TMW

This thread is going nowhere in this section I'm affraid. A lot of supporters don't even bother with it. I suggest it should be moved to General Discussion but as t has NL in the title Phil wont like it.

Where as I appreciate your passion I have a question. If Dudley were in the PL would you have this passion for the NL?. Unfortunatley, all to many answer this question with NO. I suspect that many teams, you mention, are reluctant to put there big toe in the water let alone swim. There just isn't the support for the league i'm affraid apart from Dudley. The people who pay their money want to see the stars and who can blame them?. I suspect the only way the support for the NL would incease would be to make it free entry and then you are getting into the realms of the chicken and the egg or catch 22. I have to support the PL because the only local team is a PL team and I have to say the only heat I all to often enjoy and look forward to is Ht 2. More often that not its 4 british lads giving their all in a difficult league.

U tell em!!!!!!!!!!

Come on guys you need to be reasonable. Some PL teams have NL and for them to fit another 7 fixtures in at this late stage I imagine would be a nye on impossible I would say. Lets just see what comes out of the NL AGM before making a judgement.

I know that is why I have had to hijack all the other threads

Yep thought so. Maybe I didn't word it quite how I meant it. I was just pointing out the different approaches and how more teams are now focusing their approach. maybe I should have lost the 'possibly' The only thing with them going off and being owned (transfered) or loaned by other teams is they can get lost in the system. Now I wouldn't like to spark a massive debate on this it is just my perception.

Possibly Scunthorpe. As if you didnt know. Well I have missed Scunthorpe's aim whether it is to provide riders to sell i.e revenue or whether it is to filter them into the Scorpions. Mildenahll and Stoke have said thet they are going to filter them through to senior teams. I imagine Stoke are going to enter the PL again at some point and Mildenhall have Ipswich. Thats my understanding anaywyay. I'm sure you will tell me if I am wrong.

I think you are being a bit unfair there. Nobody denies that the aforementioned riders are good riders but they ae not the only ones in the NL of that standard, there is a long list actually, They were all given PL places last season Richie without even competing in the NL for a season. They were never dropped and were given a fair amount of support morally if not financially. I would say they are the for-runners of what can happen when a brit is supported and given the opportunities. There are some riders who have been around in the NL for too long because they haven't been given the opportunity of anything else. It does very much sound like teams are turning a corner with Stoke, Mildenahall Poss Scunthorpe and I assume others who are looking to breed homegrown riders. It wont happen overnight but if the riders keep coming through then the future is looking bright.

It is a bit of a turnaround from one season to the next. From having Smethills at reserve and Nielson at no.8 to having novices as second strings. Don't be too down on the lads though they need your support and if you give it i'm sure they will return the gesture and next year who knows they may even win again.

Isn't that how it should be?. The main body doing the work while the reserves learn. I doubt they will be on the pace but give them time. Too much pressure is put on the reserves to win meetings with 7 rides. This as I say puts the reserves under undue pressure. Mildenhall held their own way before Heeps joined them although he did give them a boost. Brandon Freemantle was off the pace most of the season as was Ryan Blacklock but started winning races towards and this season can only build on that

Wasn't that why riders who had patriality started on a 6 before the rules were changed? I think what HT was saying is that it was bending the rules. I don't think anyone questions what Cameron contributed to the league maybe the rules should reflect that. The rules were changed, I believe, to only Brit riders in the NL. This is lads who hold british nationality whether that be by birth (Woffenden)or parental entiltlemt ( Morris - Brandford). Maybe the rules should be changed back to Brits and Patriality. Also If you assess Commonwealth riders and european riders on previuos experience shoud you not also assess riders who come from a different disciplin like MX ,as they have vast track and racing experience and has been proved just need to do a quick conversion course to the speedway track (Worralls and Birks). That doesnt't even touch the seemingly dubious practice of riders deliberatley underperforming to manipulate and average to fit a certain team. Maybe the rules are too strict for the NL and I speak as somebody who has a vested interest in NL for Brits only but it would put a stop to all these question marks and seemingly backroom dealings. Put criteria in place and as has been proven with Heeps people will find someway of meeting it. I think the main question that needs to be asked is was it fair to all the other teams who did compete fair and square not least stoke and they ended top of the league. [quote name=Damon' timestam p='1325500264' post='2063433] amazing that in this NL forum, Mildenhall top the charts with most replys and interest, great to see the interest in the Fen Tigers ! roll on the new season. Don't think it is interest in the Fen tigers it's the ambiguaty of the inclusion of Cameron. It's actually a different thread that is being discussed.

