Greatest 5 Americans Ever

[waiheke1 4,295]

No, actually it isn't. Though I admit that I didn't like that either.

 

I didn't like the way that he ended his Career. I was disgusted with him then and am disgusted with him now.

fair enough.

Specifically was it the way he ditched the heathens (handing Aces the title which surely was a good thing!)?

Or bowing out on home soil as double world chsmpion, to pursue a career in Hollywood rather than Dudley Wood?

[chunky 6,155]

fair enough.

Specifically was it the way he ditched the heathens (handing Aces the title which surely was a good thing!)?

Or bowing out on home soil as double world chsmpion, to pursue a career in Hollywood rather than Dudley Wood?

Thing is, there have been many other riders who have retired mid-season - for a number of reasons. Okay, he was a high-profile character, but it is a rider's right to retire...

 

Steve

[Midland Red 2,383]

Of those I've seen,

 

Penhall

Autrey

King

K Moran

S Moran

 

Res : Hamill

 

The ageing current Grand Prix champion excluded himself from selection with his Pedersen attack and his Melbourne antics

 

Of course, all of my six selections were squeaky clean!!!!!

[Guest]

Thing is, there have been many other riders who have retired mid-season - for a number of reasons. Okay, he was a high-profile character, but it is a rider's right to retire...

 

Steve

 

Very true. And their decision in this respect should always be accepted.

[Guest]

There is an article in and American publication in which the author deviates away from the threads request by naming 10 top American riders. It is an interesting item. The writer names these riders:

Kelly Moran

Bobby Schwartz

Sprouts Elder

Jack Milne

Shawn Moran

Sam Ermolenko

Billy Hamill

Mike Bast

Bruce Penhall

Greg Hancock

Go to this Link for the article: http://www.dirtbikes.com/top-10-american-speedway-riders-time/

Edited June 24, 2017 by Guest

[The White Knight 9,039]

fair enough.

Specifically was it the way he ditched the heathens (handing Aces the title which surely was a good thing!)?

Or bowing out on home soil as double world chsmpion, to pursue a career in Hollywood rather than Dudley Wood?

I do not like much about the said Mr. Penhall. Probably just his riding ability.

 

There is more to being a Champion than just riding though.

 

These are my last comments on him.

[Guest]

There is an article in and American publication in which the author deviates away from the threads request by naming 10 top American riders. It is an interesting item. The writer names these riders:

Kelly Moran

Bobby Schwartz

Sprouts Elder

Jack Milne

Shawn Moran

Sam Ermolenko

Billy Hamill

Mike Bast

Bruce Penhall

Greg Hancock

Go to this Link for the article: http://www.dirtbikes.com/top-10-american-speedway-riders-time/

 

I am sure the article on Mike Bast will attract much interest, especially in regard to his potential in the world championship. Of the 10 riders featured he is the only one not to have raced on a regular basis in Europe.

[waiheke1 4,295]

Obvious omission from that list is Cordy Milnes. Struggle to see how schwartz gets ranked ahead of Sigalos.

I'd leave out Bast and Schwarrz for milne and Siggy

Top 5

Hancock

Penhall

Sprouts Elder

J Milne

Ermolenko

[Guest]

There is an article in and American publication in which the author deviates away from the threads request by naming 10 top American riders. It is an interesting item. The writer names these riders:

Kelly Moran

Bobby Schwartz

Sprouts Elder

Jack Milne

Shawn Moran

Sam Ermolenko

Billy Hamill

Mike Bast

Bruce Penhall

Greg Hancock

Go to this Link for the article: http://www.dirtbikes.com/top-10-american-speedway-riders-time/

 

 

Obvious omission from that list is Cordy Milnes. Struggle to see how schwartz gets ranked ahead of Sigalos.

I'd leave out Bast and Schwarrz for milne and Siggy

Top 5

Hancock

Penhall

Sprouts Elder

J Milne

Ermolenko

 

This is how Mike Bast was rated by its author Scott Daloisio in the American article (see first quote).

"If this list was just on talent alone, Mike Bast would be at the top of it. Bast was so good, he was almost boring to watch. His gating was amazing, and his form was absolutely flawless. He parlayed that combination into hundreds of main event wins, seven U.S. National championships and six California State titles. Bast chose not to go overseas because he was raising a young family, had business interests and was making too much money riding in California. Had he gone overseas, he probably would have been a multi-time World Champion and started a World War or two."

Edited June 25, 2017 by Guest

[waiheke1 4,295]

I'm quite capable of reading thanks Gluestix. It's all very well the author writing that, but Bast hardly impressed in his international forays. And fact is he didn't prove himself at the highest level regardless of talent.

Jelly man didn't do his talent justice but he achieved far more than bast.

[Guest]

I'm quite capable of reading thanks Gluestix. It's all very well the author writing that, but Bast hardly impressed in his international forays. And fact is he didn't prove himself at the highest level regardless of talent.

Jelly man didn't do his talent justice but he achieved far more than bast.

 

Regarding the American article: the author Scott Daloisio is much respected in American motorcycle circles - and has been for many years. Apart from - obviously Jack Milne and Sprouts Elder - he has seen all the other mentioned American riders in action over the years. The article appears in a much respected American publication.

That brief foray by Mike Bast years ago into the UK rounds of the world championship was not inspiring. But in the USA when they used to have visits by leading European-based riders, Bast was in most cases a good match for them.

By your continued criticism of Mike Bast, a parallel IMO is Egon Muller. In the early 1970s he had a few rides with a British team and was far from inspiring. In the early 1980s without any major British experience he was a world champion.

​IMO too much importance is placed on judging riders by their results in British speedway. And there are many who do not like it when talented riders like Bast and Muller build respected reputations in the sport without the need for a British racing pedigree.

