ouch 1,200 Posted August 8, 2023 Any club that gives a debut to a superstar that isn’t covering for a badly injured rider, three weeks or so before the play off cut off are just grim individuals. Doesn’t sit well with me and I’m not bothered if it goes against the grain on here, we’ll never agree on this. Play fair or not at all in my book. Many ex fans feel the same way. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BackInTheDHSS 123 Posted August 8, 2023 6 minutes ago, ouch said: Any club that gives a debut to a superstar that isn’t covering for a badly injured rider, three weeks or so before the play off cut off are just grim individuals. Doesn’t sit well with me and I’m not bothered if it goes against the grain on here, we’ll never agree on this. Play fair or not at all in my book. Many ex fans feel the same way. You can't blame the clubs. They want to win and will do what it takes to achieve that, otherwise they might as well just give up now. It may not sit right with some people (me included, to be fair), but the ones to blame are those running the sport and allowing it to happen. 4 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikebv 10,381 Posted August 8, 2023 16 minutes ago, ouch said: Any club that gives a debut to a superstar that isn’t covering for a badly injured rider, three weeks or so before the play off cut off are just grim individuals. Doesn’t sit well with me and I’m not bothered if it goes against the grain on here, we’ll never agree on this. Play fair or not at all in my book. Many ex fans feel the same way. You could argue that bringing in a rider like Lambert showed that a UK Speedway title must be actually worth winning... The counter argument to that being of course, all the weekly Mickey Mouse goings on that form part of the overall league structure, leading up to the play offs. You cannot suddenly decide "let's have some credibility" five sixths into the season... Personally I think even replacing an injured rider leaves the sport open to manipulation, but, given the way several riders ride for other teams you can see which injuries will be "genuine" as they wont be riding for anyone at all if truly "out for the season" (eg Fricke last year)... And if they do rise "Lazarus like", to ride for another team, then any replacement rider cannot continue ro ride as their replacement, and RR must be the only option, if you don't bring the rider back.. I would like to see Robert Lambert ride over here, and Woffy to stay even if Holder returns, as it means lots of good racing and very decent crowds indeed pretty much guaranteed.. Not sure it takes any shine off the trophy either to be honest, given there isn't really too much of one on there to begin with.. It would boost the profile of the sport though without doubt, which is the most important thing.. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
False dawn 2,307 Posted August 8, 2023 There would seem to be a feeling that clubs should not be allowed to make changes to their line up during the season, for strategic reasons anyway. Its a hard one isn't it? I guess we're from a different era when there were few changes mid season. There weren't none, as I recall, but it tended to be a foreign second string back in the day. Now we have teams top riders being swapped out with the playoffs coming up. Long term injuries are one thing, but the wholesale heat leader changes really don't sit well, do they? As an example, I will quote Bomber. I haven't gone through my copious records, but I wonder when he was ever dropped mid season. Oh I know he's not the very best anymore, but he is still winning races and just when you want him to. Dropping him doesn't sit right. We used to think that losing a key rider to injury was just bad luck. Now we'll build a team to "just win" regardless of allegiance. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TTT 1,273 Posted August 8, 2023 Leicester will be playing a very dangerous game if they turn Lawson over for a British Speedway user in Robert Lambert. P*sh off too many loyal riders to British Speedway and they won't sign for the club again, Riders like Lambert don't give a stuff about the British league and they only do a few meetings to make a few extra grand once their Polish season draws to a close. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Call me wolfie 677 Posted August 8, 2023 10 minutes ago, TTT said: Leicester will be playing a very dangerous game if they turn Lawson over for a British Speedway user in Robert Lambert. P*sh off too many loyal riders to British Speedway and they won't sign for the club again, Riders like Lambert don't give a stuff about the British league and they only do a few meetings to make a few extra grand once their Polish season draws to a close. What’s really annoying is when it happened last year I honestly thought they would close the loophole so it couldn’t be done again. However what they’ve actually done is make it possible to change your team virtually at the end of the season, and not just for injuries but anyone, such as Lawson, who has earnt his team a spot in the playoffs. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikebv 10,381 Posted August 8, 2023 27 minutes ago, Call me wolfie said: What’s really annoying is when it happened last year I honestly thought they would close the loophole so it couldn’t be done again. However what they’ve actually done is make it possible to change your team virtually at the end of the season, and not just for injuries but anyone, such as Lawson, who has earnt his team a spot in the playoffs. But isn't that the whole point of sport? To win? Maybe a transfer deadline of July end would be better with a maximum of two redeclarations per season..? One at the end of May to still have enough time to maybe be successful for those struggling, and end of July? With one change allowed post July for season ending injuries to the No1, with anyone else injured, then RR used.. Bottom line is, that to take the sport seriously, (in the UK), there needs to be something worth winning, and bringing over top talent enhances that position... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
iainb 5,198 Posted August 8, 2023 1 minute ago, mikebv said: But isn't that the whole point of sport? To win? Maybe a transfer deadline of July end would be better with a maximum of two redeclarations per season..? One at the end of May to still have enough time to maybe be successful for those struggling, and end of July? With one change allowed post July for season ending injuries to the No1, with anyone else injured, then RR used.. Bottom line is, that to take the sport seriously, (in the UK), there needs to be something worth winning, and bringing over top talent enhances that position... Maybe a specific number of changes allowed per season... like 1 tac sub per match, maybe 3 allowed team changes per season, or something like that Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaksey 348 Posted August 8, 2023 Clearly if this is true then Leicester want to go out with a play off win and as they've said they won't be running the club next season there are no wider considerations for them. Good teams make changes and win things, see Poole.. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
iainb 5,198 Posted August 8, 2023 (edited) 3 minutes ago, noaksey said: Clearly if this is true then Leicester want to go out with a play off win and as they've said they won't be running the club next season there are no wider considerations for them. Good teams make changes and win things, see Poole.. Only Poole have had one of the most settled teams over the last few years Edited August 8, 2023 by iainb Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Big Al 710 Posted August 9, 2023 On 8/7/2023 at 2:59 PM, justathought said: Lawsons not going anywhere. Dont be so bloody daft Doesn't it depend on how "ruthless" the Lions management decide to be, in ambitions to take this season as far as possible? They've already done it a couple of times so far, but doing what some are speculating with regards to Lawson, would be a different level. Personally, I'm not keen on them doing it, but as to what might happen it's not up to me! But you could have inside knowledge of the management's intentions of course. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaksey 348 Posted August 9, 2023 16 hours ago, iainb said: Only Poole have had one of the most settled teams over the last few years Only: Poole have made changes previously to increase their chances of winning things the fact that they've not done ot at a lower level f late isn't relevant Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
arnieg 3,697 Posted August 9, 2023 7 minutes ago, noaksey said: Only: Poole have made changes previously to increase their chances of winning things the fact that they've not done ot at a lower level f late isn't relevant Excepting a few time-bound dispensation/facilities coming to an end, isn't every change by every team made with the intention of increasing the chances of winning things (even if it's only the great A47 wooden spoon derby) 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
noaksey 348 Posted August 9, 2023 37 minutes ago, arnieg said: Excepting a few time-bound dispensation/facilities coming to an end, isn't every change by every team made with the intention of increasing the chances of winning things (even if it's only the great A47 wooden spoon derby) Absolutely but people were talking about loopholes and restricted nunber of changes, clubs that want to win things are generally ruthless and why shouldn't they be Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Big Al 710 Posted August 9, 2023 1 hour ago, noaksey said: Absolutely but people were talking about loopholes and restricted nunber of changes, clubs that want to win things are generally ruthless and why shouldn't they be Ruthless + shrewd judgement + business acumen generally gets it done. And a good dose of luck. Leicester since 2019 have generally had all of those, but Poole have been the masters of them for a long time any no-one else has got close - yet 2 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
