stevehone 3,429 Posted October 18, 2017 I have a bit of sympathy for them as 5 are injured and injuries cant be helped but the other 2 going on holiday is just not on and both should be fined ,I dont care if its a re aranged fixture , they have all winter to go on holiday , just another example of riders taking the pee especially as the season is officially until October 31st, unless it's changed since i signed a speedway contract 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ch958 2,395 Posted October 18, 2017 The minimum/maximum points limit should be scrapped and a much simpler A, B & C grading system introduced for SIX-MAN teams. As there is a shortage of riders, adopt a new race formula tailored to six-man teams (it was used before back in the 60s, I think). Put riders into three different categories, based on their final averages, and let promoters sign whoever they want but they must choose TWO riders from each grade. For example: GRADE A: 8.00-12.00 GRADE B: 6.00-7.99 GRADE C: 0.00-5.99 All foreign newcomers to be given a Grade B rating Cut out all this throwing races nonsense to lower averages and teams being ripped apart over tiny margins of team averages. Keep it simple. like this idea but would go A 0 - 4.00, B 4.01- 7.5, then above for C but its all arguable isn't it - the basic idea is simple and sound I commend it to the house 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
martinmauger 584 Posted October 19, 2017 Spot on do away with fixed gate positions fixed riding order double points double up and down and guests That ^^. And let team manager place riders where they like in a team line up, as long as the 2 lowest average riders are at reserve. E.g. If Adams wishes to use Lindgren at no.5, let him, assuming he rides in the UK in 2018. Would prefer a return of the old 'tac sub' rule, but probably not going to happen on cost grounds. But - if the 'dreaded' tactical ride rule (not a fan of) is retained, as it almost certainly will, then double points should only apply if a rider wins the heat, and also allow 2 'tr's' per match. And for goodness sake sort out the fixture list, clubs not staging home meets for 4-5 weeks, especially in Summer months / school hols, then 3 per week in September to complete fixtures is ridiculous.... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steve roberts 9,246 Posted October 19, 2017 The minimum/maximum points limit should be scrapped and a much simpler A, B & C grading system introduced for SIX-MAN teams. As there is a shortage of riders, adopt a new race formula tailored to six-man teams (it was used before back in the 60s, I think). Put riders into three different categories, based on their final averages, and let promoters sign whoever they want but they must choose TWO riders from each grade. For example: GRADE A: 8.00-12.00 GRADE B: 6.00-7.99 GRADE C: 0.00-5.99 All foreign newcomers to be given a Grade B rating Cut out all this throwing races nonsense to lower averages and teams being ripped apart over tiny margins of team averages. Keep it simple. I vaguely recall a grading system was tried some years back? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gambo 1,341 Posted October 19, 2017 The minimum/maximum points limit should be scrapped and a much simpler A, B & C grading system introduced for SIX-MAN teams. As there is a shortage of riders, adopt a new race formula tailored to six-man teams (it was used before back in the 60s, I think). Put riders into three different categories, based on their final averages, and let promoters sign whoever they want but they must choose TWO riders from each grade. For example: GRADE A: 8.00-12.00 GRADE B: 6.00-7.99 GRADE C: 0.00-5.99 All foreign newcomers to be given a Grade B rating Cut out all this throwing races nonsense to lower averages and teams being ripped apart over tiny margins of team averages. Keep it simple. And the 'Money' team would have 2 x 12 + 2 x 7.99 + 2 x 5.99 = 51.96 The 'just keeping afloat' team would have 2 x 8 + 2 x 6 + 2 x 3 = 34.00 Been tried before and it doesn't work. 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grand Central 2,654 Posted October 19, 2017 (edited) And the 'Money' team would have 2 x 12 + 2 x 7.99 + 2 x 5.99 = 51.96 The 'just keeping afloat' team would have 2 x 8 + 2 x 6 + 2 x 3 = 34.00 Been tried before and it doesn't work. Absolutely spot on. The 'grading system' would be utterly futile. The only sensible sytem is to use averages without bonuses for team building with a ponts limit of 42 points for seven man teams over 15 heats. The match point system currently operating, with a minor tweek, would then sustain interest in matches and reward away teams who keep the scores close. No Joker rides needed. If people want simple. That is not complicated. Edited October 19, 2017 by Grand Central 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ch958 