enotian

I was thinking more along the lines of holding the whole qualifying competition over a weekend at the same venue. Riders nominated by their national federation. 4 qualifiers (1 Friday night three across Saturday) top three into the Final on Sunday next four into the last chance qualifier on the Sunday prior to the Final. Top three from that plus a home wildcard into the Final. Split the qualifiers into Continental Final (riders from mainland Europe), European Final (any European), Scandinavian/Nordic Final and Overseas Final (AUS, USA, GB etc) to ensure a mix of nationalities make the Final. Call it the Inter Continental Final with the top three qualifying for next seasons SGP. You crown 5 titleholders all over and done with in one weekend at one location. Surely that sort of content would attract plenty of spectators and TV deals or streaming sales across the competing nations. You might even attract all of the GP riders to participate if the exposure and prize money makes it worth their while. No need to travel around Europe (probably at a loss) to chase the dream of a spot in the SGP series. The recent Grand Prix Challenge was a complete non event. Even if the track hadn't been terrible it was a total anti-climax in front of a sparse crowd. Probably the twelfth biggest speedway meeting of the year and nothing made of it, despite having dragged riders across Europe to qualify for it.

Isn't that the angle though? Does the SGP Promoter have a long term vision for the product? If they do, surely to maximise income the more varied nationalities and higher standard competitors the better. Or is SGP sustainable with 90% of the rounds and competitors in/from Poland? Won by a Pole every year? That's ultimately the direction of travel if the domestic leagues collapse. FIM seem to be conscious of this based on them turning the World Team Cup into the SON to increase the number of genuinely competitive nations. It's like companies who have a successful product but don't do R&D into new products and then struggle once their successful product starts to sell less. So the SGP promoters should have more than a passing interest in their future supply chain (aka clubs providing riders). Now whether that's a direct input like BSI(?) did with Reading Bulldogs(?) or just facilitating the health of the domestic league structures by better enabling access to riders, having thriving domestic competitions can only benefit them in the long run. You can't change the past but you can try to work with these authorities for mutual benefit.

Agree it's a football centric region even at a time when all the clubs are at best also rans and don't look like winning anything. Other professional clubs (rugby union, basketball, cricket) do survive in the same environment. However they do have a much bigger national/international appeal than speedway and that's before all of the other none sport related leisure opportunities which are easily accessible. On a hot summers day (not that there are many) ideal for speedway there are amazing beaches just a short train journey away. Not sure why young people in the region would know the sport exists let alone give it a go. There's a massive student population in that area of Newcastle but if it's pitched to a family audience and takes 2 hours plus for 15 mins of action I can't see how that would appeal to students. Maybe if the beer was cheap and it was next to nowt to get in. They're more likely to attend non league football which is 7th or 8th tier stuff rather than watch the 20th best speedway team in the country. At Newcastle it's either got to be a premium winning team product to have a chance of attracting attention and crowds (the last one 20 years ago didn't, although the football team was almost successful at that time) or be something cheap and cheerful that can operate within its means. Which isn't at a costly facility like Brough Park or with a team at current Championship level.

Regarding weekends, FIM has a part to play in this surely. If the FIM calendar (not just SGP) is strangling the domestic leagues (bar Poland) to the extent that the future of International events starts to look very Polish with a smattering of other Europeans then surely FIM need to think about future product development, especially if none of the SGP money makes it into the domestic leagues. From May and October there are 24/25 weekends (defined as Friday night, Saturday and Sunday). At present there seems to be FIM events (qualifiers and finals) across most of those weekends dragging riders from domestic leagues causing them to run with guests or move to less attractive midweek schedules. Surely FIM could condense its competitions to eleven of those weekends? Eight SGP's (inc Fri/Sat double rounds [leaving Sundays free]), One World Individual Final/GP Qualifier (qualifiers and final Fri to Sun), One Youth Champs (U21/U19 Championships (qualifiers and final Fri to Sun) and One World Team Cup/SON Finals(qualifiers and final Fri-Sun). Appreciate that FIM need to allocate meetings across all their members but how much does the Hungarian Federation benefit from hosting an U19 qualifier meeting? And how much does it cost riders to navigate Europe to hopefully qualify for a final later in the season when they might even be injured/out of form. SEC series could run midweek. That would leave 13/14 weekends which are entirely free of International events. Providing Poland weren't allowed to expand into the gap would those 13/14 free weekends (or Friday and Saturdays assuming everyone will still want to ride in Poland on a Sunday) plus 4 in April, allow British clubs to run a domestic league on those defined weekends (noting some clubs Ipswich, Sheffield, Poole would still stick to their traditional race night). Not necessarily including GP riders who may be out of the price range but with some certainty that their defined team would always be available (barring injury) on those weekends. It appears that the scattergun approach to the FIM calendar doesn't benefit them or the riders and has a detrimental impact on domestic (British at least) leagues. And without those domestic leagues those International products will start to look all a bit one dimensional.

