BWitcher 12,453 Posted April 5, 2016 (edited) or that Killer failed to avoid him ...a view that the ref took And which happened first? Yet again it depends if you think Killer should have hit him .....as others have said if had missed him the race would have carried on ....the ref in this case righty or wrongly thought by killer hitting him that he was the cause of the stoppage not Dudek . as I said it's all about opinions It's not, the rules are quite clear. The PRIMARY cause of the stoppage is to go, that was Dudek. Slowing dramatically is dangerous riding. What would have happened had Kildemand had managed to avoid him and hit the fence and crashed? Would you still be saying Kildemand to go? Same principle. Dudek's slowing was the cause of all subsequent events. Edited to add: Anyway, it's one where we will all have our own views and won't persuade each other I suppose. It's 'fortunate' it occurred in this kind of meeting, could you imagine if that happened in a GP, with a World Title on the line? Edited April 5, 2016 by BWitcher Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Starman2006 2,354 Posted April 5, 2016 Dudek did nothing wrong. He pulled over and raised his hands to signal an ef. Unfortunately Kildemands view was blocked and he didnt see Dudek until it was too late and the crash ensued. The cause of the crash is Dudek, as he stopped racing due to an ef and not Kildemand who was the innocent victim of Dudeks ef. So Dudek is to blame for causing the stoppage, as if he was under power the crash would not have occured. I was watching it live and was disgusted at the refs call. Whether Dudek was still rolling or not he was clearly not under power and therefore the cause of the whole incident. Hear what your saying Steve, it happened so fast, but under the referees ruling im sure he would say Dudek caused the stoppage. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
orion 7,615 Posted April 5, 2016 And which happened first? It's not, the rules are quite clear. The PRIMARY cause of the stoppage is to go, that was Dudek. Slowing dramatically is dangerous riding. What would have happened had Kildemand had managed to avoid him and hit the fence and crashed? Would you still be saying Kildemand to go? Same principle. Dudek's slowing was the cause of all subsequent events. Edited to add: Anyway, it's one where we will all have our own views and won't persuade each other I suppose. It's 'fortunate' it occurred in this kind of meeting, could you imagine if that happened in a GP, with a World Title on the line? Don't get me wrong I tend to agree with you about Dudek's being excluded ...all I was doing was playing devil's advocate and how and why the ref made his choice . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ColinMills 1,728 Posted April 5, 2016 becoming a habit,i am agreeing with orion yet again! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fromafar 10,368 Posted April 5, 2016 Assuming Polish rules are the same as the UK, technically Kildeman was rightfully excluded. He was the cause of the stoppage, if he hadn't ridden into the back of Dudek the race would have carried on. The fact he didn't see Dudek is immaterial. I'm not saying the decision was morally right but can't fault it technically. Dudek certainly didn't cause the stoppage and did everything correctly as he raised his arm to signify he had a problem, there was no way he could know or prevent Kildemanns view being obscured Cant agree with you on that one.He cause the crash by stopping before the end of the race and blocking Kildemands racing line if want to look at it another way.Glad it was not more serious looked nasty. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Steve Shovlar 10,439 Posted April 5, 2016 Hear what your saying Steve, it happened so fast, but under the referees ruling im sure he would say Dudek caused the stoppage. No you are not hearing what I am saying. the ref excluded Kildemand not Dudek. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Starman2006 2,354 Posted April 5, 2016 No you are not hearing what I am saying. the ref excluded Kildemand not Dudek. But it should have been the other way round. We are not saying it was intentional, but he was the cause of the stoppage. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ColinMills 1,728 Posted April 5, 2016 id guess some refs have a difference of opinion on that one Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brewer 159 Posted April 5, 2016 someone having an engine failure does not cause a race to be stopped, someone crashing into someone else because they are not aware of what is happening in front of them does stop a race. the fact that dudek was clearly signalling from the exit of bend 4 and trying to keep out of the way shows kildemand was not aware or looking, he is a reckless rider at the best of times imo, he even moved over more to the right which made it worse, and you can see him lift his head at the last second. pk rightly excluded. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grachan 7,362 Posted April 5, 2016 Personally I think Dudek should have been excluded. But... If you are in your car out on the road, the car ahead of you stops suddenly and you drive into the back of them, who is legally seen to be at fault? The car behind, that's who. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fromafar 10,368 Posted April 5, 2016 Personally I think Dudek should have been excluded. But... If you are in your car out on the road, the car ahead of you stops suddenly and you drive into the back of them, who is legally seen to be at fault? The car behind, that's who. Your are not racing the car in front though! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Starman2006 2,354 Posted April 5, 2016 Personally I think Dudek should have been excluded. But... If you are in your car out on the road, the car ahead of you stops suddenly and you drive into the back of them, who is legally seen to be at fault? The car behind, that's who. Thats right, You are.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BWitcher 12,453 Posted April 5, 2016 Personally I think Dudek should have been excluded. But... If you are in your car out on the road, the car ahead of you stops suddenly and you drive into the back of them, who is legally seen to be at fault? The car behind, that's who. Correct.. but cars have brakes.. speedway bikes don't... someone having an engine failure does not cause a race to be stopped, someone crashing into someone else because they are not aware of what is happening in front of them does stop a race. the fact that dudek was clearly signalling from the exit of bend 4 and trying to keep out of the way shows kildemand was not aware or looking, he is a reckless rider at the best of times imo, he even moved over more to the right which made it worse, and you can see him lift his head at the last second. pk rightly excluded. "He even moved over to the right" lol. Do you watch must speedway? You always move over to the right at that point for the entrance to the corner. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
E I Addio 15,845 Posted April 5, 2016 Personally I think Dudek should have been excluded. But... If you are in your car out on the road, the car ahead of you stops suddenly and you drive into the back of them, who is legally seen to be at fault? The car behind, that's who. The Highway Code requires you to keep a safe distance from the car in front, and to only overtake when it is safe to do so. Those rules don't apply in any form of motor racing. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SCB 0 Posted April 5, 2016 So to confirm, I'm a speedway rider I have an engine failure. Rather than pulling onto the centre green I should roll around on the racing line, possibly even come to a stop on the racing line. That's all fine then? If someone hits me they're excluded? So what if a rider is right behind me and I just shut off? Who's fault? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
