Bt Coverage

[PHILIPRISING 7,298]

Apologies for the way an innocent comment about the need for decent stadia got hijacked in that way, especially when the key subject here is so important for the future of the sport. If only people would actually read what is posted and not make assumptions.

 

To get back on topic, re Vastervik, it is so true that you can you can only put cameras where you can. To me though it's too easy to rely on a very high, wide shot. The real test of camerawork is at close quarters, keeping framing and focus right while fast panning. I thoroughly enjoyed both SWC meetings - great coverage with the scores keeping it fascinating and the racing on Tuesday being exceptional. I may have missed it but one key interview question should have been to Hans Nielsen "Where now?"

 

Obviously on Tuesday BT were carrying the international feed as with an SGP. Was there a different international feed to BT's live on-site coverage at King's Lynn with the Suzi Perry/Scott Nicholls/Natalie Quirk work being only for BT viewers?

 

Is it possible to know who's providing the facilities in Leszno?

ONLY BT viewers were able to see Perry, Nicholls, Quirk at KL ... they do not go out on the world feed. The same for Vastervik and the SGPs (and indeed Leszno) when only British viewers see Natalie and Scott in the BT studio.

 

Steve Saint will as usual be the producer in Leszno using a Polish production team (guys who do the SGPs) - cameras, director, etc. There are no breaks in the world feed so while UK viewers are seeing N/S or commercials and other countries are taking a break Messrs Tatum and Pearson just keep rattling along, often for a three-hour stint.

[steve roberts 9,246]

At the risk of having to repeat myself yet again, great racing in a squalid stadium will please the devoted fan but repel the general public.

 

Yes we want great racing but you HAVE to meet the needs of the uncommitted to get them to comer back.

 

There was a transport museum that had a superb collection, absolutely fascinating, stowed in filthy sheds with unmade floors. Loos were a couple of portaloos. They couldn't work out why they could only attract a small number of people. Then they built a proper toilet block, comfortable cafe and a great, clean display hall. They are booming. Before the husbands were delighted to go but the wives couldn't wait to get out. Now they sit in the cafe and let them get on with it.

 

If facilities don't matter and all you need is an entertaining product why aren't films shown in fields?

 

Now can you please finally read this:

 

I was talking about STADIA, not the tracks when I made my comment about the need for covered accommodation! Surely that's clear enough?

You might be happy, but plenty more wouldn't. Sadly we can't survive just on people prepared to put up with grass banks.

 

You're taking the point of view of a speedway supporter. I've stood in many a basic stadium. I remember being one of many Rockets fans at Scunthorpe jumping up to celebrate a win - and finding ourselves sinking right through the dirt terracing when we landed. That was 38 years ago!

 

There was another 'midden' when one of the best views of the circuit was standing up in the gents loos. That was 40 years ago.

 

Time's moved on. It's all very well saying what YOU want but what about people who need to be brought into the sport?

 

This silly discussion really does illustrate that it's not just the promoters who can be accused of having their heads in the sand.

 

We have to find new supporters. We might find them but we won't keep them if we offer facilities that were embarrassing 40 years ago!

Maybe for you, but what about the general public?

 

I really cannot believe this discussion. Of course we need good racing but we also need to wise up to why it's only the diehards that still go.

That was obviously the case once upon a time but as you say things are very different now with people's expectations.

 

Not sure how it can be changed, however, considering that many promotions only rent/lease their stadiums.

 

I used to watch 'The Rebels' during their three seasons at Wood Lane and the stadium was magnificent...so was the racing sometimes...but it didn't offer the best view in many people's eyes. Trouble is that stadiums like White City, Wimbledon, Crayford, Oxford and now Coventry amongst many others have disappeared for differing reasons and the fan base is no longer there to be able to construct a stadium that compares with non-league/amateur football never mind premiership standard.

 

Football received many incentives from successive Governments but, alas, speedway and/or greyhound stadiums were left to fend for themselves.

 

I've not been to the new Belle Vue so can't comment but Hyde Road offered tremendous racing in a stadium that was beginning to show it's age and suffered thru' the Taylor Report amongst other things.

 

Really chicken and egg scenario and I, for one, have no answers however basic facilities like toilets and catering are a must and I do remember on my visits around the country that these basic needs varied considerably!

Edited July 6, 2017 by steve roberts

[OveFundinFan 4,143]

 

Really chicken and egg scenario and I, for one, have no answers however basic facilities like toilets and catering are a must and I do remember on my visits around the country that these basic needs varied considerably!

 

Apart from having a RACE track its these basic facilities like toilets and catering that MUST have attention paid to them.

Who wants to travel even a modest distance, never mind an away fan who may have travelled 60, 80, 100 mile or more, turning up to dingy smelly toilets. Long term hire (or purchase) of portacabins with flushing loos should not be out of the question. Catering facilities - way beyond a greasy burger now, people want and expect healthy snack/sandwiches.

These things are an investment for the future.

If your in business, you got to meet the needs of the customers you want to attract.

Speedway is living in the past generally speaking, and the past didnt go well for the dinosaurs.

[waytogo28 2,054]

This is so true!

If you want more people to go then fix the damn tracks.

