piston197 Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 9 minutes ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said: Standardise engines is more problematic in speedway because unlike other motorsports it has 100% wheel spin where all other sports are 100% direct drive, engines can be made the same but if you have a rider like zagar over 6ft and a rider like Ben cook at around 5 foot they clearly require different engine characteristics to work for them, it is possible to get some form of standardisation but there isn’t the will to do it, a classic example of the ridiculous nature of speedway is the rev limiter, it got mooted that they wanted to limit the revs so they asked the tuners and not wanting to hurt their business set the limit at a higher rev than is actually used during a race, so every rider was made to buy a coil per bike with a limiter which in reality does absolutely nothing during a race, you may here it cut in with some riders on the start line but under load it’s not used but if you had a limiter at say 10,000 revs riders and tuners would have kittens Yes agreed, but giving them the option of a couple of practice laps and being able to adjust gearing, carburation & timing on a standard tune/standardised horse power, rev limited engine would allow adjustment for grip/spin in those basic set-ups to alter the suitability according to the riders weight/height/ability Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebv Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 1 hour ago, Ajr said: I hope they remove the play offs to decide league WINNERS IMO it makes all the previous matches and results irrelevant. what's the point of following your team home and away all season? You could win every meeting home and away ,suffer injury to riders prior to semi final or final and potentially end up with nothing. one of the biggest reasons I don't travel away The lack of away fans is one of the major issues the sport has.. Without them, the atmosphere is flat... I remember when "local" teams to BV, (Halifax and Sheffield), would bring several hundred and have 10 coaches and more in the car park.. Meaning a proper "tribal" atmosphere... More of that and maybe "the qualifiers" would be worth attending more? So, how to do it? Well, if we are going radical.. Why not make the away team buy 100 tickets for a tenner and either flog them at that price to their fans, or simply give them away.. Who knows, maybe they could even pay for coaches to get their fans there? 100 away fans, mostly stood or sat together, would add hugely to the evening "off track"... And, if demand ever grew, more tickets could be sold.. Also, whilst in radical mode.. Maybe they should run a "SON" type competition? Six teams (if that is the top league), with their top 3 riders.. Each team holds two rounds over the season and, here's the kicker, again, each team buys 100 tickets at a tenner... 500 away fans in total.. The hosting club could even possibly then knock £5 off 1000 tickets for the home fans with the five grand.. The event will have no guests, no out of their depth juniors, and could be made into the flagship team competition.. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE DEAN MACHINE Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 2 minutes ago, piston197 said: Yes agreed, but giving them the option of a couple of practice laps and being able to adjust gearing, carburation & timing on a standard tune/standardised horse power, rev limited engine would allow adjustment for grip/spin in those basic set-ups to alter the suitability according to the riders weight/height/ability Not as simple as that I’m afraid, some riders like their engines to scream and some like them flat to achieve the same goal, different flywheels, different cams, different compression, these can’t be changed at a track, here is an example I have told a few years ago, I was travelling to a meeting with Adam skornicki and he was telling me at a meeting in Poland his bike packed up before a race and Jason crump lent him his bike for the race and Adam said as much as he was greatful crumps engine was unridable, it just wanted to put him in the fence every lap, yet crump got a maximum on it, both GMs but completely different way of achieving their power delivery and that is completely widespread in speedway today, I’m not saying standardising couldn’t or shouldn’t happen but it’s not a easy as it seems Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcone44 Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 17 minutes ago, mikebv said: The lack of away fans is one of the major issues the sport has.. Without them, the atmosphere is flat... I remember when "local" teams to BV, (Halifax and Sheffield), would bring several hundred and have 10 coaches and more in the car park.. Meaning a proper "tribal" atmosphere... More of that and maybe "the qualifiers" would be worth attending more? So, how to do it? Well, if we are going radical.. Why not make the away team buy 100 tickets for a tenner and either flog them at that price to their fans, or simply give them away.. Who knows, maybe they could even pay for coaches to get their fans there? 100 away fans, mostly stood or sat together, would add hugely to the evening "off track"... And, if demand ever grew, more tickets could be sold.. Also, whilst in radical mode.. Maybe they should run a "SON" type competition? Six teams (if that is the top league), with their top 3 riders.. Each team holds two rounds over the season and, here's the kicker, again, each team buys 100 tickets at a tenner... 