2,395 Posted October 19, 2017 the money teams will fiddle whatever system is in place - at least this is simple (ish) and i do beleive it is used elsewhere Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reliant Robin 492 Posted October 19, 2017 the money teams will fiddle whatever system is in place - at least this is simple (ish) and i do beleive it is used elsewhere Has it been used in Denmark? Potentially with squads so they can utilise either 1 x A, 1 x B and 2 x C or 3 x B and 1 x C. Could be way off, but I'm sure it was something along those lines Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Woz01 3,589 Posted October 19, 2017 the money teams will fiddle whatever system is in place - at least this is simple (ish) and i do beleive it is used elsewhere Yes a team with money are likely to rise to the top but grading will make it far easier for them while at the same time clubs who are not as well off will struggle further. Averages work, no need to change that, it just needs to be applied correctly. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The White Knight 9,039 Posted October 19, 2017 Absolutely spot on. The 'grading system' would be utterly futile. The only sensible sytem is to use averages without bonuses for team building with a ponts limit of 42 points for seven man teams over 15 heats. The match point system currently operating, with a minor tweek, would then sustain interest in matches and reward away teams who keep the scores close. No Joker rides needed. If people want simple. That is not complicated. Good Post. I think that is the way to go. Joker ride - well the answer is in the name - a JOKE!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ghosty 500 Posted October 20, 2017 The minimum/maximum points limit should be scrapped and a much simpler A, B & C grading system introduced for SIX-MAN teams. As there is a shortage of riders, adopt a new race formula tailored to six-man teams (it was used before back in the 60s, I think). Put riders into three different categories, based on their final averages, and let promoters sign whoever they want but they must choose TWO riders from each grade. For example: GRADE A: 8.00-12.00 GRADE B: 6.00-7.99 GRADE C: 0.00-5.99 All foreign newcomers to be given a Grade B rating Cut out all this throwing races nonsense to lower averages and teams being ripped apart over tiny margins of team averages. Keep it simple. Nothing simpler than the existing system, there are 101 things that need sorting in speedway but riders & team averages are best left as they are. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TonyMac 720 Posted October 20, 2017 Nothing simpler than the existing system, there are 101 things that need sorting in speedway but riders & team averages are best left as they are. There probably are more than 101 things that need sorting but isn't it the averages - and manipulation of them - that are at the root of many of the shenanigans, relentless swathe of team changes in mid-season and other problems that currently beset the sport in the UK? 5 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bald Bloke 3,287 Posted October 20, 2017 And the 'Money' team would have 2 x 12 + 2 x 7.99 + 2 x 5.99 = 51.96 The 'just keeping afloat' team would have 2 x 8 + 2 x 6 + 2 x 3 = 34.00 Been tried before and it doesn't work. Agree Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Humphrey Appleby 13,958 Posted October 20, 2017 There probably are more than 101 things that need sorting but isn't it the averages - and manipulation of them - that are at the root of many of the shenanigans, relentless swathe of team changes in mid-season and other problems that currently beset the sport in the UK? They are the effect, but not the underlying cause. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trees 2,814 Posted October 21, 2017 There probably are more than 101 things that need sorting but isn't it the averages - and manipulation of them - that are at the root of many of the shenanigans, relentless swathe of team changes in mid-season and other problems that currently beset the sport in the UK? If the promoters have agreed on Mondays and Thursdays only it must help a great deal, no clashes with other countries, no clashes with Championship teams, they can get the fixtures lists out earlier etc. Listened on the radio today to a bloke called Fred Sirieix who is general manager of Michelin-starred restaurant Galvin at Windows at the London Hilton. He has helped launch the Right Course which teaches prisoners about the 'service industry'. The whole of British Speedway could learn from this guy but at the end of the day everyone concerned needs to put themselves in the shoes of each other and treat one another respectively ......... it's really not rocket science. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites