YeOldPitGate

Whats he supposed to have done now Blobby ?

Fair point but you get my drift if you could do away with it, it shows there is still a market for the sport (in this case even as you say where 5 are doubling up).

Didn't go to the meeting so can't comment on the track, but that aside maybe there is a glimmer of hope , a track runs on its preferred night, it has a team that is manned by riders who are 90% plus committed to riding in the UK and over 3k turn up. Granted its against decent opposition and a new talent was being wheeled out. However it goes to show if you could get rid of doubling up, multiple guests, run on your preferred night, promote the sport locally, try and keep 3-4 of the team year after year so supporters can relate to them you might have a chance of breaking even or making a small profit. If you had of had Holder and Ward there v Doyle and Emil last night you would probably have got 4k plus in but it goes to show if things fall into place there is still a market for speedway at a rider level seen last night even though the super stars weren't there.

Don't disagree with that but what does a complete overhaul even look like, is it an option given even half the championship riders , ride in Poland so UK would probably still be stuck with Mon-Wed to run on, the three most unattractive nights of the week (I know Poole love Wednesdays).

When's this young dane do to start at Glasgow ?

I think I have a reasonable idea who you are and yes from memory you were viewed as a progressive during your stint in charge and turned the club around where it is now viewed as one of the better championship sides. Its a tough gig, being a promoter is pretty much pouring money into a bucket with a huge hole in it, much as I admire the way the Ford's run a club, Matt must be secretly gutted he didn't offload it when Holder and Ward were in their pomp, he had a six figure sponsorship deal at one point that started with a 2. People put the boot in to the Ford's but it would probably be easier/less costly for them just to shut up shop and walk away but to their credit they are keeping the club going even though like most teams the resale value now is pretty much nil.

Very interesting piece, do you mind me asking how long you promoted for and what was the final straw that made you decide to get out of the game ? no probs if you prefer not to disclose.

Matousek v Wilson Wilson was perfect size for a speedway rider I drifted away from sport when he was probably very early 20's he looked a natural talent but from memory he probably never reached the very top for what ever reason.

Sadly its a proper mess the promoters take flak and as Mike BV has said before they are well meaning amateurs, look at poor old Tolley he's made some proper howlers but equally the poor old boy has probably poured somewhere between 500k to a mil down the toilet such is his commitment. Most of the promoters have other business's where I guess they operate successfully, I truly think the last role of the dice might be 8 five man teams operating at current championship standard the rest need to be national league standard but maybe let a couple of foreign youngsters in at that level but only if they commit to the entire season in the UK. Accept we are a training ground for Poland run on the best night to get fans in not what the riders want to work best for them, I love seeing the top lads but my guess is for what they are costings per meeting to extra fans through the gate its probably not enough to cover half their weekly guarantee. Look when Brum got Lindgren crowd figures barely went up, Lambert comes back to Lynn for a few weeks that doesn't mean another 1k through the gate. Also as Mike has mentioned before you have seven teams in top league, two woefully understrength , you see the same riders all the time, with 2/3 home and away, guest fests so you can see why most don't bother until you get to the semi's and the final. I remember in the 80's when Gunderson or Nielson turned up you went as that was probably the only one time you would see them all year. I wish I knew the answers but the doubling up, running on unattractive days of the week, guests galore, Brexit/Visa's, riders signing for a couple of months known up front after people have bought season tickets, Netflix, Sky , Play stations, bowling alleys, multi plex cinema's, hundreds of eateries open on a Sat night massive competition for a quid now. You would though have thought that promoters would have tried to get those who no longer attend to fill in a questionnaire as to why they fell out of love if its not for the reasons already listed.

