Peterborough Panthers 2023

[Crump99]

36 minutes ago, Purplepanthernotred said:

For the record and having spoken to MT, he’s still involved and attention has now shifted more towards getting all the new plans turned down for the showground. And in my opinion that is more important than what’s happening at the moment team wise. 
 

Buster is the one who owns Peterborough so it’s down to him to sort out the rider situation not Tomalin. He has also invested a lot of money into the team already so this attitude of busters that’s supposedly been heard as ‘we can run r/r and guests all season if needs be is ridiculous. Why should tomalin be the one that forks out more money to obtain another rider??? It’s busters job as owner 

Agreed and a great strategy if true. We may go down in the end but it's not a done deal, there is hope (and questions to answer) and the club needs high profile people like Michael Tomalin, Bratters, Councillor Julie Stevenson etc in their corner. Developers want a smooth ride and thankfully people are waking up to the detail of their application and the PCC planning document and process to ensure that all are held to account.

[Sir Sidney]

3 minutes ago, Crump99 said:

Agreed and a great strategy if true. We may go down in the end but it's not a done deal, there is hope (and questions to answer) and the club needs high profile people like Michael Tomalin, Bratters, Councillor Julie Stevenson etc in their corner. Developers want a smooth ride and thankfully people are waking up to the detail of their application and the PCC planning document and process to ensure that all are held to account.

I'm glad to hear that the Panthers will be seeking to make sure the requirements of the Local Plan are enforced.

I do believe it would be beneficial for the Club to make a statement to that effect, so that all supporters know what is happening. There is a danger otherwise that supporters will just drift away, and the Club will not be able to say it is a viable option.

On a wider point it demonstrates that the BSPL and all clubs should be working with local Councils to make sure that the Local Plan includes protection against venues being lost to development without a suitable replacement

[Crump99]

1 hour ago, Flappy said:

Agreed but Buster 100% said he'd rather run guests and R/R all year that shouldn't be accepted as supporters either. 

The way the club is being ran currently is poor and whilst the future of the club is the priority letting a whole season drift is stupid also. 

It's been poor since he took over to be honest. I never got the feeling that it was more than sustainable speedway without ambition and speculation but to make up the numbers. I hear what Bratters says about it being more about mitigating financial losses but most clubs seem to manage and still offer hope with the objective (probably misplaced given the reality) of success. Given that the club is fighting for it's future then the last thing that it needs is another crap season sucking the life out of it. The buck stops with the owner I'm afraid, irrespective of what other members of the management team or sponsors say.

[Crump99]

18 minutes ago, Sir Sidney said:

I'm glad to hear that the Panthers will be seeking to make sure the requirements of the Local Plan are enforced.

I do believe it would be beneficial for the Club to make a statement to that effect, so that all supporters know what is happening. There is a danger otherwise that supporters will just drift away, and the Club will not be able to say it is a viable option.

On a wider point it demonstrates that the BSPL and all clubs should be working with local Councils to make sure that the Local Plan includes protection against venues being lost to development without a suitable replacement

I'm not too fussed by a further statement to be honest because they've covered it already IMO (open wording highlighted):

"In terms of the future, as things stand at present, very sadly this will be our last year. We have a contract with the Showground until the end of October, and at this stage it is highly unlikely that this will be renewed.

"We will continue working hard to secure a replacement for Nicki and fighting for the continuation of speedway in Peterborough, but this is the truth of how things stand today."

More detail would be nice but not at the expense of showing our hand and then disappointing in the final outcome.
 

Edited April 21, 2023 by Crump99

[arnieg]

5 hours ago, Bagpuss said:

Shouldnt have been allowed last year either. Farcical. Guests are ruining speedway, teams have no identity any more with too much doubling up and random guests all over the place. And we are being asked to pay £20+ to watch.

The difference is that Kennett was (or at least CLAIMED to be) injured. Nicki is so incapacitated he could only manage an 18 point maximum in the Polish Ekstraliga.

 

Edited April 21, 2023 by arnieg

[Sir Sidney]

30 minutes ago, Crump99 said:

I'm not too fussed by a further statement to be honest because they've covered it already IMO (open wording highlighted):

"In terms of the future, as things stand at present, very sadly this will be our last year. We have a contract with the Showground until the end of October, and at this stage it is highly unlikely that this will be renewed.

