Eduds1 48 Posted August 2, 2019 6 hours ago, stevebrum said: The relevance of that is? We are talking about the product on offer now and potentially next season. I’ve already stated that the product on offer doesn’t entice me very much. By the product do you mean the class of rider or the racing . I go to Wolves H&A, Leicester Home some Away, Cradley Home and Stoke Home when not clashing with Leicester the racing in the CL is in the main far better than PL and a reasonable amount of races in the NL are as good if not more exciting than the PL. I have been a Wolves supporter for over 50 years and seen the good, the bad and the ugly but I feel a lot of the opposition to one big league comes from the snobbery of PL fans looking down on the lower leagues. Most PL riders double down to the CL so how would one league be weaker than the 2 we have now. At the moment there is only 1 world class rider in Britain (J Doyle) so the risk of losing GP riders is negligible. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikebv 10,290 Posted August 3, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, Eduds1 said: By the product do you mean the class of rider or the racing . I go to Wolves H&A, Leicester Home some Away, Cradley Home and Stoke Home when not clashing with Leicester the racing in the CL is in the main far better than PL and a reasonable amount of races in the NL are as good if not more exciting than the PL. I have been a Wolves supporter for over 50 years and seen the good, the bad and the ugly but I feel a lot of the opposition to one big league comes from the snobbery of PL fans looking down on the lower leagues. Most PL riders double down to the CL so how would one league be weaker than the 2 we have now. At the moment there is only 1 world class rider in Britain (J Doyle) so the risk of losing GP riders is negligible. I watch the Colts at the NSS and the racing is around 2 - 3 seconds slower than the Premiership.. The racing is great and only by the announcer telling you the times of the heats do you realise the time difference... Stick four lads of a similar ability level on a race track that is conducive to deliver decent racing and you will be entertained... Stick four lads of a similar ability level on a race track that has too tight bends and too long narrow straights, and you invariably will not be as entertained.... And those lads could all be the best four riders in the World providing the low level of entertainment, whilst four 'juniors' could be the four lads providing the great racing.. Even teams, with close racing ran on tracks that allow passing opportunities, has to be the overall objective to deliver 'the good night's racing' that a Speedway promoter should be offering up as his or her minimum aim.. That 'good night's racing' should then get supported by a wider evening of off track entertainment to keep the punters engaged.. Do that well and no one will notice, or even care, that any of the riders on show are not GP stars, or even that many of them are not even international class.... Fans would just go away from the venue pleased with what they had seen and, more than likely ,be willing to return to get more of the same. . Edited August 3, 2019 by mikebv 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trees 2,814 Posted August 3, 2019 Why is the racing good in the NL, do they make lots of mistakes which makes the racing more exciting? Is it because they are still learning lines, bike set ups etc? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
colin wood 249 Posted August 3, 2019 mikebv is spot on with his post.The racing at the NSS in the National league is superb value for money .And no the racing isn't good because of riders mistakes,far from it.You get lots of young riders of similar ability producing great close racing.Regarding race times Jack Smith clocked 61.53 in heat 1 recently which is on a par with many races in the Premier league.You hardly notice slower race times.Doyle v Fricke or Kemp v Flint etc would be exactly the same entertainment. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trees 2,814 Posted August 3, 2019 6 minutes ago, colin wood said: mikebv is spot on with his post.The racing at the NSS in the National league is superb value for money .And no the racing isn't good because of riders mistakes,far from it.You get lots of young riders of similar ability producing great close racing.Regarding race times Jack Smith clocked 61.53 in heat 1 recently which is on a par with many races in the Premier league.You hardly notice slower race times.Doyle v Fricke or Kemp v Flint etc would be exactly the same entertainment. It seems the NSS can't be included in the poor racing category. Are you getting massive crowds in Manchester? 4-5k? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikebv 10,290 Posted August 3, 2019 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Trees said: It seems the NSS can't be included in the poor racing category. Are you getting massive crowds in Manchester? 