500 away fans in total.. The hosting club could even possibly then knock £5 off 1000 tickets for the home fans with the five grand.. The event will have no guests, no out of their depth juniors, and could be made into the flagship team competition.. i do like the sound of that. we do need more fans travelling. shrink the size of the teams ,and no gp riders. im afraid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE DEAN MACHINE Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 33 minutes ago, mikebv said: The lack of away fans is one of the major issues the sport has.. Without them, the atmosphere is flat... I remember when "local" teams to BV, (Halifax and Sheffield), would bring several hundred and have 10 coaches and more in the car park.. Meaning a proper "tribal" atmosphere... More of that and maybe "the qualifiers" would be worth attending more? So, how to do it? Well, if we are going radical.. Why not make the away team buy 100 tickets for a tenner and either flog them at that price to their fans, or simply give them away.. Who knows, maybe they could even pay for coaches to get their fans there? 100 away fans, mostly stood or sat together, would add hugely to the evening "off track"... And, if demand ever grew, more tickets could be sold.. Also, whilst in radical mode.. Maybe they should run a "SON" type competition? Six teams (if that is the top league), with their top 3 riders.. Each team holds two rounds over the season and, here's the kicker, again, each team buys 100 tickets at a tenner... 500 away fans in total.. The hosting club could even possibly then knock £5 off 1000 tickets for the home fans with the five grand.. The event will have no guests, no out of their depth juniors, and could be made into the flagship team competition.. 1st idea brilliant, second idea has already been tried a couple of years back, can’t remember why it failed but from what I remember some riders were less than interested in doing it (Money on offer probably) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambo95 Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 2 hours ago, IainB said: You only had to watch Sedgy stuffing Drew Kemp over the finishing line at Sheffield on Thursday night on BSN (or actually being there, as I was)... instead of Kemp showing Sedgmen his back wheel after the race, and I'm pretty sure most of us were looking for some reaction, all we got was a barely noticeable shake of the head from Kemp as he pulled up back at the pits. Even though I've singled this out, I'm not particularly singling out this incident as Kemp may not be that type of person, but it's symptomatic of the perceived lack of passion of riders riding for teams/clubs. If they don't really give a toss why should we? Again, I stress this is not having a go at either Kemp or Sedgeman. You watch a Football match and players are busting a blood vessel because a throw in hasn't gone their way, Speedway... it's all kisses and cuddles after a race. We perhaps don't want to go down the Football route as that attracts a very different kind of fan but there maybe room for a little more passion in Speedway. If Drew had shown any aggression towards Justin he would have received a fine for bringing the sport into disrepute. When riders have squared up to each other at Berwick they have been fined. Remember Woofy saying last year to just let the riders fight instead of fining the riders. He said that despite all the brilliant races Emil has been involved in over the years, the clip on YouTube that has more views than all of them is the one where he is fighting with Scott Nicholls. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcone44 Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 wouldn't call that a fight.🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE DEAN MACHINE Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Gambo95 said: If Drew had shown any aggression towards Justin he would have received a fine for bringing the sport into disrepute. When riders have squared up to each other at Berwick they have been fined. Remember Woofy saying last year to just let the riders fight instead of fining the riders. He said that despite all the brilliant races Emil has been involved in over the years, the clip on YouTube that has more views than all of them is the one where he is fighting with Scott Nicholls. Bit before my time but I would of loved to go to meetings where jack Millen rode, he knew how to wind a crowd and other riders up Edited June 29 by THE DEAN MACHINE 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noelinho Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 59 minutes ago, mikebv said: The lack of away fans is one of the major issues the sport has.. Without them, the atmosphere is flat... Honestly, we need more home fans before we start worrying about away fans. Travelling fans is also an issue with speedway because of the dependence on the weather. How many people will choose to go from Glasgow to Poole if the weather is a bit iffy? For a playoff final, maybe some will take the risk. In the middle of the season? Probably only if they plan to stay down south for a few days anyway. Pretty much every team doesn't have enough home fans to support their costs. We need to cut costs without cutting meetings, and get more home fans through the gates. Do those two things and you solve a good chunk of the problem. Fail to do those two things and everything else is irrelevant (track ownership/leasing aside, which is probably the third big issue). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YeOldPitGate Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 Matousek v Wilson Wilson was perfect size for a speedway rider I drifted away from sport when he was probably very early 20's he looked a natural talent but from memory he probably never reached the very top for what ever reason. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinh88 Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 I find the reality of Workington last home meeting only amassing 250 supporters really sad. I was hoping to visit in and around my birthday versus Scunthorpe. Fondly remember Workington coming to Berwick in April 2000 and winning 42-48. From memory there was one hell of a turn out from Workington and fortunately managed to go to DP a few years later and the place was rocking with maybe 2-3000 in attendance? 250? Mind boggling..