"We will continue working hard to secure a replacement for Nicki and fighting for the continuation of speedway in Peterborough, but this is the truth of how things stand today."

More detail would be nice but not at the expense of showing our hand and then disappointing in the final outcome.
 

So, for those who read this Forum, there will be some knowledge now about what is included in the Local Plan. 

Is that more widely known in the Panthers fan base?

It's still my view that a more nuanced communication could be released,  but I accept you see it differently 

[Crump99]

5 hours ago, Sir Sidney said:

So, for those who read this Forum, there will be some knowledge now about what is included in the Local Plan. 

Is that more widely known in the Panthers fan base?

It's still my view that a more nuanced communication could be released,  but I accept you see it differently 

Hopefully it will all filter down and the interest and resistance will grow now that the cat finally seems to be out of the bag. As long as those mentioned keep at it, and others hopefully join the fray, then those communications will naturally follow. Bratter's interview was really only the starting gun that woke everyone up to the reality of the situation so it's important not to get ahead of ourselves.

Edited April 21, 2023 by Crump99

[LisaColette]

3 hours ago, foreverblue said:

Cant remember possibly I dont know. Cant see  it being related to what happened at Kings Lynn. In my biased opinion Chris Holder is a nice guy and he rightly feels let down by Peterbough so not surprised by his comments. I am also not surprised Kings Lynn felt let down and Buster not wanting him in the Peterborough team  

Buster needs to get over himself and just be civil. No one likes everyone they work with, it's life. It must be emotionally draining to be that bitter about someone.

[IainB]

1 hour ago, hans fan said:

If a restaurant serves up substandard food  you don’t eat there again 

if a branded clothing retail store sells clothes what fall to bits you don’t buy again 

but you seem to think that the paying speedway supporter should put up with the 5h1te team put together this season.last season was bad enough with the over the hill team and pea poor racing.The track this season is even worse 

The answer is serve up a decent show and people will pay …serve up filth and they won’t part with money in theses financial times 

Sport is different though, it's tribal, it's your team and you should support them through thick and thin (in sickness and in health) it's the team representing all of the history built up through the years and your local community... or at least it should be and it is generally the case with most other sports. Speedway on the other hand decides to throw away this proven tribal instinct built into humans and instead decide to hire a bunch of mercenaries, who rarely stay with their team from one season to the next, can barely say "we" or "us" when referring to the team they ride for, instead electing for "them" and decide to go and ride for other clubs around the country and world during the same season. So yes I can easily see why people "vote with their" feet and stop going.

I am more of a fan of the Sport than any particular team or rider, I do support a team (Leicester) but having had my team taken away from me numerous times through the years, I'm a lover of the sport in general.

Edited April 21, 2023 by iainb

[proud panther]

Get the track right to produce good racing, & the average supporter would accept a few defeats.

[Flappy]

1 hour ago, proud panther said:

Get the track right to produce good racing, & the average supporter would accept a few defeats.

Without doubt providing we're competitive. I'm not prepared to consistently be the whipping boys with zero ambition 

[pleasureboy60]

2 minutes ago, Flappy said:

Without doubt providing we're competitive. I'm not prepared to consistently be the whipping boys with zero ambition 

I agree entirely. For the last couple of seasons since the showground closure was announced. Chapman appears to have given up entirely on the Panthers.  Team building has been disappointing to say the least, but he still expects supporters to pay good money to watch average riders on a poorly prepared track.

The crowds at the showground have been exceptionally good compared to some other premiership teams and I think they deserve to see better quality riders, not a team of leftovers that nobody else seemed to want this season.

[Littleze]

6 hours ago, bigcatdiary said:

Voting with your feet is never the answer, thats the main reason speedway clubs fold.

I would have thought that was obvious to a Rye House fan.

The main reason Speedway clubs fold is due to largely, poor stadia, compared to other sports or activities on offer, no promotion, a near total disregard for their fan base, an amateurish “show” confusing rules, no meaningful competitions, which this leads to very little credibility and therefore exposure in media and the failure to attract sponsorship or investment. The failure to tap in a young audience on social media platforms.

 

AFTV (Arsenal Fan TV) have approx 1.5 million followers on their YouTube channel alone. It was started by 1 man (many since and before have shows/podcasts resulting in exposure, advertising, merchandise resulting from this & expanding revenue streams). AFTV don’t have anything to even sell… no game/no club/no museum/no access to players… the list goes on.

Speedway bosses have a product they could market to the whole world, they could interview riders, ex riders.. referees.. supporters, do bike examinations, show behind the scenes, team manager interviews, merchandise, tickets… do podcasts, show old clips… ANYTHING… what do they do… next to idiot all!

I used to attend Rye, from when my parents took me from 6months old.. we went to Mildenhall, P’boro, Lynn, Milton Keynes regularly. Rye was a great venue, with potential if there was investment for it to be a picturesque stadium and good night out. I’m not sure the track design/set up, like Wolves gave that good racing..

Yet, you’d have these old codgers as track staff, smoking as they came out, some fat bloke as start Marshall with his top barely over his belly, waving to his mates on parade, the contrast being the riders & their bikes pristine. It’s shabby.. scruffy, lazy and embarrassing.. it’s professional sport.. that should apply to staff too. Image and perception is just as important. The latest trend to keep the sagging tapes from hitting the track floor is the ORANGE TRAFFIC CONE!!  Seriously.. it looks rubbish on TV.. well it just looks rubbish. Add in the weather factor and all the other issues people raise. Address the above and you may just get the footfall back. Many well known high street shops disappeared because they didn’t adapt to the modern day market place.. and Speedway could well be that equivalent. That’s my opinion anyway.

[DizzAssStar]

2 hours ago, Flappy said:

 I'm not prepared to consistently be the whipping boys with zero ambition 

Didn't reallise that you are a KL fan ??

[Flappy]

2 minutes ago, DizzAssStar said:

Didn't reallise that you are a KL fan ??

[bigcatdiary]

1 hour ago, Littleze said:

The main reason Speedway clubs fold is due to largely, poor stadia, compared to other sports or activities on offer, no promotion, a near total disregard for their fan base, an amateurish “show” confusing rules, no meaningful competitions, which this leads to very little credibility and therefore exposure in media and the failure to attract sponsorship or investment. The failure to tap in a young audience on social media platforms.

 

AFTV (Arsenal Fan TV) have approx 1.5 million followers on their YouTube channel alone. It was started by 1 man (many since and before have shows/podcasts resulting in exposure, advertising, merchandise resulting from this & expanding revenue streams). AFTV don’t have anything to even sell… no game/no club/no museum/no access to players… the list goes on.

Speedway bosses have a product they could market to the whole world, they could interview riders, ex riders.. referees.. supporters, do bike examinations, show behind the scenes, team manager interviews, merchandise, tickets… do podcasts, show old clips… ANYTHING… what do they do… next to idiot all!

I used to attend Rye, from when my parents took me from 6months old.. we went to Mildenhall, P’boro, Lynn, Milton Keynes regularly. Rye was a great venue, with potential if there was investment for it to be a picturesque stadium and good night out. I’m not sure the track design/set up, like Wolves gave that good racing..

Yet, you’d have these old codgers as track staff, smoking as they came out, some fat bloke as start Marshall with his top barely over his belly, waving to his mates on parade, the contrast being the riders & their bikes pristine. It’s shabby.. scruffy, lazy and embarrassing.. it’s professional sport.. that should apply to staff too. Image and perception is just as important. The latest trend to keep the sagging tapes from hitting the track floor is the ORANGE TRAFFIC CONE!!  Seriously.. it looks rubbish on TV.. well it just looks rubbish. Add in the weather factor and all the other issues people raise. Address the above and you may just get the footfall back. Many well known high street shops disappeared because they didn’t adapt to the modern day market place.. and Speedway could well be that equivalent. That’s my opinion anyway.

Pretty much most of the clubs in this country are staged in old run down stadiums with very little facilities for supporters like seats or shelter from the elements some of which have been staging speedway for decades but they continue to run because they clearly get attendances which covers the costs for whatever the league they are in.

Your point about the lack of young fans is however a good one, few tracks offer cheap admission for children under the age of 11.

 

[Daniel Smith]

2 hours ago, pleasureboy60 said:

I agree entirely. For the last couple of seasons since the showground closure was announced. Chapman appears to have given up entirely on the Panthers.  Team building has been disappointing to say the least, but he still expects supporters to pay good money to watch average riders on a poorly prepared track.

