Crump99

True. I can certainly sympathise with some of the points made but don't understand and can indeed argue with that. It's difficult given one aspect they've brought into their reasoning now so will need to think.

Sounds logical. Showground always been the ones instigating such action so I'm sure that they'd be happy to retrospectively support the protection of their grassed areas inside. Probably can't believe their luck that the club have crapped on it's own affected fans for the first time ever and taken the heat off them ever having to do it if it's still a big issue for them, which it seemingly isn't as they were not putting pressure on us that we know of. Fair point Wealdstone, someone has ownership of this we are told so the EoES would have to say that individual events no longer control their own parking, or if they do, what they are limited to regarding any general parking flexibility, especially around BB parking as I'm sure that sure that it wouldn't be a broad brush for all. Given the nature a location of the speedway then bringing it in line as described with other events does not make sense anyway unless other events are running as well as speedway and they can't organise internal parking, as has happened on very rare occasions in the past. Then again, let's not pre-empt any statement forthcoming, we might have been big enough and clever enough to see a way out and let common sense prevail.

I don't think that they have to do that, just say that on reflection, and from comments received, they have decided to reinstate the former BB system for their disabled fans with clear guidelines. Any infractions will result in individual removal of access with an overall totting up procedure that could lead to the reintroduction of the newly proposed scheme in future. Everyone is happy, there are consequences and management still hold all the aces.

If they are undeliverable then that suggests wrong details used rather than anything untoward. Has contacting the club ever been easy? You can say on social media that everything is triffic but that's about it in the world that we know live.

I'm not making any assumptions. The notice was quite clear. The planning and detail clearly went into creating a bigger problem than the one that was reasonably easy to find a solution to within the existing system. You don't put such things out on the website (under the radar hoping that nobody spots it) and then still be working on the specifics, jeez, it's not rocket science. There were instructions, allegedly spurious reasoning and a diagram; at no point did I also see a "draft" watermark across it! I think I'm the one being reasoned here as I'm aware of the history of EoES parking and understand the problems on all sides. I've been quite calm trying to explain that history (and what history particularly has to do with it is that usually the club is fighting the EoES for access for it's disabled fans whereas they are now the ones kicking them out, that's nothing to be proud of. Also knowing how the system has been administered/organised over the seasons, and the lack of it 2019 seems to have been the prompt for where we now are) and look at what could and should have been done within this club self created problem. With respect, you are entitled to your opinion (it is a forum after all) but I don't need any lectures from someone in Manchester about this particular situation at the club I've supported for longer than I care to remember. I'm also not prepared to sit quietly hoping that they have a plan b in progress because you and I both know (yes I'm happy to assume that) that there was no other solutions being worked on. Hopefully they are looking at this again now or it's going to be a long 6 weeks whoever they sign.

This should be done from the off as it has been made many seasons before. The first part was no parking on the grass (should apply to all cars), no driving over the grass (should apply to all cars), Blue badges on display. The second problem is location: the Arena car park isn't ideal (but very welcome so let's not start that argument again) which is why many seemed to park on the access road approaching the stand or other areas closer to the stand. Was that ever picked up, monitored or announced anywhere as a problem? Not that I'm aware of. I have some sympathy with Johnson's gripe because I saw it with my own eyes but I didn't see any action to deal with it. That's where the problem is. It's not the girl on the gate's job to admininster this. The website should say that disabled access is pre agreed and all she needs is a list of name/vehicle registrations/Badge number (or similar) if there is one, allowed disabled access with zero tolerance to anyone who is not on the list. The security bloke can deal with those people. If anyone doesn't do as instructed then they can be warned with a three strikes and we take the ruler or Tipp-ex to your details on the list.

There is no negative PR yet which is why it is important to keep it centre stage because those who matter do indeed read this forum. Nobody is making wild assumptions. The notice is clear and if they were offering/exploring alternative arrangements alongside then it should have said so or not been uploaded. They are selling season tickets on the basis of no access for disabled that hasn't been publicised so what do you expect. You sound like the typical speedway fan who takes any old crap, they'd love 1000s like you!

In years gone by (not happened under Johnson's watch) the instructions on where to park (even to the extent of giving out a paper sheet of instructions) have been made very clear and the consequences of not doing so was clear in that in future you'd be denied the access that you abuse. So rather than try to instruct, organise and explain consequences for a problem that Johnson is probably correct about but is also able to take less draconian action to correct, management take their ball away!!

Yes I think you have missed something as have we all. I don't recall this ever being communicated even though it had clearly been worked on in detail. That's the most professional looking notice the club has produced in many a long year and was only stumbled upon on by chance. Rather that the usual guff news items you would have thought that as soon as it was loaded onto the website that supporter would have been made aware of it's existence, but given that it's usually the EoES making the draconian decision and the club stands up for it's disabled supporters, how do you communicate the embarrassing situation that your making changes for seemingly no good reason off your own back? Why faff about with with a new shuttle that takes organisation, staff time and some expense when you already have a system that works fine and at the end of the day can't involve great numbers for the bread and butter meetings. Of course management may be looking at this chuckling. Their thoughts would be welcomed. It'd be good to see one of those (because we all know that they read these things) "We've seen the comments on the internet" articles to justify their action/position and tell us where we are going wrong?

Going round in circles a bit now. That doesn't explain why Horton was so hot on it early doors? He must have been aware of freeloaders and/or abuse of the BB system. Anyway, let's leave it there as there are more pressing matters. You do show however that it isn't rocket science to administer an efficient system for BB stadium entry, although the longstanding system seemed to work fine so the real reason for turning on the fans when the club has fought for them over many decades would be a good starting point.

Well you favourite supporters facebook site posted (shared post) the season ticket details yesterday which gives no indication anywhere to anyone with a BB that if they buy an ST and think that can rock up at the gate for stadium entry as per usual then they are in for a shock. Think that answers your question.

True if allowed but what was the trigger as it has never been done before. Given the drop off of crowd at that time I'd have thought that you'd have wanted all the fans that you could get in

Firstly the shuttle service for those affected would work but as said previously, what is easier, cheaper, more time consuming? Organising, staffing, financing a shuttle service or just let affected fans do what they have for 20 years that which takes little effort by the club? Seeing the kids run down the stands to give the riders high 5s was a great sight but was probably one thing that was wise to stop although I don't recall anyone ever falling off the fence or otherwise being injured. In fact when it was suggested to Colin Horton that the practice should be reintroduced he said stuff H&S and took the ropes down so the kids could do that again. Problem being that it had been so long since those days that nobody knew what to do and it was abandoned through lack of interest.

Wealdstone is correct in that staying quiet and waiting to see is not an option because everybody knows the outcome of that strategy. Relevant communication has often been lacking since Rathbone and Watson left. I wasn't their greatest fan, but then again it's bloody hard to get me on your side anyway, but you can't knock the good job that they did with their passion for the club and fans, disabled or not. This action would never have happened under their watch and it's just a shame that Rathbone offloaded the club as he did. Given the way that this was introduced without communication and the reasons as given allegedly debunked then I'm not sure where the management can go with any explanation anyway (would love to see full facts and circumstances), hence their silence and hoping that it will go away as you indicate might be a way forward. I appreciate that disabled access needs to be managed and I think, as with most such systems, that some people gained access when they shouldn't (I guess that's why after the Frost era of massive internal car park Horton made BB holders show their photo side to parking staff? Neil can confirm?) so get a better system in place, don't use a sledgehammer to crack a nut.

Due to new Health and Safety restrictions we've just made up for 2020 I'm afraid that nobody is allowed to discuss the team until all 7 riders have signed and been announced.

There isn't really a story in print, just removal of long standing club policy for 2020 with reasons that allegedly no longer stack up according to the EoES bosses whereas the club bosses who seemingly made the decision off their own back remain silent.

I agree entirely but surely the problem here is that that's what Peterborough's disabled fans were trying to do that and have been for the last 20 years that I can recall. The club has always been supportive of their position and fought the EoES on occasions when it's them who have restricted disabled access. We are led to believe that the EoES have no objection to the former longstanding arrangements and it's the current club management who are allegedly not helping their disabled fans easily live their life, given that they already have a daily struggle, by removing the facility under questionable reasoning. Personally I don't think that's unimportant or a pointless waste of time trying to get common sense resumed and it's not a particularly good example of "what sort of things did you do for your 50th anniversary"?

Indeed. You might care to read Mimmo's first post on page 92, it might open your eyes and mind a bit

I wasn't aware of it and never saw it publicised, so great if it was an option for those affected even if it was a case of if you don't ask you don't get, current situation accepted of course! It's good that you feel the need to pay and not see it as a freebie and hopefully others do likewise but some disabled people will take carers who have little interest in the event and also have to be available for the duration so paying on top of that isn't always appropriate.

It's only in line because they've introduced the standard practice for events generally that take place at the showground with parking areas close to entrances, so that is true. The missing bit is that the specific event organisers apparently have some control over how they deal with their event parking and the club have made conscious decision to exclude stadium access to their disabled fans under the umbrella of health and safety restrictions that allegedly only they are aware of.

I'm not aware of the carer facility in operation at Panthers, and to be fair to them I don't think that it ever has. I know what you mean though because those receiving DLA/PIP can get a carer in free of charge at Posh where it is in operation but they get 7 to10x more fans and receipts. If you have a Blue Badge then that would potentially get you close to the turnstile under the proposed new system. It's then a fair trek to the circuit with a similar trek on the way out. Probably not a pleasant experience but as a one off you might cope or consider even that too much depending on the level and type of disability.?

Nicely put. I couldn't see a way out but that would do it.

They are targeting a group in the same fashion as has happened intermittently over 15 years so the outcome of that was clear enough. The attention is in the detail of what new restrictions have popped up and what will access really be limited to in future. You cannot always win that's true but it always seems to be those who probably can't help themselves who pay the price. If nobody fights the apparent unwinnable battles then nothing will ever change, even though as you say, often that's the way it is irrespective.

True but it's been a hokey cokey situation at the Showground for 15 years so I'm not buying it unless I know what these new H&S restrictions are and where they came from? There, that's me seeing flying pigs now.

Unlikely I agree but decisions get unmade when it suits all the time. Disabled people often feel bad enough about their situation as it is without requiring special measures to highlight them and their problems, whatever they may be. What takes more time, cost and effort: special measures to deal with a newly self created problem or just reinstate a system that worked perfectly well for years?