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyler42 Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 5 hours ago, bellevueace said: I totally agree the team aspect has disappeared, i dont know if its because nowadays riders are team mates one night and opponents the next there does feel more familiarity in the pits than there used to be. That edge of real rivalry between teams doesnt exist today. Ive never forgot the scenes in the early 70,s during the heat 13 fracas against Leicester, that passion is nowhere to be found today. Riders were loyal to their clubs as you said it was their club, i could never imagine Wilkie, PC, Mort at another club similar Lee was always associated with Kings Lynn along with Betts, Louis and Sanders at Ipswich etc, but they wernt riding for 3 or 4 clubs every other night. I dont know if it makes a difference but riding against someone on a Monday and then with them as team mates on Tuesday there must be more familiarity. Just a thought you are better qualified to judge if this does have an effect. Teams also used to ride as teams good team riding was common place, nowadays in the main its gate and go and leave your team mate to it, team meetings are now individual with the odd rare exception. 100% agree with everything you have said. Being a Wimbledon fan in my younger days. If Belle Vue were in town you knew Their team PC, Morton etc and that would be the same with all the clubs. Now supporters turn up and 9/10 there will R/R plus a couple of Guest's. We have had in the past Chris Harris Riding for Ipswich in the Semi final of the play offs then riding against them in the final!!!. People outside the sport must think its a proper Micky mouse sport and who can blame them. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE DEAN MACHINE Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 6 minutes ago, Robinh88 said: I find the reality of Workington last home meeting only amassing 250 supporters really sad. I was hoping to visit in and around my birthday versus Scunthorpe. Fondly remember Workington coming to Berwick in April 2000 and winning 42-48. From memory there was one hell of a turn out from Workington and fortunately managed to go to DP a few years later and the place was rocking with maybe 2-3000 in attendance? 250? Mind boggling..... Not being from that area I can only look on from a far but from what I see, they have a no1 who on occasions takes the pee with his performances, another rider who puts Poland before Workington and I can only guess how that makes the worky fans feel, running in an afternoon imo is not great but wouldn’t stop me going, price again is too expensive but again wouldn’t stop me going, no continuity with home meetings is frustrating and in general the team being poor results wise will always affect a crowd, football is a perfect example of that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinh88 Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 4 minutes ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said: Not being from that area I can only look on from a far but from what I see, they have a no1 who on occasions takes the pee with his performances, another rider who puts Poland before Workington and I can only guess how that makes the worky fans feel, running in an afternoon imo is not great but wouldn’t stop me going, price again is too expensive but again wouldn’t stop me going, no continuity with home meetings is frustrating and in general the team being poor results wise will always affect a crowd, football is a perfect example of that Maybe wrong mate but I don't think their crowds were great pre closure in 2018. Went a few times from 2010 onwards, never saw a bad meeting but there was no one there or atmosphere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawk127 Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 1 hour ago, THE DEAN MACHINE said: Bit before my time but I would of loved to go to meetings where jack Millen rode, he knew how to wind a crowd and other riders up Brian Foote when riding for Rayleigh gave Jack as good as Jack dished out. The boos started the moment his name was announced during the team introductions. A hard rider and a great character as was Brian. Ted Hubbard was another hard rider. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IainB Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 52 minutes ago, YeOldPitGate said: Matousek v Wilson Wilson was perfect size for a speedway rider I drifted away from sport when he was probably very early 20's he looked a natural talent but from memory he probably never reached the very top for what ever reason. This was one of my most memorable nights at any Speedway track! Brilliant stuff! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mac101 Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 (edited) You can get 14 new standard engines built and no 2 will be the same and I think these rev limiters are causing more damage as nowadays most riders just go to tapes and give it full throttle till the tapes go up along with the blocked exhaust the engine are under a lot of strain Edited June 29 by mac101 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoff100 Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 9 minutes ago, Robinh88 said: Maybe wrong mate but I don't think their crowds were great pre closure in 2018. Went a few times from 2010 onwards, never saw a bad meeting but there was no one there or atmosphere. Way off their the atmosphere with max and hoggy on the mikes was allways good at derwent park,just missing a comets war cry at northside 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poole keith Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 All moto2 engines made,sealed and serviced by triumph,moto3 Honda or ktm sealed engines,but of course wouldn't work in speedway!! why can't a sport run by amateurs learn from the professionals 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bellevueace Posted June 29 Report Share Posted June 29 4 hours ago, MattB said: That's because British Speedway has become so woke and doesn't want anything controversial because "we don't want to see that". Exactly then people complain about the lack of characters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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