RobMcCaffery 2,752 Posted February 7, 2014 . A slightly odd view. Considering it is the heat formula that determines who rides against who in those races and off which gate position. And what arrangements are being made for replacement riders etc. I dare say it would make quite a difference. Especially if they choose a bad formula. . I sincerely doubt if he even reads the programme. He certainly can't grasp what's going on. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skidder1 7,667 Posted February 7, 2014 I sincerely doubt if he even reads the programme. He certainly can't grasp what's going on. ????? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
g13webb 4,254 Posted February 7, 2014 (edited) Right ladies gentlemen boys and girls. May have some good news in the near future about this particular topic. Have e-mail British Speedway Promoters Association and Speedway Control Bureau along with Jon Cook at Lakeside this last week with a polite request for information regarding Elite League 2014 Race Heat Format without any response from any of them at all. So I did the next best thing and PMed our esteemed friend on this forum Philip Rising has to why there seemed to be no response from them not even sending a reply to say thank you for your interest. This is the reply from Philip "I AM rarely at Speedway Star these days but spoke to the office and they basically have the same problem as you. But, hopefully, might have something early next week". Big thank you to Philip Seems that the Speedway Star and us the fans/supports have been treated like mushrooms, so may see the light at the end of the tunnel shortly then we can all choose our weapons and discuss. Appreciate your efforts and a big thanks for trying to get some response from the horses mouth.. The facts are indeed worrying, that after 3 months or more, we are still waiting the finalised details. It wouldn't surprise me, if at the last moment, this protected race formula is dropped and we revert back to the old tried and tested format, leaving the reserves to compete as others have done before...... At least that would enable the present CMA to carry on...... Edited February 7, 2014 by GRW123 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
INCOGNITO 357 Posted February 7, 2014 I think the details of the new heat format don't really need to be known by everyone until the press release and there has been a few different types of formats they have been looking at so you can't say much about something that hasn't been decided on yet. The rough outlines of the format have been knowledge for some time with reserves not having to face top riders but will face decent second strings like Adam Skornicki, Peter Ljung and Richie Worrall. This will mean top riders will not have such easier races and will face each other more times during a meeting. All we really need to know now is who is in which heat and when but the basics are already out there for everyone to get a decent idea of what to expect. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
waiheke1 4,295 Posted February 7, 2014 Very true Skidder - but what happens when they turn to the regular Supporter to ask for help with the Programme (I have helped a number of folk over the years) and the reply to the new Supporter: Sorry I haven't a clue how to go on with this. It won't look good - so at least some advance warning of what is to happen really would be useful for everybody. Unless there is a change in the number of nominated races, the race format shouldnt impact in anyway on how to fill in the programme? 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
T.N.T. 355 Posted February 8, 2014 (edited) There is one format that I developed when they were looking a something different for the KO Cup and with a few little changes it could work here ..... but it will NOT be the new race format. Basically there would be a reserves race in heats 1 and 8 with the other races having just one programmed rider and one nominated rider for each team. This would give team managers a job to try and get the best out of each race by nominating the right ridr at the right time. This is an example only of a match between Wolves and Kings Lynn In heats 2-7 each team selects a top 5 rider ineach of the heats and one reserve. (A rider can only be nominated once in these heats obviously.)Then in heats 9-14 this is repeated. NOTE; Before the meeting starts, each team manager hands in his nominated riders for heats 2-7. Then once heat 8 is run, they must had in their nominations for races 9-14. These are done on official sheets/cards and can NOT be seen by the