Tsunami 10,219 Posted February 4, 2017 Ah yes the famous winter of discontent. The time when the most fans agree that the sport took a massive turn for the worse. Proven by the current situation the sport finds itself in, yet you think it should be all forgotten. Well I've got news for you , it won't be. Started by Sandhu along with the mislead Rick and Julie, and aided and abetted by Trump(the other one) You forgot to get the facts right, so no you won't forget it. Given Buster Chapman's remarkable interventions at Leicester and Coventry I doubt very much that his role was negative. It would be very wrong if Chapman went into this with any form of prejudice against a potential promotion simply because they were friends with David Gordon. Lets face it, Tony Rice is the calibre of businessman that makes those in charge of all the other tracks across the country look distinctly small time (one internet report said his salary at Cable & Wireless was £700k per annum) and it would have been a true disaster if his takeover bid had been endangered because of such an attitude. No, thats not what i said, HT. In his role of Chairman of the BSPA he would be able to assess the situation, as to whether the new promotion were in fact fit and proper to take on the role. Standard procedure, which I had to go through myself. In an interview you have to convince the BSPA that you a fit and proper person. No good Buster being involved, watching what was going on, and knowing if they new owners were not fit and proper for what they were taking on. He wouldn't start from a negative position, but would start as a neutral. Dead right Maybe they didn't fund it, but it almost certainly would not have been built but for the efforts of David Gordon and Chris Morton - and this was in the face of scepticism, cynicism and downright derision from other promoters and fans across the country. To be fair HT, Promoters, and many fans on here, knew the potential, but were probably staggered at the payback period being reduced from about 55 years to 25. They would know it was just not possible, and a massive gamble that was likely to be doomed from the start. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikebv 10,342 Posted February 4, 2017 Why would some clubs not sell British Final tickets? I had no idea this had happened.What reason could possibly justify this.p Incredible if true....! THE flagship event of the British Speedway Season and it is suggested that some tracks didn't actively promote it at their own venues...? Wow... No wonder the sport is 'Donald Ducked' in this Country when personal individual feelings are allowed to take precedent over the greater good... No Independant CEO so what do you expect though? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fundin5 18 Posted February 4, 2017 Danny Smith, on 04 Feb 2017 - 11:03 AM, said: Tony Rice looks like a man with his hands in a lot of pies and certainly not short of capital. Robin Southwell isn't short of a bob or two either. Looks like the perfect match to take the Belle Vue project forward without any threats to it's future at all Only positives can come out of this and this pair will certainly rattle Ford's cage. Belle Vue are back Well done Buster in getting shot of the previous pair of calamity morons Whilst I may have some issues with what went on last season, you have to give Gordon and Morton some respect for finally delivering the NSS. Although I honestly believe that what went wrong was not entirely their fault. We will probably never get the complete truth as to the goings on, however, we now have to forget the past and concentrate on the present and, more importantly, help make sure the Aces (and all other teams) never have to go through a period of uncertainty again. Yeh BV are back mate, As for rattling Matts cage, im not sure that will happen, but I think you are a little wide of the mark in calling the others morons. Starman -Your totally correct in Gordon and Morton being wrongly labelled morons. Now another thought. Buster appears to have done the best possible in ensuring all the declared starters finally come to the 2017 starting tapes. However, as much as I admire his efforts over the closed season, I still firmly believe, as I have done for the past 30 years, that speedway needs someone at the top who has not got any vested interest in the sport. Whether the promoters would accept an arrangement like this is doubtful in my eyes. John Berry tried in the mid 80's and was out within a very short period of time. OK, JB had the ability to rattle cages, but he was a very astute promoter. Nobody, me included, likes to be told what to do in certain circumstances, but sometimes you have to bite the bullet, even if you don't like it. Mike Parker appeared on the scene in 1959 and shook up the establishment (National League). The outcome in 1965 gave speedway stability, even though some promoters had reservations and it prospered. For the good of speedway, they bit the bullet and worked together. Understandably, a promoter, quite rightly, who puts his money in will not like an outside interference, but even though they probably know what is wrong, they don't go the whole hog to sort it out. Instead they tinker with small issues and incur the wrath of us; the supporters. What do you think Starman Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KevH 257 Posted February 4, 2017 What do you think Starman He doesn't.......ever!!! 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hamish McRaker 601 Posted February 4, 2017 Who is responsible for payment to riders? Club owners, or Promoters? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KevH 257 Posted February 4, 2017 Who is responsible for payment to riders? Club owners, or Promoters? Ultimately the owner.......the rider signs a contract with the club, therefore the owner of the club is the signatory on the contract by default. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hamish McRaker 601 Posted February 4, 2017 Ultimately the owner.......the rider signs a contract with the club, therefore the owner of the club is the signatory on the contract by default. OK - so presumably the owner also pays the bond money to the BSPA? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KevH 257 Posted February 5, 2017 OK - so presumably the owner also pays the bond money to the BSPA? Yes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
woodenspoon 157 Posted February 5, 2017 It appears to me that a lot more is to be revealed about the happenings at Belle Vue 2016. The Forum seems to be split between the members who think that Gordon and Morton are totally blameless, and others suggesting the total opposite. Interestingly the British Final venue for 2017 has yet to be declared. The big problem with calling the Stadium the NSS, is that it works fine in football where all the clubs are quite happy to have all the big matches played there, whereas Speedway promoters like them shared out amongst them all. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hyderd 1,216 Posted February 5, 2017 It appears to me that a lot more is to be revealed about the happenings at Belle Vue 2016. The Forum seems to be split between the members who think that Gordon and Morton are totally blameless, and others suggesting the total opposite. Interestingly the British Final venue for 2017 has yet to be declared. The big problem with calling the Stadium the NSS, is that it works fine in football where all the clubs are quite happy to have all the big matches played there, whereas Speedway promoters like them shared out amongst them all. That's understandable, however the same promoters should remember that without the fans their would be no speedway, so if they want big events they should ensure that the racing provided encourages fans to turn up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hamish McRaker 601 Posted February 5, 2017 Yes.Well there you go - after about 50 years I'm starting to get the hang of it! Sounds like promoters can clear off without incurring too many liabilities, certainly compared with the liabilities potentially incurred by club owners, who sound as though they are highly reliant on promoters to be responsible and do their job properly - and vice-versa. Surprised there isn't a club owners' equivalent of BSPA, unless there is already. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
proud panther 1,507 Posted February 5, 2017 If the British final is at Belle Vue, I will make every effort to attend, because there is a very good chance the racing will be top notch. Don't think it will be as good as the World cup though, as that was something special. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Aces51 2,778 Posted February 5, 2017 It appears to me that a lot more is to be revealed about the happenings at Belle Vue 2016. The Forum seems to be split between the members who think that Gordon and Morton are totally blameless, and others suggesting the total opposite. Interestingly the British Final venue for 2017 has yet to be declared. The big problem with calling the Stadium the NSS, is that it works fine in football where all the clubs are quite happy to have all the big matches played there, whereas Speedway promoters like them shared out amongst them all. I don't think it is as black and white or polarised as you suggest. I don't think that many of those who feel some sympathy and gratitude to Gordon and Morton for getting the stadium built would claim they are entirely blameless, in fact haven't they themselves said that mistakes were made. Equally, I think that many of those who condemned them at the time of the opening meeting and when their licences were withdrawn can now accept that at least some of their problems were made much worse by the failure by others to ensure that the terracing on the back straight was built and the construction problems on the 3rd and 4th bends. What I do find appalling, if true, is that other promoters were working against them as early as when the British Final tickets went on sale in April or May and that, so far as we know, the BSPA did nothing about it. Why try to harm another promotion, how does that sort of attitude help the sport? It certainly fuels suspicions many Belle Vue fans had about the attitude of some members of the BSPA after the it was nothing to do with us, it was all Belle Vue's fault and has done great damage to the sport, press release made immediately following the disasterous opening meeting and before any investigation and before all the facts were known. Yes, the full story of what really happened last year needs to be told, whether it will is another matter. However, the main thing now is to get the new promotion in place and for those who feel threatened by the NSS to realise that this showpiece stadium and brilliant race track are vital to the success of the sport nationwide. Let's also hope that Swindon can soon join the NSS as 21st century stadiums and templates for what is needed for the sport we all love to move forward and grow. 7 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skidder1 7,658 Posted February 5, 2017 So with the MCC funding the NSS project, does that actually mean the people of Manchester ie the residents/rate payers actually paid for it and own it? If so I didn't realise that rents and rates were so high?! OR did MCC manage to acquire funding from Europe and/or the Saudis to make it happen?! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
arnieg 3,662 Posted February 5, 2017 The original papers make it fairly clear what the funding process was. Step 1: council borrows money (from Public works Loan Board or on open market) Step 2: stadium built (give or take a third bend/back straight stand) Step 3: council pays interest on borrowings which it finances from rental income for stadium hence the rent being so high. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
