Steve Shovlar 10,450 Posted July 22, 2016 Plainly obvious Shovlar just posts for a reaction consistently putting down Bates who has achieved more on the World stage than Ellis this year. Bates smashed Holder and Hans the other week which he forgets. Oh and he kept going on and on about Adams injury but yet when Bates comes back from his he expects him to be banging in the points! It's what trolls do. I see this disgusting obnoxious troll has been allowed back to play after serving a ban for a foul and abusive bullying attack on another forum member. He should have been banned permanently for such disgraceful abuse. What shows your lack of knowledge most is your comment about Woryna showing more form than Bates. Is that why Kacper is now at reserve with his average still dropping as can't score there, whilst Bates has scored so well at reserve he's moved in to the top 5 and even upped his average there, beating strong riders. Bates stays in the top 5 in the new averages as well as his average is nearer to 5 whilst Woryna is still 4. Put money on it Woryna has a bigger career of the two. Just seems to have far more track craft. You forget its his first year and he hasn't seen these tracks before. Bates knows all the tracks. He has ridden Poole on numerous occassions. If he gates he can be quick. A bit like Daniel Davidsson. But clueless from the back. The problem with the Bees side is quite simply that it was constructed very very poorly. That was obvious from the moment it was announced , it required changes early on in the season and they weren't forthcoming. The only person to blame for that is Horton, he is ultimately responsible for what happens. There is no point continually aiming criticism at the various riders , the bottom line is that the team building for this year is garbage. Agree with that. Garrity is the reason why Coventry gave failed so miserably. He bullied Horton into giving him a top five berth. Madness. It's irrelevant if he scored 21 points in Poland in the week, that may indicate he has some potential for the biggest speedway nation. Back to the UK, he has been woefully exposed in the EL. Bates without question is having a better EL season than Woryna. you answered your own question. Woryna us doing well in Poland as he knows the tracks. The same as Bates here. Take Bates out to Poland and listen to the Poles screaming about this "useless Brit". Its exactly the same. Woryna doesn't know the tracks yet. He was giving his all chasing the Poole riders attempting some Kamakazi dives to no avail, while Bates and Barker were tailed off poodling. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mdmc82 2,878 Posted July 22, 2016 I wonder what Bates was like on his first visit to EL tracks?! He was coming in as a draft rider with only NL & PL experience when he first rode in the WL so can hardly compare them. Woryna has been brought in to the team in the main body and has experience against big names. I think Woryna has potential in a few years time just not yet. We watch him every meeting not just in one like you. It's not his fault as he's only a 4pt rider, it's our team building that has made it harder and exposes him although that said he should be able to score against some of the FDR. He would have been best at no 8. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gemini 4,894 Posted July 22, 2016 Do you think that im bothered if your not bothered. Nope. Strange attitude to have. You should be in it to win it, not just turn up. We're both happy then because that makes two of us. Work that one out......or don't because I'm really not bovvered. 3 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Woz01 3,589 Posted July 22, 2016 (edited) The problem with the Bees side is quite simply that it was constructed very very poorly. That was obvious from the moment it was announced , it required changes early on in the season and they weren't forthcoming. The only person to blame for that is Horton, he is ultimately responsible for what happens. There is no point continually aiming criticism at the various riders , the bottom line is that the team building for this year is garbage. Agree with that. The side looked like it was built so when the heat leader list was no longer applicable we could change Woryna for someone better. Should've happened and it's poor it hasn't. Bates is doing decent progress this year at both levels so I'm baffled why anyone is questioning his season or potential. If he is doing so poorly how come a certain Pole with potential has ended up at reserve in a dreadful team with the weakest reserves? Woryna has showed some ability this year but lacks any consistency. To be a reserve in one of the 2 weakest teams this season has to be seen as a failure on his behalf. It's irrelevant if he scored 21 points in Poland in the week, that may indicate he has some potential for the biggest speedway nation. Back to the UK, he has been woefully exposed in the EL. Bates without question is having a better EL season than Woryna. It's irrelevant he scored a 21 point maximum as it was a junior fixture! Edited July 22, 2016 by woz01 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lisa-colette 6,065 Posted July 22, 2016 Plainly obvious Shovlar just posts for a reaction consistently putting down Bates who has achieved more on the World stage than Ellis this year. Bates smashed Holder and Hans the other week which he forgets. Oh and he kept going on and on about Adams injury but yet when Bates comes back from his he expects him to be banging in the points! It's what trolls do.And who did Bates beat at Poole? Whoever is better at BV should be in the GB squad. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