In 2018 I was involved in the purchase of waste land, probably big enough to build a speedway track on, from North Tyneside Council. It's in between a rubbish tip a motorway and a railway line and cost £1m. With all councils struggling for cash and planning for housing developments much easier I just can't see any public authority making a significant plot of land available for leisure, especially motorsports. There's plenty of grant funding out there to stimulate the construction industry but you've got to prove that your investment will benefit the local economy. They obviously did that in Manchester with the promise of National and World Finals attracting visitors to the city. Something like that would be great for an authority like North or South Tyneside or even Gateshead, to have world class sport staged in their area but the promise of attracting up to at best 1,000 people once a week for 20 weeks of the year for a noisy motorsport is a tough sell.

I don't disagree that Championship level speedway wasn't going to be sustainable at Newcastle (for the reasons in my previous post) and the lower costs of a NDL team which would have been at least competitive could have been the way forward. But in 2021 that would have been something like five or six home meetings? Just not viable either. But you're right the only possible future for the Diamonds at Brough would be at a lower level in which all (or the vast majority of) the riders in the league were UK based and not riding overseas at weekends. However, you'd need to have a viable number of teams race against and you can't see the likes of Leicester, Poole and Glasgow (and therefore Edinburgh) wanting to dilute their team strengths.

Phew the Diamonds are saved!!! Unbelievable that the list of previous promotions have never thought of trying to get the cost of renting the stadium down?? I expect Rob Grant will have seen this now and announce the 2022 line up and first meeting date anytime soon. Then he'll be on the phone to Newcastle City Council who haven't got a pot to urinate in, can't afford proper social care, infrastructure maintenance etc etc, for a nice juicy hand out for a sport which attracts minimal visitors to the city and is probably in reality occupying a site which is a prime location for much needed new housing. Of your six facts, three are questions, two of the others are opinion and the other is bleeding obvious. Have a clown emoji Might you consider that young Dandelion was perhaps upset that her favourite team/pastime had just announced it was no longer to exist? So maybe some ill informed comments were made. Or maybe Dandelion is privy to the same information THJ has alluded to or the fact that Rob Grant was told to retain the same company as the previous promotion which was undoubtedly part of the reason he has walked away. Or the fact that despite knowing that there was never going to be enough riders to sustain the 2020 line ups in 2021 the authority decided to allow teams to keep the same line ups despite there being no obligation to do so and knowing that would mean some teams would track under strength teams. I don't blame Rob Godfrey. Yes the structure of the leagues and team building could have been better but speedway at Brough Park is untenable. Brough Park is too expensive for the level of crowds attracted. The track shape is no longer suited to modern bikes and riders. There's little or no opportunity for other income streams (bar takings etc). It's only available on a Sunday and therefore even at Championship level attracting heat leaders is extremely difficult (note who else now runs on a Sunday) even if they could be afforded. There are lots of other ways to spend disposable income in Newcastle and in a football obsessed area in which all the local teams are a shambles the last thing the general public of Tyneside want is to watch another uncompetitive sports team. I think this also answers the valid question as to why Redcar is successful compared to Newcastle. Speedway can still be great but all of the right ingredients need to be there and sadly for Newcastle the cupboard is empty. To his credit Rob Grant knew that the long term future of speedway in Newcastle was outside of the city but where and how much it would take are probably beyond anyones means at this point in time. Especially for a sport that, lets face it, nobody wants on their door step. Even if it could be proved to improve the local economy.