4-5k? Sadly no, but to be fair the domestic shared events and the international events, do seem to attract more fans (many of which from around the country) at the NSS than would be the case if held anywhere else... Bar maybe Glasgow as they do a great job promoting such occasions.. Sadly it would appear that too many years of 'Mickey Mouse/Guestfest' Speedway has taken a rather large toll on the levels of support the sport now has, by eroding the enthusiasm of many followers to 'buy into' what's on offer as a legitimate sporting contest with real meaning.. Hopefully the NSS can build back some of that support base with such exceptional racing, and the sport can do its bit by making what's on offer a credible sporting experience to help deliver this much needed crowd growth.. Edited August 3, 2019 by mikebv Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Daniel Smith 5,666 Posted August 3, 2019 2 hours ago, mikebv said: Sadly no, but to be fair the domestic shared events and the international events, do seem to attract more fans (many of which from around the country) at the NSS than would be the case if held anywhere else... Bar maybe Glasgow as they do a great job promoting such occasions.. Sadly it would appear that too many years of 'Mickey Mouse/Guestfest' Speedway has taken a rather large toll on the levels of support the sport now has, by eroding the enthusiasm of many followers to 'buy into' what's on offer as a legitimate sporting contest with real meaning.. Hopefully the NSS can build back some of that support base with such exceptional racing, and the sport can do its bit by making what's on offer a credible sporting experience to help deliver this much needed crowd growth.. The part I've highlighted is the very reason I feel one big league would be a bigger disaster to the sport than the 2 main leagues now. Guests will still be needed and due to the lack of rider availability in 1 big league, teams will be riding with gueat riders for far longer. Likely a whole season as rider's struggle to be found. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eduds1 48 Posted August 3, 2019 6 hours ago, Trees said: Why is the racing good in the NL, do they make lots of mistakes which makes the racing more exciting? Is it because they are still learning lines, bike set ups etc? Passing even up to Gp level is generally caused by riders mistakes eg too slick, too grippy wrong set up, wrong lines, over riding. So this can't be a reason for overtaking only in the NL. After the first bend if the rider in front doesn't make a mistake he's going to win. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevebrum 6,823 Posted August 3, 2019 15 hours ago, Eduds1 said: By the product do you mean the class of rider or the racing . I go to Wolves H&A, Leicester Home some Away, Cradley Home and Stoke Home when not clashing with Leicester the racing in the CL is in the main far better than PL and a reasonable amount of races in the NL are as good if not more exciting than the PL. I have been a Wolves supporter for over 50 years and seen the good, the bad and the ugly but I feel a lot of the opposition to one big league comes from the snobbery of PL fans looking down on the lower leagues. Most PL riders double down to the CL so how would one league be weaker than the 2 we have now. At the moment there is only 1 world class rider in Britain (J Doyle) so the risk of losing GP riders is negligible. The product, the standard, the calibre - call it what you will. But I wouldn’t refer to the racing standard as much as the class of riders. The product in the top flight is at its weakest possibly ever. Next season IF a one big league happens the product will again be reduced. Dont get me wrong, I’m a fan of the NL because that’s where you see raw talent start to develop. Yes there are more mistakes, yes there are sometimes riders not a good enough standard but generally the product matches the standard matches the price to attend. The top 2 leagues have become too expensive for a rather lower quality of competitor(s). However give me a top league with all the stars back and ask me to pay £25, I’d be there every week. Does that make me a top flight snob? Possibly. Although watching mostly NL hardly backs that up however. Too be honest it’s just as much the CL fans who have as big an issue with the top flight. So snobbery works both ways. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
craigACE 91 Posted August 3, 2019 i think the prices to watch Speedway are very reasonable. Compared to the other Sports i have recently attended. A few examples, Football way ott. Rugby League at Super League level, 26 quid i think it was at Warrington. 16 to stand at Leigh in the Championship. What we pay at Belle Vue is very fair. I have not been this year but the Colts meetings are a tenner. To watch the real top riders, 25 quid would also be a bargain. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brianbuck 928 Posted August 3, 2019 I know people say that we only get 15 minutes of action for our admission money - but is this so very different from other sports. Take away all the tip-tapping and back passing and the hold-ups in a football match and we probably just about get 15 minutes of genuine action in a 90 minute football match. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
iris123 20,993 Posted August 3, 2019 10 minutes ago, brianbuck said: I know people say that we only get 15 minutes of action for our admission money - but is this so very different from other sports. Take away all the tip-tapping and back passing and the hold-ups in a football match and we probably just about get 15 minutes of genuine action in a 90 minute football match. Rubbish. Plus in ice hockey and lots of other sports the time is stopped when the action stops Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
auntie doris 2,342 Posted August 3, 2019 Average of 60 minutes of football ball-in-play. Paid 17 quid for a seat at Millwall, 18 quid to stand at Swindon's Abbey. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DC2 11,150 Posted August 3, 2019 6 minutes ago, auntie doris said: Average of 60 minutes of football ball-in-play. Paid 17 quid for a seat at Millwall, 18 quid to stand at Swindon's Abbey. Hmmmm ... Millwall 1 Preston 0. Scintillating. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
auntie doris 2,342 Posted August 3, 2019 15 minutes ago, DC2 said: Hmmmm ... Millwall 1 Preston 0. Scintillating. I went to Millwall 3 Ipswich 0 in October Share this post Link to post Share on other sites