ch958 2,395 Posted September 28, 2018 22 minutes ago, PHILIPRISING said: NO one is more frustrated with the state of British speedway than me but, frankly, the cards currently held by the BSPA are not great. Tracks like Poole, King's Lynn, Wolves, Somerset want to at the very least maintain their team strengths ... not dumb down to the level of some CL teams who understandably cannot afford to go in the opposite direction. That doesn't mean that British promoters cannot address many of the problems afflicting the sport here but sadly there isn't a one-fit solution. I'm sorry but the tracks you mention can not form a league therefore they fall in with everyone else or nothing. The tail has to stop wagging the dog. All of the clubs mentioned ran successfully atD2 level in the past, they can do it again - especially if they're top dogs, which they probably will be. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dontforgetthefueltapsbruv 10,706 Posted September 28, 2018 25 minutes ago, foamfence said: How about a handicap system, sign who you like but if a team has a 50 point average and their opponents have 40, the opponents get 10 points added to their final score? Sounds simple but I dont think in reality it works out that way If the 2 teams 1-7 were all separated by around 1.5 points that would cause much more than a 10 point swing in the final score In the majority of races the higher averaged rider would beat their equivalent opposition and the overall score more likely to be 60-30 than 50-40 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
foamfence 2,917 Posted September 28, 2018 5 minutes ago, dontforgetthefueltapsbruv said: Sounds simple but I dont think in reality it works out that way If the 2 teams 1-7 were all separated by around 1.5 points that would cause much more than a 10 point swing in the final score In the majority of races the higher averaged rider would beat their equivalent opposition and the overall score more likely to be 60-30 than 50-40 Possibly so but we need a competition where all clubs can assemble a team within their financial capabilities. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spl77 337 Posted September 28, 2018 37 minutes ago, foamfence said: How about a handicap system, sign who you like but if a team has a 50 point average and their opponents have 40, the opponents get 10 points added to their final score? That's far worse than the farce of double points and would finish the sport for sure. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
foamfence 2,917 Posted September 28, 2018 9 minutes ago, Spl77 said: That's far worse than the farce of double points and would finish the sport for sure. Well it's slowly finishing itself anyway and if the richer clubs won't compromise, there'll be more of the same. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikebv 10,277 Posted September 29, 2018 For too long the Sport has had 'The Survival Of The Weakest' as it's mantra... Charles Darwin had a theory about how that would never work if you want to evolve and grow, and get bigger and stronger..... British Speedway obviously had a theory that his theory was bollox..... This year a rider has had a season ending injury which effected the 'Flagship Competition' when riding for his 'other team' in the Lower League.. This year a team qualified for the play offs by using a No1 from one of their play off rivals to oust their nearest competitor, because their No1 was riding in the Lower League for a team he joined just a few weeks earlier.. This year several fixtures were pulled without consultation because so many teams racing on the same night would mean not enough guests would be available... Just think about that one for a moment... Basically, it means guests are now a fundamental key priority in the operating model. No longer an occasional 'necessary evil' as they may have been regarded as in the past... UK Speedway obviously now admits it cannot do without them and builds it's whole operating model around their use. Putting their need well above the impact to fans who may have made plans to attend the initial fixture dates.. So, is it. Not enough riders? Or too many teams? Either one or the other has to give.. The Sport will never get that (so vital to its success), Mainstream Media coverage if it keeps running itself in the same nonsense manner. As the MM will never take it seriously, and sponsors, of the size required, will never want to be associated with it... Change has to come for the greater good, sad for those who may lose their teams, but currently British Speedway is on a clear race to the bottom... A race all may end up 'winning' collectively in a 'dead heat'... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waytogo28 2,054 Posted September 29, 2018 30 minutes ago, mikebv said: Change has to come for the greater good, sad for those who may lose their teams, but currently British Speedway is on a clear race to the bottom... A race all may end up 'winning' collectively in a 'dead heat'... If as we hear, there is to be very little change in the league structure of UK speedway in 2019, this is the likely outcome. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waytogo28 2,054 Posted September 29, 2018 12 hours ago, ch958 said: Tracks like Poole, King's Lynn, Wolves, Somerset want to at the very least maintain their team strengths The other way is to let them go and set up and run teams in the Swedish way ( full of Superstars ) in a league of four teams only one will fail to get a medal every year, so success or near success is theirs from the start. I genuinely don't believe that they will get the 4,000 or so paying spectators for every match to pay for it. Let them bankrupt themselves giving it a go. And let the other tracks run one big league on a much more realistic, UK contracted only riders level and see which one is the more successful setup. There seems to be no one league setup which will suit all. Better to crash those four clubs ( by their own choice ) than destroy the whole sport here. 2 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PHILIPRISING 7,298 Posted September 29, 2018 2 hours ago, waytogo28 said: The other way is to let them go and set up and run teams in the Swedish way ( full of Superstars ) in a league of four teams only one will fail to get a medal every year, so success or near success is theirs from the start. I genuinely don't believe that they will get the 4,000 or so paying spectators for every match to pay for it. Let them bankrupt themselves giving it a go. And let the other tracks run one big league on a much more realistic, UK contracted only riders level and see which one is the more successful setup. There seems to be no one league setup which will suit all. Better to crash those four clubs ( by their own choice ) than destroy the whole sport here. WHAT makes you think it is only four clubs? Or that they want to run teams full of superstars. You are right that they won't get a crowd of 4,000 but these days anything around the 1800/2000 mark is considered good. Why would Somerset want to lose Doyle, Kings'Lynn either or both of Lambert and Iversen, Belle Vue release Cook or Fricke? Why wouldn't Wolverhampton want to try and get either Lindgren or Woffinden back. Poole might fancy a rejuvenated Holder. Just questions, not solutions ... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waytogo28 2,054 Posted September 29, 2018 52 minutes ago, PHILIPRISING said: WHAT makes you think it is only four clubs? Or that they want to run teams full of superstars. You are right that they won't get a crowd of 4,000 but these days anything around the 1800/2000 mark is considered good. Why would Somerset want to lose Doyle, Kings'Lynn either or both of Lambert and Iversen, Belle Vue release Cook or Fricke? Why wouldn't Wolverhampton want to try and get either Lindgren or Woffinden back. Poole might fancy a rejuvenated Holder. Just questions, not solutions ... The other question is if there are only four or five clubs that want to go along this route they should not crush other clubs who might have dreams to copy them but no cash. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fromafar 10,363 Posted September 29, 2018 1 hour ago, PHILIPRISING said: WHAT makes you think it is only four clubs? Or that they want to run teams full of superstars. You are right that they won't get a crowd of 4,000 but these days anything around the 1800/2000 mark is considered good. Why would Somerset want to lose Doyle, Kings'Lynn either or both of Lambert and Iversen, Belle Vue release Cook or Fricke? Why wouldn't Wolverhampton want to try and get either Lindgren or Woffinden back. Poole might fancy a rejuvenated Holder. Just questions, not solutions ... Financially on only Glasgow could compete with the " big boys" any other Teams would just be making up the numbers and whipping boys IMO .(take Leicester as an example of recent seasons).Personaly I think 1 League split North and South.just my opinion sure it won't happen though.If Teams you mention have to weaken to compete in lower division they would not survive on current rider demands as I can't see crowd levels increasing. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PHILIPRISING 7,298 Posted September 29, 2018 19 minutes ago, waytogo28 said: The other question is if there are only four or five clubs that want to go along this route they should not crush other clubs who might have dreams to copy them but no cash. BUT there are more than four or five ... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
foamfence 2,917 Posted September 29, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, PHILIPRISING said: WHAT makes you think it is only four clubs? Or that they want to run teams full of superstars. You are right that they won't get a crowd of 4,000 but these days anything around the 1800/2000 mark is considered good. Why would Somerset want to lose Doyle, Kings'Lynn either or both of Lambert and Iversen, Belle Vue release Cook or Fricke? Why wouldn't Wolverhampton want to try and get either Lindgren or Woffinden back. Poole might fancy a rejuvenated Holder. Just questions, not solutions ... On the other hand, why would Woffinden want to ride at Wolves? He claimed that he has more accidents on British tracks, then there is the money thing, why ride here for a fraction of what you get there? It's true that some riders like to keep very busy but some of the top names seem quite happy riding elsewhere. With regard to Iversen, I don't think he has done anything like as well as expected. Edited September 29, 2018 by foamfence Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waytogo28 2,054 Posted September 29, 2018 43 minutes ago, PHILIPRISING said: BUT there are more than four or five ... Let's hope that there are more than eight, even ten say - then, Go Ahead. We need at least eight but that does sound a lot like not much change ( if there are to be three leagues in 2019). The six, eight or ten clubs with higher aspirations need to up their marketing methods considerably if they are to pull in the 2,000 average crowd needed to sustain their team costs. Just popping it on social media will not double the crowd at King's Lynn for example. They have been there, done that and it has failed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ruckerroo 792 Posted September 29, 2018 Like it or not there are 3 leagues, what is being mooted will probably put the weak sides in the nl out of business immediately. For me speedway and greyhound racing are along similar lines, mobbed in the 60s to the end of the 90s, in steady decline ever since and only heading one way. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