Yes I must admit that at this point in time I wouldn't have the time or be prepared to invest my own money or have the contacts to make this happen. Which puts me amongst the 99.9% majority on here but that shouldn't prohibit anyone from sharing their views, opinions and ideas. Otherwise it would be a rather dull forum. You should also feel free to use the forum how you see fit.

Add the fact that the nominated heat 15 means having two No.1 riders is a massive advantage. Especially when you can't go for two experienced riders at reserve using heat 2 to offset against heat 13. It's a potential 4 to 8 point head start. Then if you can fill your lower order with foreign riders with competitive experience on low assessed averages, which is counter to the strategy of wanting to develop home grown talent, there's one generic formula for success. By simply allowing only one rider averaging over 8.00 (or whatever the correct number is) per team you address the supply issue, potentially reducing how much the top riders can demand. You make all the teams more competitive and potentially the product better to watch. Or you at least increase the foreign assessed average to 7.00 so if any team wants one or more rider over 8.00 then they have to field genuinely lower averaged riders to be within the points limit. Which should create opportunity for home grown riders. And allow teams the opportunity to go for a strength in depth strategy in which they always have a strong reserve pairing. Under the current heat format if you're going to restrict the make up of the bottom end of the team you have to restrict the top end as well. These are fairly simple equations that should be obvious to the promoters involved in the composition of their product but clearly they don't consider it in a formulaic way but base it on their own resources and what might benefit themselves.

Well the idea would be that the TV rights across Britain, Sweden, Denmark and Germay (not sure what the TV situation is in Latvia) provide more income than the current individual deals on the basis that you have four/five home nations to broadcast to. With Polish riders involved you also potentially sell the rights to a Polish broadcaster. Then you have more potential to attract pan european sponsors rather than the local plumber or national brands. And hopefully, if the product is any good (best riders on the best tracks at the best stadiums) and you have a wider catchment area within only two teams in the UK the attendances increase. People still like spending money, just not on rubbish. Clearly none of these income streams are guaranteed but you can negotiate TV deals and with sponsors ahead of committing to rider contracts. The GP stars appear to want more competitive action than the Polish League offers and if the Polish authorities continue to drive down rider rates then it shouldn't be too difficult to attract these stars within a budget. Especially as you're not competing with another two leagues for their services. The opportunity for the riders would be Polish League and Euro League. If the don't accept the rates the Euro League are offering then they only have Poland. Potentially putting them at a competitive disadvantage for the SGP compared to others riding both leagues. If the riders want it and the supporters want it then there'd seem to be away to make it happen. Or you could stick your head in the sand say it's not affordable, pedal the same old tripe to an ever decreasing fan base until it is no longer sustainable. At least if you try something new there's a chance it might succeed.

I'm wondering if Birmingham and Newcastle were given a bail out by the BSPL, Eastbourne asked but the pot was empty?? Or maybe because Eastbourne has a much more attractive 'asset' base than those two. Couldn't they just sell Tom Brennan to the mega rich to raise some cash.... ...or do they just now 'own' him by default. This won't be popular but I have to say weren't Eastbourne one of the teams that insisted on retaining their 2020 line up in 2021 even though there was no precedent or legal requirement to do so. When it was obvious that was going to mean there wasn;t going to be enough riders to make all of the teams competitive. A team they then appear to have been unable to afford. Madness.

Doesn't have to be entering the Polish League does it. It looks like all of the GP riders are looking to do at least 2 leagues Poland and A N other. Doesn't look like Sweden can afford them all but what is there to stop a 'Euro League'. A couple of tracks each from Sweden and Britain, Vojens, Daugavpils and one or two of the better German tracks. Get the product to an equivalent level as the Polish League (GP rider heatleaders, best domestic riders at 2nd string and best domestic U21 riders at reserve, using the best FIM/GP standard race tracks). All of those nations could do with getting their younger riders exposed to top level competition and you get to sell the TV rights to five home countries, more opportunities for riders to attract sponsors. Bi-weekly home fixtures featuring the top riders in the world (if there were two teams from Britain that would only be 14 UK fixtures in the season) should boost the crowd levels. Yes you couldn't use Sundays but with combined bargaining power you might be allocated a Friday night race day or the odd Saturday. Regardless, between those nations you'd have Monday to Thursday guaranteed for fixtures. It's not just Britain who are struggling to compete with Poland (in terms of their domestic leagues and young riders) so why doesn't everyone else pool their resources together to produce an equally as professional high standard league. Providing a similar pathway to the highest level of the sport that the Poles enjoy. Hopefully Brexit and Covid haven't made it a permanently logistical nightmare?

