at least.

Interesting to note the points totalled in 4 big meetings in the UK in 1962 in which a group of 9 leading British-based riders all competed. In the meetings comprising the World Final at Wembley, the Laurels, Gold Cup and Internationale (all at Wimbledon) the total points accumulated were Barry Briggs 54, Ove Fundin 53 (won the Internationale and The Laurels), Ronnie Moore 45 (Gold Cup winner), Peter Craven 44 (World Champion), Bjorn Knutsson 43, Ron How 36, Bob Andrews 34, Ken McKinlay 30, Soren Sjosten 28.

 

It would have been interesting to see the outcome if all had competed together in meetings on a wider range of tracks. A series including meetings on continental tracks would probably have seen the top five still there or thereabouts, but several top class non British-based riders might also have scored well.

[BL65 658]

In 1961 the group of riders who competed in The Malmo World Final, Harringay Internationale Final, Gold Cup and Laurels (both at Wimbledon) accumulated the following points - Barry Briggs 52, Ronnie Moore 51, Ove Fundin 50, Peter Craven 42, Bjorn Knuts(s)on 39, Bob Andrews 39 and Ron How 32. Fundin was World Champion, although Knutson recorded 4 wins and a fall. Briggs won The Laurels, Moore was victorious in the Gold Cup and Fundin won a run-off against Moore to win the Internationale.

[lucifer sam 3,955]

In 1961 the group of riders who competed in The Malmo World Final, Harringay Internationale Final, Gold Cup and Laurels (both at Wimbledon) accumulated the following points - Barry Briggs 52, Ronnie Moore 51, Ove Fundin 50, Peter Craven 42, Bjorn Knuts(s)on 39, Bob Andrews 39 and Ron How 32. Fundin was World Champion, although Knutson recorded 4 wins and a fall. Briggs won The Laurels, Moore was victorious in the Gold Cup and Fundin won a run-off against Moore to win the Internationale.

 

BL65, good stuff, and it shows how closely matched the top riders were.

 

Although to be honest, I'm not sure if the Gold Cup and Laurels were on a par with the World Final or Internationale. The big two individual meetings... and both won by Fundin.

 

In fact, Fundin's hat-trick of Internationale wins from 1961-63, plus his superior record in the Golden Helmet Match Race again suggest that while the competition were not far behind, he had the slight edge from '56 to '63. Interestingly, I stumbled across a 1964 interview with Fundin the other day, when it was mentioned he thought he had lost his edge that year. He was talking about retirement and, of course, he did semi-retire after the closure of Norwich, which made some of subsequent achievements even more amazing.

 

All the best

Rob

Edited June 14, 2016 by lucifer sam

[BL65 658]

 

BL65, good stuff, and it shows how closely matched the top riders were.

 

Although to be honest, I'm not sure if the Gold Cup and Laurels were on a par with the World Final or Internationale. The big two individual meetings... and both won by Fundin.

 

In fact, Fundin's hat-trick of Internationale wins from 1961-63, plus his superior record in the Golden Helmet Match Race again suggest that while the competition were not far behind, he had the slight edge from '56 to '63. Interestingly, I stumbled across a 1964 interview with Fundin the other day, when it was mentioned he thought he had lost his edge that year. He was talking about retirement and, of course, he did semi-retire after the closure of Norwich, which made some of subsequent achievements even more amazing.

 

All the best

Rob

It does indeed show how closely matched the top group of riders were. 1963 results for the World Final, Internationale and Gold Cup only show slight surprises (6 riders competed in all three meetings, but not all of them took part in The Laurels that year). Totals were Bjorn Knutson 38, Ove Fundin 37, Barry Briggs 36, Sverre Harrfeldt 34, Nigel Boocock 30, Peter Craven 26.

 

If I had ranked British-based riders over the period 1961 to 1963 from memory, and taking into account all meetings rather than just looking at statistics from some of the big individual meetings, I would have had a top five of 1. Ove Fundin, 2. Barry Briggs, 3. Ronnie Moore, 4. Bjorn Knutson, 5. Peter Craven.

[Sidney the robin 4,735]

It does indeed show how closely matched the top group of riders were. 1963 results for the World Final, Internationale and Gold Cup only show slight surprises (6 riders competed in all three meetings, but not all of them took part in The Laurels that year). Totals were Bjorn Knutson 38, Ove Fundin 37, Barry Briggs 36, Sverre Harrfeldt 34, Nigel Boocock 30, Peter Craven 26.

 

If I had ranked British-based riders over the period 1961 to 1963 from memory, and taking into account all meetings rather than just looking at statistics from some of the big individual meetings, I would have had a top five of 1. Ove Fundin, 2. Barry Briggs, 3. Ronnie Moore, 4. Bjorn Knutson, 5. Peter Craven.

What a top five BL all legends, BL have you any idea roughly what Craven's Hyde Rd record was against Fundin ? my uncle told me he always held his own there.I always imagined Ove to be a white liner tough as old boots ( only see him ride twice) have pictures of Craven leading him there one in the Helmet i think.?

[norbold 7,154]

If I had ranked British-based riders over the period 1961 to 1963 from memory, and taking into account all meetings rather than just looking at statistics from some of the big individual meetings, I would have had a top five of 1. Ove Fundin, 2. Barry Briggs, 3. Ronnie Moore, 4. Bjorn Knutson, 5. Peter Craven.

 

From my memory of those years I would go along with that, BL.

 

What a top five BL all legends, BL have you any idea roughly what Craven's Hyde Rd record was against Fundin ? my uncle told me he always held his own there.I always imagined Ove to be a white liner tough as old boots ( only see him ride twice) have pictures of Craven leading him there one in the Helmet i think.?

The dedicated Ove Fundin fan and great speedway statistician and historian, the late Keith Farman, compiled a complete record of every race Ove had ever ridden in this country. He found that Ove Fundin beat the other Big Four more times than they beat him, but that of those, Peter Craven beat him more times than any of the others.

[BL65 658]

What a top five BL all legends, BL have you any idea roughly what Craven's Hyde Rd record was against Fundin ? my uncle told me he always held his own there.I always imagined Ove to be a white liner tough as old boots ( only see him ride twice) have pictures of Craven leading him there one in the Helmet i think.?

A quick glance through my records indicates that between 1956 and 1963 Peter Craven and Ove Fundin met in 49 races at Hyde Road, with Peter ahead 31-18.

1956 team matches Craven 0 Fundin 2

1957 Golden Helmet Craven 2 Fundin 0

1958 team Craven 3 Fundin 0, Golden Helmet Craven 2 Fundin 0

1959 team Craven 0 Fundin 1, Golden Helmet Craven 2 Fundin 1

1960 team Craven 1 Fundin 4

1961 team Craven 3 Fundin 1, Golden Helmet Craven 0 Fundin 2, second half races Craven 3 Fundin 0

1962 team Craven 3 Fundin 2, Golden Helmet Craven 3 Fundin 2

1963 team Craven 3 Fundin 2, Golden Helmet Craven 4 Fundin 0, second half Craven 2 Fundin 1

 

Not including the second half races, some of which were Gold Cup qualifiers, the score was Craven 26 Fundin 17.