(Message to Naysayers, yes I will keep banging this drum about crap tracks because it's the fundamental problem.)

The racing tonight at Vastervik was light years ahead of what you got at Lynn the other night.

King's Lynn needs reshaping, a one-line wonder.

 

The track at Vastervik allowed those riders who really wanted to try to pass, to succeed ( and often be re-passed! ) What we saw at KL was almost a different kind of sport to what we saw at Vastervik. Passing was almost impossible at KL - sadly.

[steve roberts 9,246]

 

Apart from having a RACE track its these basic facilities like toilets and catering that MUST have attention paid to them.

Who wants to travel even a modest distance, never mind an away fan who may have travelled 60, 80, 100 mile or more, turning up to dingy smelly toilets. Long term hire (or purchase) of portacabins with flushing loos should not be out of the question. Catering facilities - way beyond a greasy burger now, people want and expect healthy snack/sandwiches.

These things are an investment for the future.

If your in business, you got to meet the needs of the customers you want to attract.

Speedway is living in the past generally speaking, and the past didnt go well for the dinosaurs.

....I agree with most of your points however dinosaurs were hugely successful living in various guises for hundreds of million years before becoming extinct...which is more than the human race will achieve or, indeed, the sport of speedway!

Edited July 6, 2017 by steve roberts

[PHILIPRISING 7,298]

 

The track at Vastervik allowed those riders who really wanted to try to pass, to succeed ( and often be re-passed! ) What we saw at KL was almost a different kind of sport to what we saw at Vastervik. Passing was almost impossible at KL - sadly.

NOT sure that is totally fair. You wouldn't really expect most of the USA or Czech team to pass riders from Australia and GB. Craig Cook passed a few but overall I agree with your sentiments.

 

Sadly, the track at Saddlebow Road (as I remember it) is no longer the great racing circuit it once was, especially when events like the Commonwealth Final and test matches were held there. I remember Kelvin Tatum telling me how much he loved going there and that was common amongst all riders.

 

I have no pretence to be a track expert but during my days as Assistant Race Director of the SGP and SWC to Ole Olsen and especially Tony Olson I learned a lot. I was actually RD at two and a half (just practice day) SGPs and ran SWC practice at KL when TO was delayed and on one occasion actually took the reins for the whole meeting when he wasn't there. During those events at KL I had many a discussion with Buster Chapman about the track and often had to allay the fears of the referee who feared it would not be ready (after morning practice) for the main show in the evening.

 

On the occasion that I was RD I had to pull rank (no easy task) on Buster to allow the USA team their full practice allotment. We were running late and he told me that if the Yanks went out again there would be no meeting that night. For a moment I thought I had blown the meeting but Clerk of the Course Sean simply said give him a few minutes to calm down and it will be fine.

 

Buster worked for hours on end (under a blazing sun) to completely relay the track. No one could fault his work ethic but there was a feeling that the material then (and maybe now) being used on the track was not really conducive to lots of passing.

[speedibee 3,091]

ONLY BT viewers were able to see Perry, Nicholls, Quirk at KL ... they do not go out on the world feed. The same for Vastervik and the SGPs (and indeed Leszno) when only British viewers see Natalie and Scott in the BT studio.

 

Steve Saint will as usual be the producer in Leszno using a Polish production team (guys who do the SGPs) - cameras, director, etc. There are no breaks in the world feed so while UK viewers are seeing N/S or commercials and other countries are taking a break Messrs Tatum and Pearson just keep rattling along, often for a three-hour stint.

thank goodness Perry couldn't be seen by the rest of Europe , saved british sports broadcasting and speedway being embarrassed by her airheaded incompetence

[flagrag 704]

I am a little surprised with GB in final and given they have had a weeks notice that BT have not moved the presentation to be live from the track as could still use Natalie and Scott with Brando to do some BT interviews in the pits.

[oldace 1,678]

 

 

I've not been to the new Belle Vue so can't comment but Hyde Road offered tremendous racing in a stadium that was beginning to show it's age and suffered thru' the Taylor Report amongst other things.

 

 

The Taylor report was in the aftermath of Hillsborough in 1989 and was published in 1990. Hyde Road was demolished in 1987. Valley Parade in 1985 was really the death knell for Hyde Road

[iris123 20,997]

ONLY BT viewers were able to see Perry, Nicholls, Quirk at KL ... they do not go out on the world feed. The same for Vastervik and the SGPs (and indeed Leszno) when only British viewers see Natalie and Scott in the BT studio.

 

 

World feed was amusing.Don't remember the name of the woman doing the interviews in between Kelv and Shouty,but she was a bit off putting.The question of the night must have been after the first 4 heats talking to Hans and at the end she asked him what the plan was for the rest of the meeting.Even Hans couldn't stop himself from laughing and said "win every heat!!!"

[racers and royals 8,736]

World feed was amusing.Don't remember the name of the woman doing the interviews in between Kelv and Shouty,but she was a bit off putting.The question of the night must have been after the first 4 heats talking to Hans and at the end she asked him what the plan was for the rest of the meeting.Even Hans couldn't stop himself from laughing and said "win every heat!!!"

We saw that- I think it was Morgan Andersson.

[iris123 20,997]

We saw that- I think it was Morgan Andersson.

No,it was definitely a woman interviewing Hans.Think Morgan had more important things to do

[Stoke Potter 242]

At the risk of having to repeat myself yet again, great racing in a squalid stadium will please the devoted fan but repel the general public.

 

Yes we want great racing but you HAVE to meet the needs of the uncommitted to get them to comer back.

 

This silly discussion really does illustrate that it's not just the promoters who can be accused of having their heads in the sand.

 

We have to find new supporters. We might find them but we won't keep them if we offer facilities that were embarrassing 40 years ago!

Maybe for you, but what about the general public?

 

I really cannot believe this discussion. Of course we need good racing but we also need to wise up to why it's only the diehards that still go.

Perhaps, instead of keeping repeating yourself, you should take a step back and attempt to understand what is being said. You may then realise that it's you who is missing the point.

Yes, times have moved on and people want better facilities, agreed. BUT there is no point having "nicer" facilities if the key part of any speedway facility, i.e. THE TRACK, is not conducive to good racing and too many in this country are not.

There would be no point in spending x thousands on, for example, King's Lynn's facilities and not spending anything on improving the track. You would've improved the surroundings, you would not have improved the key thing on offer, the Speedway Racing!

 

So first of all, you invest in improving the tracks. If you actually start offering decent racing on a regular basis, you will get more people going, i.e. those people that used to go but don't anymore because the racing's no good. Then, with improved crowds, you might be in a position to start in investing in improved facilities which then, following your theory, will bring in more of the general public and you actually stand a chance of keeping them because they are now watching something exciting!

[PHILIPRISING 7,298]

World feed was amusing.Don't remember the name of the woman doing the interviews in between Kelv and Shouty,but she was a bit off putting.The question of the night must have been after the first 4 heats talking to Hans and at the end she asked him what the plan was for the rest of the meeting.Even Hans couldn't stop himself from laughing and said "win every heat!!!"

AGREE. BSI are alternating between two female interviewers. I think it was Amy on Tuesday and she is not a patch on Natalie for example.

[RobMcCaffery 2,752]

Perhaps, instead of keeping repeating yourself, you should take a step back and attempt to understand what is being said. You may then realise that it's you who is missing the point.

Yes, times have moved on and people want better facilities, agreed. BUT there is no point having "nicer" facilities if the key part of any speedway facility, i.e. THE TRACK, is not conducive to good racing and too many in this country are not.

There would be no point in spending x thousands on, for example, King's Lynn's facilities and not spending anything on improving the track. You would've improved the surroundings, you would not have improved the key thing on offer, the Speedway Racing!

 

So first of all, you invest in improving the tracks. If you actually start offering decent racing on a regular basis, you will get more people going, i.e. those people that used to go but don't anymore because the racing's no good. Then, with improved crowds, you might be in a position to start in investing in improved facilities which then, following your theory, will bring in more of the general public and you actually stand a chance of keeping them because they are now watching something exciting!

No, you are choosing to ignore what I have said.

 

One final time, hopefully, and perhaps you might bother to read this time.

 

If we are talking overall about stadium and track then racing is all-important.

 

If we are talking about the stadium alone, facilities are essential.

 

I really, really cannot see how much more simply I can put it. I was talking about stadia, you were talking about tracks. Now I really do have better things to do than try to teach you basic logic. If you wish to carry on wittering on in a desperate attempt to score points please feel free. I won't see them. Life's too short.

 

I will remind you this thread is about BT Sport's coverage. If I'd known I'd run up against such stupidity I would never have mentioned stadium facilities. More fool me for trusting the BSF, eh? In should have learned a long time ago that when you do try to have a serious conversation someone will wade in, miss the point then obsessively try to score points until they achieve a 'win'.

ONLY BT viewers were able to see Perry, Nicholls, Quirk at KL ... they do not go out on the world feed. The same for Vastervik and the SGPs (and indeed Leszno) when only British viewers see Natalie and Scott in the BT studio.

 

Steve Saint will as usual be the producer in Leszno using a Polish production team (guys who do the SGPs) - cameras, director, etc. There are no breaks in the world feed so while UK viewers are seeing N/S or commercials and other countries are taking a break Messrs Tatum and Pearson just keep rattling along, often for a three-hour stint.

Thanks Philip. I was aware that the studio work is only for BT viewers but was unsure about the rare instance of live presentation from the track of a BSI event, after all it only happens with the SWC and Cardiff.

 

I often watch the world feed - there are ways - simultaneously with the BT coverage, just to see the variances. Hence my comments about BT only taking a few of the world feed interviews. Unfortunately I've had to watch the SWC on time delay so just wished to check on the set-up at King's Lynn.

 

As you might imagine, my interest in the TV coverage of the sport lies in the actual techniques as well as the sport itself. My professional involvement may only have been brief and a long time ago but as I've mentioned before, broadcasting technique and the industry and its history are amongst my many other non-speedway interests. Thank you for your guidance.

 

And with that it is time to end my participation with this topic.

Edited July 6, 2017 by Rob McCaffery