Should Laguta and Emil be kicked out of the GP Series?

[Star Lady 5,400]

1 hour ago, Technik said:

After reading this statement from the IOC I don't think the FIM have any option but to exclude Sayfutinov & Laguta & all other Russians from any of their events. I would also assume they will issue a directive to all member federations to exclude any competitor or official from any events within their territory.

I understand this is a tough call on the riders but it is my opinion that we are in a forced position that we must treat all Russian nationals in the same manner. Of course there are good & bad in all aspects of life & I bere no ill will to those mentioned but we must stand united against the actions of Mr Putin.

I assume Sayfutinov and Laguna hold dual citizenship so technically are still Russian, if only 50%.

[topaz325 1,856]

I think it’s only a matter of time until Emil and Artem and other Russian riders will not be allowed to take part....Chugenov ?

[severnsider 197]

32 minutes ago, topaz325 said:

I think it’s only a matter of time until Emil and Artem and other Russian riders will not be allowed to take part....Chugenov ?

Chugunov has Polish passport and citizenship. That is why he could ride as junior in 2020 for Wrocław 

[topaz325 1,856]

2 minutes ago, severnsider said:

Chugunov has Polish passport and citizenship. That is why he could ride as junior in 2020 for Wrocław 

Yes  I know 

[hammer1969 421]

4 hours ago, HenryW said:

So, how are you defining Russians in this case? Anyone born in Russia? Anyone who has ever held Russian citizenship?

Would you exclude Alexandr Loktaev from competing? He is Russian born but has had Ukrainian citizenship for at least the last 11 years and races as a Ukrainian in all international events.

He's currently in Ukraine and cannot leave because no military age Ukrainian male is allowed to leave the Country. He's still originally Russian, though, and just races under a different flag...So would you ban him? 

Fortunately I do not have to sort out all the ifs and buts in these awful times the Ukranian, and many Russian ordinary citizens find themselves in.  Loktaev, although born in Russia, in the searches I have done is listed as Ukranian nationality, so I'll leave it to the people who issue the entry Visas to sort that one out.

[MattB 177]

It's a horrific situation, and both Laguta and Sayfutdinov are not to blame for whats going on in Ukraine at the moment

I don't this is a situation where you can go in half-soaked.  If all sport governing bodies are blocking Russians from competing in international sport, then speedway must follow suite.

[Triple.H. 1,986]

All 3 should be banned from riding outside Russia. The only reason they have Polish passports/citizenship is to make it far easier to ride for Polish clubs. The clincher is which national federation do they represent.

[enotian 562]

the point of any ban is to communicate to the World and Russian public that the actions of the Kremlin are not acceptable.

if you then allow those athletes to participate just without a flag and anthem then that message is weak.

again i'm short on detail but at the 1980 Moscow Olympics my understanding it Great Britain boycotted the event but athletes competed under the banner of the British Olympic Committee or some such moniker. But I'm certain Wells and Goodheugh were cheered on as Brits even though they weren't officially representing Great Britain. Not sure about flags and anthems when they won but essentially there was no boycott.

if the message is to be clear then the ban has to be absolute no matter how unfortunate that is for innocent competitors or how ineffectual it might be. even FIFA seem to have finally tumbled to that. 

[WembleyLion 413]

Nothing good comes out of this awful situation.

I also wonder just how safe it might be for Emil and Artem.

Let’s all hope and pray for a swift end to this horrific situation.

Edited February 28, 2022 by WembleyLion

[Humphrey Appleby 13,955]

3 hours ago, Triple.H. said:

All 3 should be banned from riding outside Russia. The only reason they have Polish passports/citizenship is to make it far easier to ride for Polish clubs. The clincher is which national federation do they represent.

No, it comes down to their passport(s) for individual purposes.

[Humphrey Appleby 13,955]

4 hours ago, hammer1969 said:

Fortunately I do not have to sort out all the ifs and buts in these awful times the Ukranian, and many Russian ordinary citizens find themselves in.  Loktaev, although born in Russia, in the searches I have done is listed as Ukranian nationality, so I'll leave it to the people who issue the entry Visas to sort that one out.

There are many Russians with Ukrainian parentage, or born in the Ukraine, and vice-versa. The two countries were intertwined for decades if not centuries, in the same way that Britain and Ireland have been. 

That's the particular tragedy of the situation - brethren are fighting brethren in many cases.

Whilst there clearly have to be sanctions against Russians representing Russia in sport, I honestly haven't come across a single expat Russian so far who supports the invasion. Should my Russian workmate who I sit opposite when I'm in the office really not be allowed to work, and by extension how are individuals in professional sport different to that?

Edited February 28, 2022 by Humphrey Appleby

[Technik 491]

11 hours ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

The IOC seems to be saying they can still compete as independent athletes, just not under any Russian banner. The Paralympics is coming up shortly, so the matter is pressing. 

The relevant text is...

"Russian or Belarusian nationals, be it as individuals or teams, should be accepted only as neutral athletes or neutral teams. No national symbols, colours, flags or anthems should be displayed."

It most certainly doe's not say anything of the sort within the IOC statement. Post's like yours are the type that cause the arguements. none of the points made in your post appear in the linked statement that was posted by Grachan.

[Humphrey Appleby 13,955]

40 minutes ago, Technik said:

It most certainly doe's not say anything of the sort within the IOC statement. Post's like yours are the type that cause the arguements. none of the points made in your post appear in the linked statement that was posted by Grachan.

The statement as issued by the IOC Executive Board says exactly that, if you could be bothered to go and read it on the IOC website which is surely the authoritative source. I quoted part of that statement verbatim, so not sure what the confusion is on your part, but you can read it for yourself here...

https://olympics.com/ioc/news/ioc-eb-recommends-no-participation-of-russian-and-belarusian-athletes-and-officials 

No, the link that Grachan posted did not say that, because it was an article in the Gulf Times that left out the important detail. 

[Triple.H. 1,986]

9 hours ago, Humphrey Appleby said:

No, it comes down to their passport(s) for individual purposes.

But they have 2 passports, maybe more. So they can pick and choose their nationality on a whim

[OveFundinFan 4,142]

whilst determining whether Emil and Artem should or should not ride in the GPs, this morning's tv news has just shown a 40-mile long column of Russian tanks, armored vehicles, supply trucks just 20 miles north of Kyiv........ in the next few days there could be absolute destruction and mass killings by Russian troops. Any thought going towards those people in Kyiv and the surrounding area?.  It is ok I suppose, give it 5 years, and Putin and his gang will stand before a court in the Hague, that will make it ok.       

Enjoy your discussion.