opposing manager so the can't manipulate who their top rider faces. < HT01; Ashley Morris, Joe Jacobs, Lewis Kerr, Lewis Rose > HT02 ; Tai Woffinden, .............. , Kenneth Bjerre, .............. > HT03 ; Ricky Wells, .............. , Rory Schlein, .............. < HT04 ; Jacob Thorssell, .............. , Roger Lambert, .............. > HT05 ; Tyron Proctor, .............. , Nicolas Porsing, .............. < HT06 ; Joe Jacobs, .............. , Lewis Rose, .............. > HT07 ; Piotr Pawlicki, .............. , Niels K Iversen, .............. > HT08 ; Joe Jacobs, Ashley Morris, Lewis Rose, Lewis Kerr < HT09 ; Ricky Wells, .............. , Nicolas Porsing, .............. > HT10 ; Jacob Thorssell, .............. , Roger Lambert, .............. < HT11 ; Tyron Proctor, .............. , Rory Schlein, ............. < HT12 ; Piotr Pawlicki, .............. , Kenneth Bjerre, .............. > HT13 ; Ashley Morris, .............. , Lewis Kerr, .............. < HT14 ; Tai Woffinden, .............. Niels K Iversen, .............. <>HT15 ; .............. , .............. , .............. , .............. This gives the reserves two races together, but they could be out with anyone in the other two heats however it is unlikely a team will select a top rider in these races as this could mean they have two consecutive races and would want to place their top men against the opposing top men. They will face a reserve however in each race Each teams fifth rider face each other twice in programmed rides but are likely to be alongside a heat leader in their two nominated races to avoid two races in a row. Gate positions are riders in Red and White taking the inside gates. Teams can flick a coin to decide which set of gates they wish to take. The options are races marked < or > Heat 15 remains a nominated race for the top scorers / heat leaders. NOTE; This is only an example of a format I developed a few years ago This 8is how it could look after managers have nominated < HT01; Ashley Morris, Joe Jacobs, Lewis Kerr, Lewis Rose > HT02 ; Tai Woffinden, Jacob Thorssell , Kenneth Bjerre, Niels K Iversen > HT03 ; Ricky Wells, Piotr Pawlicki , Rory Schlein, Lewis Rose < HT04 ; Jacob Thorssell, Ashley Morris , Roger Lambert, Nicolas Porsing > HT05 ; Tyron Proctor, Tai Woffinden , Nicolas Porsing, Rory Schlein < HT06 ; Joe Jacobs, Ricky Wells, Lewis Rose, Kenneth Bjerre > HT07 ; Piotr Pawlicki, Tyron Proctor , Niels K Iversen, Robert Lambert > HT08 ; Joe Jacobs, Ashley Morris, Lewis Rose, Lewis Kerr < HT09 ; Ricky Wells, Piotr Pawlicki , Nicolas Porsing, Robert Lambert > HT10 ; Jacob Thorssell, Joe Jacobs , Roger Lambert, Kenneth Bjerre < HT11 ; Tyron Proctor, Tai Woffinden , Rory Schlein, Lewis Kerr < HT12 ; Piotr Pawlicki, Ricky Wells , Kenneth Bjerre, Niels K Iversen > HT13 ; Ashley Morris, Jacob Thorssell , Lewis Kerr, Nicolas Porsing < HT14 ; Tai Woffinden, Tyron Proctor Niels K Iversen, Rory Schlein <>HT15 ; .............. , .............. , .............. , .............. Edited February 8, 2014 by T.N.T. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sandking072 151 Posted February 8, 2014 There is one format that I developed when they were looking a something different for the KO Cup and with a few little changes it could work here ..... but it will NOT be the new race format. Basically there would be a reserves race in heats 1 and 8 with the other races having just one programmed rider and one nominated rider for each team. This would give team managers a job to try and get the best out of each race by nominating the right ridr at the right time. This is an example only of a match between Wolves and Kings Lynn In heats 2-7 each team selects a top 5 rider ineach of the heats and one reserve. (A rider can only be nominated once in these heats obviously.)Then in heats 9-14 this is repeated. NOTE; Before the meeting starts, each team manager hands in his nominated riders for heats 2-7. Then once heat 8 is run, they must had in their nominations for races 9-14. These are done on official sheets/cards and can NOT be seen by the opposing manager so the can't manipulate who their top rider faces. < HT01; Ashley Morris, Joe Jacobs, Lewis Kerr, Lewis Rose > HT02 ; Tai Woffinden, .............. , Kenneth Bjerre, .............. > HT03 ; Ricky Wells, .............. , Rory Schlein, .............. < HT04 ; Jacob Thorssell, .............. , Roger Lambert, .............. > HT05 ; Tyron Proctor, .............. , Nicolas Porsing, .............. < HT06 ; Joe Jacobs, .............. , Lewis Rose, .............. > HT07 ; Piotr Pawlicki, .............. , Niels K Iversen, .............. > HT08 ; Joe Jacobs, Ashley Morris, Lewis Rose, Lewis Kerr < HT09 ; Ricky Wells, .............. , Nicolas Porsing, .............. > HT10 ; Jacob Thorssell, .............. , Roger Lambert, .............. < HT11 ; Tyron Proctor, .............. , Rory Schlein, ............. < HT12 ; Piotr Pawlicki, .............. , Kenneth Bjerre, .............. > HT13 ; Ashley Morris, .............. , Lewis Kerr, .............. < HT14 ; Tai Woffinden, .............. Niels K Iversen, .............. <>HT15 ; .............. , .............. , .............. , .............. This gives the reserves two races together, but they could be out with anyone in the other two heats however it is unlikely a team will select a top rider in these races as this could mean they have two consecutive races and would want to place their top men against the opposing top men. They will face a reserve however in each race Each teams fifth rider face each other twice in programmed rides but are likely to be alongside a heat leader in their two nominated races to avoid two races in a row. Gate positions are riders in Red and White taking the inside gates. Teams can flick a coin to decide which set of gates they wish to take. The options are races marked < or > Heat 15 remains a nominated race for the top scorers / heat leaders. NOTE; This is only an example of a format I developed a few years ago This 8is how it could look after managers have nominated < HT01; Ashley Morris, Joe Jacobs, Lewis Kerr, Lewis Rose > HT02 ; Tai Woffinden, Jacob Thorssell , Kenneth Bjerre, Niels K Iversen > HT03 ; Ricky Wells, Piotr Pawlicki , Rory Schlein, Lewis Rose < HT04 ; Jacob Thorssell, Ashley Morris , Roger Lambert, Nicolas Porsing > HT05 ; Tyron Proctor, Tai Woffinden , Nicolas Porsing, Rory Schlein < HT06 ; Joe Jacobs, Ricky Wells, Lewis Rose, Kenneth Bjerre > HT07 ; Piotr Pawlicki, Tyron Proctor , Niels K Iversen, Robert Lambert > HT08 ; Joe Jacobs, Ashley Morris, Lewis Rose, Lewis Kerr < HT09 ; Ricky Wells, Piotr Pawlicki , Nicolas Porsing, Robert Lambert > HT10 ; Jacob Thorssell, Joe Jacobs , Roger Lambert, Kenneth Bjerre < HT11 ; Tyron Proctor, Tai Woffinden , Rory Schlein, Lewis Kerr < HT12 ; Piotr Pawlicki, Ricky Wells , Kenneth Bjerre, Niels K Iversen > HT13 ; Ashley Morris, Jacob Thorssell , Lewis Kerr, Nicolas Porsing < HT14 ; Tai Woffinden, Tyron Proctor Niels K Iversen, Rory Schlein <>HT15 ; .............. , .............. , .............. , .............. So, in other words, a bit like 1998 then? A combination of ink manufacturers getting rich and writer's cramp. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Daniel Smith 5,709 Posted February 8, 2014 Some of the comments on this thread do tickle me. Speedway is in dire straights because we don't know the race format. Really? Fans won't turn up because we don't know the race format. Really? How do we explain the program to a newbie. Really? It'll be right in front of your eyes for goodness sake. No different to to the old programme. Rider's 1-7's, gate positions, heats etc will all be self explanatory to the experienced spectator. Some need to get a grip, in principle I've come round to the new format idea and for a change the BSPA are taking their time to make it fit rather than rushing it through. 6 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BluTiger 21,719 Posted February 8, 2014 Some of the comments on this thread do tickle me. Speedway is in dire straights because we don't know the race format. Really? Fans won't turn up because we don't know the race format. Really? How do we explain the program to a newbie. Really? It'll be right in front of your eyes for goodness sake. No different to to the old programme. Rider's 1-7's, gate positions, heats etc will all be self explanatory to the experienced spectator. Some need to get a grip, in principle I've come round to the new format idea and for a change the BSPA are taking their time to make it fit rather than rushing it through. Absolutely spot on screamer... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
