mikebv

Is that because they get 5% added to their score when guesting for someone at home?..

With Hans Christian Andersen as company rather than the Speedway rider...

It was the top league that I was basing my figures on not the 2nd Division, hence the 1200 crowd level requirement, and the average pound per point guesstimate. And on your numbers it looks like it could be more £100 a point on average in the top tier? Which lowers their spend.. Your figures which I am sure will be accurate, mean circa £60 average per point in the 2nd Division which means less than just £6k needs taking in to pay for two matches.. Wow, what a state the sport is in when at around £17 to watch a 2nd level match, it still struggles.. 'Happiness' used to be 40-38. Nowadays 'Happiness' would appear to be winning every match at home 46-44 in a last heat decider, and losing away 75-15... The positive for the sport is that at quite a few tracks, crowds during the pandemic have reached the restricted figure allowed (some being 600 or so in the 2nd Div), so maybe now the restrictions are lifted the crowd levels could become more sustainable..

Really? They must be paying out well under £5k a night if that is the case... One top league promoter mentioned circa £10k a night was the going rate, however that was a few years ago when a few of the major stars still rode here.. If they are paying out so little nowadays (must be much less than £10k for two meetings), then how come are they are losing so much? I would think though that if you want riders to ride in one league only, then you would have to pay them a reasonable amount, and if a track cannot afford to pay circa £11k from its home meeting to pay for the two it needs to, then there probably isn't any hope for the sport.. 1200 paying £18 generates over £20k a night which surely must be affordable?

The individual meetings invariably dont have much of a prize fund and riders race for "basic money".. Hence so many advertised to ride pick up illnesses just before the meeting and get replaced by someone local who usually isnt up to the same level.. Even the British Final itself being ran on a Monday night doesn't generate anywhere near the crowd levels it used to at Brandon on a Sunday.. For me, five man teams and a league of 12 teams riding home and away twice is the only way to deliver the priority requirements for the sport... ie Enough rides for riders and 'spare' riders to have as replacements without guest riders being used which will mean that so important credibility... With team strengths being around a 'Championship', level of two heat leaders and three second strings/best reserves.. Six rides each per night, 15 heats at an average of £120 a point per rider would mean £5400 paid out per night per team for an average 45 points scored.. A decent standard to watch too with no out of their depth lads.. These lads could then race in a lower league made up of the other teams left and "B" teams from any team in the top league who wants to run one.. A league that could use seven man teams to give the riders most in need of practice to improve the opportunity to do so..

Really stoked for yer mate...

The uncomfortable truth is that the sport carrying on as a team sport will never work. (In the UK).. When, as a fan attending, you have to agree to collude with the promoters that it is a 'proper' team sport that you are watching, (when you deep down know it isn't), then the sport has a major problem.. You can never ever build up that "emotional engagement" that a fan of a team needs to keep repeating their visits, (with many of those visits taking place through blind loyalty with absolutely no sense of actual reason other than they are "your team").... The sport has always been a bit "Mickey Mouse" with regards to the way it has been "self policed" in regards to its rules, however, in the halcyon days of the 70's "Proper Speedway Competitions", with nationally recognised sponsors, went out to millions every Saturday afternoon via one of only three channels that existed.. These didn't have any 'Mickey Mouse' rules and involved truly the very best in the world, with the bonus for the domestic sport of a young, exciting British Hero ie Peter Collins, who took on, and often beat, the best the world had to offer, and did it usually by giving them a head start which made the sport spectacular to watch.. The Britsh Leagues then fed off this coverage. You could watch PC getting interviewed at 4pm on ITV after wowing the TV audience, and then see go and him race at 7pm that night at Hyde Rd.. Unless of course he had flown to Germany to race their the next day in a long track meeting so Larry Ross guested for him, (but obviously you didnt know that till you had paid to get in).. For me, the sport has some major decions to make.. The team aspect only exists for two reasons... 1). With promoters often being fans themselves, it provides them with a "toy" to play with and some very small recognition. As they still (misguided that they are), see "their team" as being relevant and important locally.. 2) As many nights racing for the riders as possible, to provide them with the relatively (for the sports' size), a 'huge' return, which then helps them pay the 'huge' costs to compete.. In short, the world has moved on and UK Speedway hasn't, what you could get away with in the 70's you cannot today. And what is a trillion percent clear is that the operating model and business plan used over the past couple of decades in particular, simply isn't fit for purpose and in the year off due to the pandemic both should have been radically changed.. Unfortunately, it appears, no one in the sport felt that it was needed so I presume all must think what they put out is "ok"... That's the problem when you sit in Echo Chambers, you only hear what you already believe.

Agreed.. The reality will of course be somewhat different.. There could be a fair few team changes I reckon as those teams in Poland who cannot get into the play offs, or have no fear of relegation, start to jettison their overseas higher earners.. Never forget that winning the leagues over here is very prestigious so changes will have to be made.. And for the others, you might just break into the "Top Six"..

Woffy seems to be using Bomber's 'gating gloves' over the past few seasons...

Majic....

That's a shame...

Amazing from the World Champ... Freddies Polish Team must be really pleased with his performance tonight too..

Obviously... But to still do it so regularly after so many years is a problem I would say... Just throwing points away when it's hard enough to score them...

Doyle again...!!!. Amazing he still does this so many times...

He has just finished some Humble Pie for lunch..

I think it was the late Jon Cook who said in the SS around 10 years ago now, that they tried to attract Mx riders over.. Given certain similar traits between the two sports. Their advertising was built around letting the Mx lads know that they could actually earn money for riding motor bikes and a figure of (I think), £4k a week was quoted as achievable.. Presumably riding two or three times a week.. This would appear a 'carrot' I would think, until how much needed to get paid out each season reared its head... I would suggest that if you could be competitive and have parity with all, for no more than £10k a year, the money available would be more than enough to have you trying to get involved.. When you hear that £30k (and more), is nearer the "going rate" a season, then you will always struggle to attract anyone but a kid whose parents or parent's friends/acquaintances are willing to finance the operation.. A very shallow pool to find someone from..

The riding style used to be like grass track still is.. As the rider entered the bend his aim was to find grip to propel him back down the straight as fast as he could.. And with the hard compound tyres and deep tracks, if they rode them "howling into the bends sideways" like they do today, they would have been spat off when the tyre dug in.. Nowadays riders take up a fair old chunk of the entrance to the bends when side on, with the usually slick surface allowing them confidence to do so.. Hence the best racing is usually to be found on the wider tracks... As you say, at the very top level the racing is still fantastic. As it always was... Unfortunately the vast majority of races (especially over here) are competed in now by a standard below the very top level...

Objected

Your comment re how far out riders slide is spot on... Watch the old racing on YouTube from the 70's and most riders slid the bikes well into the turn... Meaning they often entered the turn almost straight legged before hooking the back end round midway through the turn.. Which meant room to pass the rider existed for the one behind going into the turn faster... Now with riders virtually sideways well before the turns the track space to pass must be very narrow indeed at most circuits given the lack of width of the straights and bends...

It was very grippy on the inside but as you say, everyone knows that this spoils the racing at the NSS so why not remove some material from the inside? Some times were quick (sub sixty seconds), and the outside didn't really work till around heat 12 or so.. Maybe the new tyres don't help either?

Wow... How average has the racing got at the NSS? Geoff will be on soon telling us that everywhere else is rubbish... I have read on various forums that the racing wasn't up to its usual standard but watching four riders riding really fast in a freight train really isn't entertainment... Especially when the back section of the freight train sometimes more than half a straight behind.. Wolves should have won by much more with Nick Morris giving the Aces a 4-2 by blocking the fast riding Ryan Douglas and letting Brennan ride past the pair, before Doiglas came back very hard (good to watch a rider with that commitment)... And with Leon Flint you could have added a few more to their score as Jack Smith gave it his all but was a long way behind (apart from his third ride when he wasn't too far behind R Worrall)... The engine room for the Aces looks like (as always it seems to be year in year out) the problem... Often getting beat by the opposition reserves and never being good enough to cover a heat leaders off night seems to be the criteria sort by the management for the Aces middle order over the past more than a few years.. Becker and Douglas showed what a number two and four should be all about with fantastic commitment and capability.. It must be great for Wolves to have such strength in the second string dept.. Masters and Rory a class apart on the night.. The scores kept the meeting interesting but the racing wouldn't have me looking up the next meeting with any eager anticipation to be honest.. And I blame my lad for going anyway as I didn't know it was on and he only mentioned it at six o clock when I got in from work.. Best part of fifty quid for the two of us spent by three hours later to watch 'follow the leader' for most of the evening.. Next time I won't cave in so easily... Dan seems to have developed a consistent 'snake' starting style too over the past few weeks from what I have seen on TV and both tonight and Sheffield the other week.. He need to sort that and quickly as he is too far behind at the first turn... What has gone wrong with that track Geoff? Do pray tell...

Include Youth Speedway? Some upright engined bikes races? Some of the 'oldies' riding round on their Rudges, Japs etc? Maybe a 'devil take the hindmost' where the last rider drops out after a mad one lap dash of racing? Two riders starting at opposite sides of the track similar to the cycling pursuit? With the "Grand Finale" at the end of four or five hours of entertainment... Get the merchandise stalls there so fans can dip in and out of the racing... Include some of the usual face painting, bouncy castles, beat the starter etc for the kids.. Maybe hook up a PlayStation too? Something for the older generation and something for the younger including teenagers.. Raffle off some 'season/however meetings left tickets' for the club at say a fiver a ticket or sell some set amount of meetings tickets in a block eg next five matches, at discount special offer rates.. And probably most important of all, get some names, emails, mobile numbers, etc etc of those in attendance to target market them post that day.. Maybe even give everyone a club car sticker or a pen as a memento for them to take away too to a) get your name on a fair few cars locally, and b) those in possession of the items will have a tangible reminder of their day which they will see often.. As they start from so a very low base marketing and promotion wise, there is really so much which could be done..

Still think that a major season long individual event ran with qualifiers at every track funnelling down to two semis and a Grand Final would be worthwhile.. All the promotions put in a certain amount and generate a large prize fund and then promote their own meeting off the back off it.. They pay out tens and tens of thousands every week as a collective, which works out to hundreds and hundreds of thousands every season, for hardly any recognition from even those who live on their 'doorstep' locally, never mind within a radius of 20 miles or so... Advertising some 'shock' prize fund for a sport many won't even have heard of and you may just get some notice taken.. Wouldnt cost any more than they pay now either if they all agree to budget for this prize fund... And by running such a big individual competition, with a 'big prize' at the end of it, you can then promote your own club off the back of it when running your own meeting within the overall competition... It does seem crackers to keep paying out huge sums in reality for zero development of the sport..

3. Guesty...

Thinking out loud. Seven Dwarf's would be perfect to make up a Speedway team...