A slight reality check on this thread is needed I think and then move on. Cameron Heeps is believed by some to have ridden illegally in the Fen tigers. This has nothing to do with what foreign riders may or may not contribute to the league that is a different argument. Did this put Mildenhall at an advantage?. Jayne has stated she was told his mother has a British Passport, so no. I think that closes the argument. Unless Mrs Heeps comes on here and states her citizenship status then you will never know if this is true or not as the BSPA will not be able to disclose this information as it wil probably subject to privacy Foreign riders on false averages, foreign riders in the league are a different argument altogether and should be discussed on a different thread.

Possibly hit the nail on the head there. People want to see EL standard riders at NL prices. I say let anyone into the NL and before you know it there will be no NL or a NL of stand alone clubs only which may not include Mildenhall as has already been said on here it is Ipswiches 'little brother'. I don;t imagine Cameron is on £10 a point plus all the X's

This Heeps argument does seem to have overshadowed the staggering progress a Brit has made at Mildenhall this season, one Lewis Blackbird, which is sad. As for the exciting riders it seems to me that you are happy for exciting riders just so long as they ride for Mildenhall cos if they belong to the visiting team they get........... woe be tied

Ament to that.!!!!!! Just hope there aren't any scouts out in oz preparing to supply another Heeps

The only way that could happen is if Cameron's mother or father or both produced a birth cert. stating they are british. (Branfords mum is from Yorkshire). If that hasn't happened and Ipswich win the title on the back of Cameron having a good season then I would say that it is a pretty poor affair if Ipswich are prepared to raise the cup and take the acollade then they have to live with themselves. Let all teams have whoever they want, I say, then everyone is on a level playing field instead of what appears to have been implied here which is backroom dealings.

I supose the thing is the way he came in was always going to raise an eyebrow or 2 as Branford and Morris didn't seem to have the same 'issues' and Alex Davies did. Lets hope a new controversy raises it's ugly head and this one will become tomorrows chip paper . Maybe they should revert to the old rule where patriality allowed you into the NL on 6 points. It would save all this

It was made toungue in cheek. Of course there are others.

I wouldn't say shame on you. Stoke for example wouldn't be able to track such a team as the supporters would vote with their feet having not long dropped down from PL. Then the NL would be down to 8 teams. All teams need to consider their supporters and their aims and cut their cloth accordingly. Doesn't look like Scunny are leaving many new riders for anyone else anyway. I still say best of luck for 2012 though

At the rate we are going Wrathall will be @ 1 but joking aside I hope this project works well for Scunthorpe.

I do think Paranby is overplaying the pessimism in the SS. I'm sure he knows what he is doing but I imagine all riders in the team wil go out to do their best I just hope if they read that that it doesn't affect their confidence unduely.

Lewis Kerr has already been announced as a Y S

Can't fault your enthusiasm but who did he ride for in the ML? I cant recall seeing him. I am a little purplexed as the ML only have 6 heats and Tom appears to have ridden in all but 1 of them in all meetings or is it a different ML you are talking about but I only know of 1

They have treid to keep the team under 25 for the past couple of seasons

Brandon Freemantle has done well this year and he ahs been able to just get on with it. I think the best thing to do with these lads who have no previous NL experience is to do just that just let them ride and not big them up too much because then they start to feel the pressure.