racers and royals 8,805 Posted February 8, 2014 Some of the comments on this thread do tickle me. Speedway is in dire straights because we don't know the race format. Really? Fans won't turn up because we don't know the race format. Really? How do we explain the program to a newbie. Really? It'll be right in front of your eyes for goodness sake. No different to to the old programme. Rider's 1-7's, gate positions, heats etc will all be self explanatory to the experienced spectator. Some need to get a grip, in principle I've come round to the new format idea and for a change the BSPA are taking their time to make it fit rather than rushing it through. Rushing it through ?? Conference decision mid-November now Early February Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hodgy 982 Posted February 8, 2014 I've come round to the new format idea What is it? Some of the comments on this thread do tickle me. Speedway is in dire straights because we don't know the race format. Really? Fans won't turn up because we don't know the race format. Really? How do we explain the program to a newbie. Really? It'll be right in front of your eyes for goodness sake. No different to to the old programme. Rider's 1-7's, gate positions, heats etc will all be self explanatory to the experienced spectator. Some need to get a grip, in principle I've come round to the new format idea and for a change the BSPA are taking their time to make it fit rather than rushing it through. My guess is they are taking their time as they are now realising the impact of such a ridiculous unthought through decision. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
g13webb 4,254 Posted February 8, 2014 Some of the comments on this thread do tickle me. Speedway is in dire straights because we don't know the race format. Really? Fans won't turn up because we don't know the race format. Really? How do we explain the program to a newbie. Really? It'll be right in front of your eyes for goodness sake. No different to to the old programme. Rider's 1-7's, gate positions, heats etc will all be self explanatory to the experienced spectator. Some need to get a grip, in principle I've come round to the new format idea and for a change the BSPA are taking their time to make it fit rather than rushing it through. No comments on here tickle me as much as your have. You say you have come round to the new format idea, yet , as of this moment, we don't know what that idea is or how it will effect the meeting. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RobMcCaffery 2,752 Posted February 8, 2014 (edited) Some of the comments on this thread do tickle me. Speedway is in dire straights because we don't know the race format. Really? Fans won't turn up because we don't know the race format. Really? How do we explain the program to a newbie. Really? It'll be right in front of your eyes for goodness sake. No different to to the old programme. Rider's 1-7's, gate positions, heats etc will all be self explanatory to the experienced spectator. Some need to get a grip, in principle I've come round to the new format idea and for a change the BSPA are taking their time to make it fit rather than rushing it through. Of course not knowing the race format isn't the problem. Good lord I do wonder if some of you can actually read! The problem is coming up with a sensible format. Can't you understand that simple difference? Try understanding the problem before shooting your mouth off and trying to ridicule others, eh? It's clear a lot of supporters can't see the problem. I'm sure they'll be the first to bleat if they're watching awful meetings with riders being hopelessly mismatched. Mind you, as long as their team wins I guess they'll be happy.... Edited February 8, 2014 by rmc Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BluTiger 21,719 Posted February 8, 2014 Of course not knowing the race format isn't the problem. Good lord I do wonder if some of you can actually read! The problem is coming up with a sensible format. Can't you understand that simple difference? Try understanding the problem before shooting your mouth off and trying to ridicule others, eh? It's clear a lot of supporters can't see the problem. I'm sure they'll be the first to bleat if they're watching awful meetings with riders being hopelessly mismatched. Mind you, as long as their team wins I guess they'll be happy.... Do you think the BSPA are trying to come up with a non competitive race format then ? I assume the opposite would actually be the case... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Daniel Smith 5,709 Posted February 8, 2014 Of course not knowing the race format isn't the problem. Good lord I do wonder if some of you can actually read! The problem is coming up with a sensible format. Can't you understand that simple difference? Try understanding the problem before shooting your mouth off and trying to ridicule others, eh? It's clear a lot of supporters can't see the problem. I'm sure they'll be the first to bleat if they're watching awful meetings with riders being hopelessly mismatched. Mind you, as long as their team wins I guess they'll be happy.... ^^^^^ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