Can't agree with that. When he arrived at Newcastle he could put the bike wherever he wanted on a track that not many can. Liquid speedway. Maybe red mist Nicki took over too often making him look ragged but that's his winning mentality. I think we only saw red mist Nicki once at Brough when Stuey Swales wouldn't let him past. I'd struggle to think of any more naturally gifted riders of the era. Gollob? Maybe one for another thread...

Sums it up perfectly for me. It could actually be both things if they were done properly. But what it can't be is individual riders trying to earn as much as they can from whatever team masquerading as a team sport. Which is what it has become. But that's the crux of it. How do you go from the current situation where the pool of riders are in two leagues and guesting earning from 50 plus fixtures to restricting them to say 30 fixtures if there was one big league. It's a 40% pay cut. Or it's £8 more on the entrance fee. The numbers don't add up anymore. I've said for ages that the pay per points is counter productive in a team scenario. Does not incentivise team riding which is why it no longer exists. Why not have a purse for each heat (different values depending on which heat it is i.e. £200 for heat two £1,000 for heat 15). The purse is split between the teams based on the heat result (50:50 for a 3-3, 70:30 for a 4-2 and 90:10 for a 5-1). If you're a heat winner in a £1,000 heat you earn £500 in a 3-3, £525 in a 4-2 and £540 in a 5-1. Even promote it in that way. I guess back in the day discussing money was frowned upon (probably because of the unfair class system in this country but that's a different debate) but now the reality is everything is about money. So why not embrace it. The obvious problem is how many people would be impressed by a £1,000 prize pot (just using that for illustrative purposes). I guess there's nothing wrong in promoting it as a £10,000 heat, just not mentioning there was a £9,000 entry fee . The point is you can see how it would promote team riding and teamwork which would hopefully improve the on track product. A different dynamic. Of course it still doesn't get you away from the problem of reducing the riders earning capacity as a result of reducing the number of meetings they can ride in.

So basically we're saying that even if any Newcastle Promoter was mega wealthy and could afford to run a loss making business they still couldn't attract a competitive team. Unless they moved race nights from a Sunday. Which doesn't seem to be an option either. And you can't run a team at a lower level because (apart from it only having a handful of fixtures) the crowd levels wouldn't cover the stadium rental. Sounds like we know where to find the writing..........

Exactly the point though isn't it. It's not about what you want to see or what I what to see. It's about providing what the vast majority want. Lowest common denominator stuff. That's why you get stuff like the Hundred. (Garish) Style over content. (Don't tell my boss) but I spent today watching the first day of the Lords test followed by Northern Superchargers vs Manchester Invincibles. (Absolutely terribly contrived teams to attract the widest fan base, you might as well refer to them as Popchips vs McCoys) Clearly the skills set and tactical nuances on display at Lords were far greater than the risk and reward slogfest which was the Hundred. But even though tonights match was a thumping home win and not even a contest it was still very watchable with lots of big hitting and then wickets tumbling. With presumably sane members of the public singing and dancing along to terribly cheesy tunes during the very short delays between sets of five (not overs). Total escapism. Which is exactly what entertainment (not neccesarily sport) should be. If speedway is to reinvent itself it needs to appeal to these lowest commom denominators. Unfortunately for speedway for the masses the equivalent of a big six isn't a big five one it's a big crash. Interesting debate during the test match about scheduling of matches and how the ECB have introduced the Hundred because the game is too reliant of International matches subsidising the counties. Something speedway in this country could only dream off..... ....or is that the way forward??? A showpiece International tournament with a competitive GB team? Using the Hundred as a template you don't even need the best performers you just need non stop action over a couple of hours, merchanside, loud music, crowd interaction, booze by the looks of it. Nobody seems to be that bothered about the standard relative to the best in the world (must of the big name England players are now no longer in the competition [imagine if the Premiership started with all the GP stars but they all left once the SGP's started!!!]), as long as they can entertain. Nobody seems remotely bothered that the players have no affinity to the teams they represent. They're all double or even treble uppers. None of this matters because it's a great show. Can speedway in this country replicate it?? I doubt it.