Many of Bast's successes were gained against fellow countrymen who had raced consistently in Britain. That surely is criteria for the recognition of the great speedway talent he possessed.

Edited June 25, 2017 by Guest

[Sidney the robin 4,735]

This is how Mike Bast was rated by its author Scott Dalosio in the American article (see first quote).

"If this list was just on talent alone, Mike Bast would be at the top of it. Bast was so good, he was almost boring to watch. His gating was amazing, and his form was absolutely flawless. He parlayed that combination into hundreds of main event wins, seven U.S. National championships and six California State titles. Bast chose not to go overseas because he was raising a young family, had business interests and was making too much money riding in California. Had he gone overseas, he probably would have been a multi-time World Champion and started a World War or two."[/size]

I dont know who this Dalosio bloke is but what he has said here is way off the mark most of us on here know Bast was talented but he didnt go and prove himself.He stayed in his safety zone beat the locals it was a big disapointment to me that Bast did not come to Britain Wimbledon would of been ideal for him.As for this Dalosio bloke where is AUTREY. SiGALOS, in the list it is staggering and as for this quote Bast would of been multi time world champion he is deluded.

[Guest]

I dont know who this Dalosio bloke is but what he has said here is way off the mark most of us on here know Bast was talented but he didnt go and prove himself.He stayed in his safety zone beat the locals it was a big disapointment to me that Bast did not come to Britain Wimbledon would of been ideal for him.As for this Dalosio bloke where is AUTREY. SiGALOS, in the list it is staggering and as for this quote Bast would of been multi time world champion he is deluded.

 

Scott Daloisio is a leading photographer and journalist on the USA's West Coast. He has many years experience in American speedway and much respected. In the introduction to the article it was said that his opinions could stimulate much debate and that certainly appears to be the case, especially in view of his comments re Mike Bast.

So far as the rider is concerned, he had no interest in riding in speedway outside the USA. Professionally it would have been of no financial benefit. And with a family and business interests in California there was good reason to stay away from racing for example in Britain.

​There is to some extent a blinkered opinion that participation in British speedway is 'a must' for any rider seeing world glory. In recent years, that has been proven by several riders - Greg Hancck and Tai Woffnden - and it just simple logic that Bast was of much the same opinion.

Basically, the fact is that 'all the benefits of world speedway achievement' are derived from a career in Britsh speedway. In these modern times, that is no longer the case. Bast was just a forerunner of that outlook. And while it persists the current problems surrounding the sport in Britain will not in my view g away but increase.

Sadly comments that are unrelated to expressing views on 'the greatest 5 Americans ever' but an opinion that needs to be clarified.

Edited June 25, 2017 by Guest

[Sidney the robin 4,735]

Scott Daloisio is a leading photographer and journalist on the USA's West Coast. He has many years experience in American speedway and much respected. In the introduction to the article it was said that his opinions could stimulate much debate and that certainly appears to be the case, especially in view of his comments re Mike Bast.

So far as the rider is concerned, he had no interest in riding in speedway outside the USA. Professionally it would have been of no financial benefit. And with a family and business interests in California there was good reason to stay away from racing for example in Britain.

​There is to some extent a blinkered opinion that participation in British speedway is 'a must' for any rider seeing world glory. In recent years, that has been proven by several riders - Greg Hancck and Tai Woffnden - and it just simple logic that Bast was of much the same opinion.

Basically, the fact is that 'all the benefits of world speedway achievement' are derived from a career in Britsh speedway. In these modern times, that is no longer the case. Bast was just a forerunner of that outlook. And while it persists the current problems surrounding the sport in Britain will not in my view g away but increase.

Sadly comments that are unrelated to expressing views on 'the greatest 5 Americans ever' but an opinion that needs to be clarified.

I actually dont take this blokes opinion to seriously to be honest i listen to the likes of Briggs/Mauger and they both rated Bast so that was good anough for me.Also most of us on here respect Bast i certainly do and from interviews seems like a really nice bloke.But to put Bast in front of Autrey and Sigalos for me is a big slur on those two those two did it against world class riders Bast did not.Also i find the Muller/Bast comparison amazing Muller was World Class most of us on my bus who went to Norden in 83 had him favourite we all wanted him in the sweep stake.Bast say for example if he had qualfied for the Coliseum in 1982 and this is my own opinion only even with a month's practice on that track he still would not of been good anough to be World Champion i am convinced of that.The reasons for that is he had not got the experience for one and had not learned the ropes and paid his dues.

[Guest]

I actually dont take this blokes opinion to seriously to be honest i listen to the likes of Briggs/Mauger and they both rated Bast so that was good anough for me.Also most of us on here respect Bast i certainly do and from interviews seems like a really nice bloke.But to put Bast in front of Autrey and Sigalos for me is a big slur on those two those two did it against world class riders Bast did not.Also i find the Muller/Bast comparison amazing Muller was World Class most of us on my bus who went to Norden in 83 had him favourite we all wanted him in the sweep stake.Bast say for example if he had qualfied for the Coliseum in 1982 and this is my own opinion only even with a month's practice on that track he still would not of been good anough to be World Champion i am convinced of that.The reasons for that is he had not got the experience for one and had not learned the ropes and paid his dues.

 

Bear in mind Sidney the robin that the opinions of Scott Daloisio are coming from an American perspective. They originally appeared in an American publication. Daloisio writes as he has seen Bast and the others active against each other on American tracks, not speculating on how they might have shown against each other in other parts of the world.

Remember that achieving his multi-US National Championship victories, Bast accomplished these in meetings where American riders who had featured strongly in the European season, returned to challenge for the title and were ultimately outpaced by him.

Edited June 25, 2017 by Guest