foreverblue 6,121 Posted July 22, 2016 And who did Bates beat at Poole? Whoever is better at BV should be in the GB squad. Bates looks quick when he gates but doesn't do much passing, not good enough for the squad yet but he is young and will improve so one for the future. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chris4gillian 1,832 Posted July 22, 2016 I see this disgusting obnoxious troll has been allowed back to play after serving a ban for a foul and abusive bullying attack on another forum member. He should have been banned permanently for such disgraceful abuse. On the Team GB thread you have a pop at me for using the phrase 'lying coward' (in exactly the correct context) but yet you think that's ok to post? HYPOCRITE. Is that one ok? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mj82 52 Posted July 22, 2016 Woryna is a good rider and he doesn't get the points his effort deserves. Saying that I would rather see a tryer than someone tootlin around because they haven't gated. To many of them about. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mdmc82 2,878 Posted July 22, 2016 And who did Bates beat at Poole? Whoever is better at BV should be in the GB squad. Exactly. We are yet to see Ellis ride at Belle Vue so he hasn't beaten anybody there & could score 0. I think Rosco will pick Adam but I hope for our sake nobody gets injured Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Steve Shovlar 10,450 Posted July 22, 2016 On the Team GB thread you have a pop at me for using the phrase 'lying coward' (in exactly the correct context) but yet you think that's ok to post? HYPOCRITE. Is that one ok? So you think Gavan was ok posting that disgusting comment? It was the worst type of bullying and undefendable. He should have been banned for good. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevebrum 6,834 Posted July 22, 2016 you answered your own question. Woryna us doing well in Poland as he knows the tracks. The same as Bates here. Take Bates out to Poland and listen to the Poles screaming about this "useless Brit". Its exactly the same. Woryna doesn't know the tracks yet. He was giving his all chasing the Poole riders attempting some Kamakazi dives to no avail, while Bates and Barker were tailed off poodling. No disagreement from me. Bates is the better rider in the EL/UK. It's irrelevant he scored a 21 point maximum as it was a junior fixture! Given how strong the juniors are in Poland it's a decent achievement however it's irrelevant given it wasn't a team competition. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skidder1 7,660 Posted July 22, 2016 He was coming in as a draft rider with only NL & PL experience when he first rode in the WL so can hardly compare them. Woryna has been brought in to the team in the main body and has experience against big names. I think Woryna has potential in a few years time just not yet. We watch him every meeting not just in one like you. It's not his fault as he's only a 4pt rider, it's our team building that has made it harder and exposes him although that said he should be able to score against some of the FDR. He would have been best at no 8. I've said before, Horton only signed him to spite MF as Woryna was lined up as Poole's no.8. Kacper's heart has always been at Poole due to the family connections with Poole, but felt he was ready for a full season which Poole weren't able to guarantee this year. He has a skull & crossbones logo on all is kit except his Bees kevlars which Horton wouldn't allow. However he ends this season its not the last you'll see of him in the UK leagues. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lisa-colette 6,065 Posted July 22, 2016 So Horton did it to annoy Matt yet it completely backfired onto him. Brilliant! :D 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chris4gillian 1,832 Posted July 22, 2016 So you think Gavan was ok posting that disgusting comment? It was the worst type of bullying and undefendable. He should have been banned for good. What's Gavan got to do with it? You lambasted me but yet posted what you felt was 'ok'. Double standards. I'll leave it there. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waiheke1 4,295 Posted July 22, 2016 On essence I don't think bees have an issue with woryna per Se. If garrote was at reserve he was on OK signing. But as it was bees needed a 6.5 man who could alternate between hl and 2nd string, not a 4 pt man to alternate between reserve and 2nd string. I'm sure SS would not have been happy had Ford gone with woryna and Newman rather than Kurtz and Pedersen as 2nd strings. I too think woryna has talent and clearly puts in the effort, but he's symptomatic of the poor way the team was assembled. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