The crowds at the showground have been exceptionally good compared to some other premiership teams and I think they deserve to see better quality riders, not a team of leftovers that nobody else seemed to want this season.

Last couple of season has nothing to do with closures. Buster (Allitt??) has produced teams both at Peterborough & King's Lynn of similar standard. 

You where fortunate to get a freak season to win the title, apart feom that season, our 2 clubs have been team building exactly the same, even switching rider's season on season & using guests. 

It's building a team with minimal financial loses in mind. 

We all wish to have sponsors like Ipswich but there are not the people with the love for the sport like them. 

I know Peterborough fans will say Tomlin was going to put up the money but there's a reason it didn't happen. It's not just down to Buster. 

[Littleze]

39 minutes ago, bigcatdiary said:

Pretty much most of the clubs in this country are staged in old run down stadiums with very little facilities for supporters like seats or shelter from the elements some of which have been staging speedway for decades but they continue to run because they clearly get attendances which covers the costs for whatever the league they are in.

Your point about the lack of young fans is however a good one, few tracks offer cheap admission for children under the age of 11.

 

My 1st point about Stadia, is still a good and very valid point.. they may well cover the costs, or they may not.. but the point is & you have essentially agreed is that they are old, uncomfortable often dirty and not suitable for the modern day sporting experience.. I’m not saying that is a club or owners fault, but it’s a negative to go with the many other negatives, many of which they can control. They don’t even have to come up with idea.. it’s been done for them. 
Football referees… same kit, varying colours, bright, modern. Why can’t clubs strike a Sponsorship deal with someone who provides say Black, all in one overalls. They have their name on the front.. advertising space can be on the back of the overalls for any other companies who wish to Sponsor. So, all leagues/Tracks and track staff have a standardised “uniform” which speaks of cohesion & adds a small level of professionalism to the show. Get some younger track staff, not blokes of 40+
Have walk out with riders (possibly their heroes) at parade, as they do in football. It’s hardly groundbreaking, costs idiot all.. the kids will probably love it & want to go back.

 

 

[mikebv]

24 minutes ago, Littleze said:

My 1st point about Stadia, is still a good and very valid point.. they may well cover the costs, or they may not.. but the point is & you have essentially agreed is that they are old, uncomfortable often dirty and not suitable for the modern day sporting experience.. I’m not saying that is a club or owners fault, but it’s a negative to go with the many other negatives, many of which they can control. They don’t even have to come up with idea.. it’s been done for them. 
Football referees… same kit, varying colours, bright, modern. Why can’t clubs strike a Sponsorship deal with someone who provides say Black, all in one overalls. They have their name on the front.. advertising space can be on the back of the overalls for any other companies who wish to Sponsor. So, all leagues/Tracks and track staff have a standardised “uniform” which speaks of cohesion & adds a small level of professionalism to the show. Get some younger track staff, not blokes of 40+
Have walk out with riders (possibly their heroes) at parade, as they do in football. It’s hardly groundbreaking, costs idiot all.. the kids will probably love it & want to go back.

 

 

There are truly dozens of ways to "get the message out there" to "ver kidz" but it appears not many want to do it...

For example. My lads old grassroots football team had teams from U8 to U16 and several teama at many of  the age groups...

Just in Stockport where I live alone there must have been well over 2000 kids playing football each Saturday and Sunday morning, for several hundred teams..

A perfect time for clubs to appear with riders and bikes on parks and set themselves up on those parks that can have up to 10 matches going on at any given time, handing out car stickers, free tickets etc..

Loads of kids and loads of parents on hand, and the same happens every afternoon as well as morning...

Each season the local kids leagues also run a trophy giving day where each age Group gets trophies. 

The younger ones all get one (there are no losers here), and the winners and runners up get trophies in the older leagues.. 

It would cost clubs very little to sponsor any of their local sporting leagues and their trophy giving day,, and get the league called after them..

Much, much less than they would be paying their heat leaders for just one match I would say..

In this modern era, if you have a decent smart phone, you have the chance to advertise yourself to millions...

Lots of ways of getting others to hear about you if you had the inclination.. 

And it needn't cost the earth.

 

[LagutaRacingFan]

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