astonishing isn't it. imagine Coca-Cola sales plummenting and their Marketing Director suggesting they solve the problem with a new advertising campaign. the slogan "Coca-Cola if you stop drinking it we'll stop making it!" Genius. Been happening at Newcastle for decades now. As much as it's a shame speedway just isn't sustainable in Newcastle. Brough Park is an expensive millstone which is too costly to allow the club to operate at a lower level and lower crowds and, lets face it, doesn't produce a great deal of exciting racing in the modern era. Speedway in this country reminds me of loads of those TV shows that viewers lost interest in after season three but are still churned out year after year until inevitably someone realises that nobody is watching anymore. The trouble is that those making the show are having a great time making it. They just never realise that watching it is nowhere near as entertaining as making it. I think it's called lack of self awareness.

The irony is cricket had adopted a couple of key aspects common to speedway. A variety of formats and more recently players who play for numerous teams. However they've done it somewhat better than speedway does. On a much larger budget of course. Would using the 4TT format for the league be the way to answer the current ills? Fair enough you lose team riding but that's, as stated earlier, rare. One league 16 teams. Facing your 15 opponents twice home and away with some kind of end of season play off and grand finals (4 of them, 5 if you add a neutral track). That's 10 regular home fixtures (similar to this season) and 30 away fixtures. Just about the equivalent number of fixtures riders have this season doubling up. 16 teams of 4 requires 64 riders (80 if you include a reserve) which is about the same number of active riders this season across the two leagues, so no need for riders to ride for more than one team. Rank the riders A, B, C, and D and each team would consist of one of each (maybe have a pre-season auction to generate interest). At each home meeting you have the potential for three sets of away supporters (or even streamers) as opposed to one. It won't happen because it's 16 (20 inc reserves) riders to pay for instead of 14 and 20 or 16 heats instead of 15.

could be massive this. seemed to have something of an impact tonight, interesting to see how it evolves. if it reduces the number of re-starts it can only be a good thing. of course in theory or even reality the referee releases the tapes after a random amount of time in that they don't time the release so that it's the same every heat. so there is no real change but psychologically for a rider if you're told the release time is random and automated the dynamic changes and the concept of anticipation disappears.

I noticed the same. Isn't there a worldwide doping ban on Russian athletes/sportspersons. Something to do with the Russian Fereration refusing to co-operate with WADA. So I think Russian competitors have to compete as athletes without representation or some such description, hence no flag. I then think it's up to the sports governing body to decide if any Russia nationals are allowed to compete. Presumably on the basis that they believe them to be free of doping and/or that the individuals have co-operated in testing. I think the same will apply at the Olympics. Although in the Euro's the team was definitely referred to as Russia. Interesting to see what happens at the SON. Are Sayfutidinov and Laguta still the defending champs?

Marcus Bisson of Poole Seemed be progressing mid 80's, 7ish average in the National League then disappeared. Not sure if he picked up an injury but I did see him riding on a beach in Jersey early 90's. Maybe he just didn't want to leave the Channel Islands too often. Who can blame him.

interesting model. presumably the auction is a pantomime with all deals having been sealed beforehand? still an interesting way to launch a season.

currently but if it was financially beneficial (better TV deal or larger market for sponsors) I'm sure they'd consider the proposition. alternatively propose something similar to the Swedish/Danish authorities. Maybe add a German and/or Latvian club so the league is held at GP standard venues. I just feel that the sport in this country could do with having a top tier product that British fans could access. The current strategy to improve the standard seems to be by developing British talent (which they're doing a great job at with limited resources) but even if the current batch reach world standard don't they just (justifiably) follow the Woffinden/Lambert path and concentrate on continental fixtures? I don't think there is any future in a six team (5 promoter) top league without any world stars

randomly and only some weeks. I've a series link set up to catch them.

Not sure to be honest. I assume he was an asset of BSPL. Maybe Coventry was his last "owner"? I'm not sure if Newcastle had to pay to acquire him but I was told he was retained over Mountain (at the point he was released) because Roynon would become an asset and Mountain wouldn't. So the notion still exists even if it has zero financial status.