That's before you get onto the semi funded public sector pension Liabilities, re student loans hundreds of millions have been fleeced by Romanians over recent years, the other legal fiddle is mature students who realize they can work part time and manipulate income down to max out on the living costs loan, equally if your a mature student living on your own you can potentially get council tax down to zero for three years. You then finish the course and so long as you make sure you never earn over £28,500 gross per annum (increasing by inflation) again (you can pay any excess above £28,500 into a pension) you never pay a penny of the loan back. So work two day per week go to Uni for the other time (1-2) days per week get a tax free living loan and spend your days in beer gardens, you can see why so many are doing it.

I work in financial markets and can give you a ringside idea of where we are (bear in mind the EU and USA are in a worse place than us but I will relate this to UK) As a country we owe nigh on £3 trillion built up by living beyond our means for decades, this was sustainable when interest rates were near zero but given 10 year government bonds are now nigh on 4.5% roughly 10% of the entire £1.3 trillion total UK tax (income tax ,vat etc) take just pays the interest on our debt (not a penny in debt repayment, the debts are just forever rolled over). Now also bear in mind during covid £400 billion was printed out of thin air to pay for all the furlough etc this money was probably set at 0.5% interest rates or less this also will be due for refinancing soon at north of 4%. So we are screwed x 10 whoever runs the country knows all choices going forward are bad so it will be more taxation or more money printing out of thin air to add to the £3 trillion which is no free lunch as its what causes inflation and just means the pound in your pocket is worth less so you have to run harder to stand still. Onto speedway I was really into it when Loram, Screen, Louis, Henka , Rikardson were all starting out in the UK and drifted away in my early 20's as preferred night clubbing and chasing women. However in the late 80's, Sky was in its infancy, you didn't have Netflix, Xbox/Playstation, multi plex cinemas everywhere, online shopping. mobile phone contracts, broadband contracts and the product although in decline was way better than now so Speedway didn't have to compete so hard for the pound in your pocket. Who would have thought thirty years ago Blockbusters would crash and burn , hundreds of pubs would close, its a real shame as the world cup last four races a couple of years back where Magic beat Lambert shows what a great spectacle the sport can be but it gets it wrong so often and as Dean says these days 40% are probably just keeping head above water and would rather spend small dispsoable on Nextflix, Amazon etc. I really think it might be curtains next year as even if you go five man teams assuming all current championship run you will still have to find 10-15 new riders assuming 4-5 drop down from premiership which would have been doable 1980/90's but I'm not so sure now.

Only way I can see things surviving is with five man teams of championship standard maybe 8-10 clubs in the new top league. All the top boys would have to depart as we can't afford them and ideally you would need riders who would be committed to being in Britain for 90% of the time needed. The rot set in during the late 80's and we have limped through to the current last knockings the question is even with five man teams will you find enough riders for UK at Championship standard. We can't carry on as we are and that decision looks like it will be forced onto promoters by events next year even those who want the current status quo to continue will have to accept it. You have the riders dictating the racing nights and thus end up with teams running on Mondays which is probably the least most attractive night of the week for your average punter. Going to be an interesting winter that's for sure.

Hi Phil whats the score with Leicester didn't Cairns snr purchase it , is it the usual case of tens of thousands have been burnt though to keep the club afloat , and at the end of year one and he's nor prepared to chuck any more money at it ?

Agree Dean my personal view is other than the part of central London near Liverpool Street (the financial district) the rest is a big avoid same goes for most/all of the other big cities, Cambridge, Oxford and Bath still very nice but even Norwich near where I live near has fell off a cliff the last 25 years, with one huge shopping mall virtually empty, Deliveroo riders everywhere, betting shops littering the high street, a massive ex Debenhams store covered in graffiti, aggressive beggars on the streets/Greggs shops hassling you for a quid or free coffee and sadly just a look of general run down scruffiness.

Another problem speedway has is Zmarzlik is to speedway what Floyd Maywether was to boxing so good it was boring when he fought as no one could lay a glove on him, its same here small fella who knows how to ride on a missile he should get ten titles at this rate, real shame what happended to Darcy Ward as the one rider who had the natural talent to maybe have given him a run for his money.

Any news on the mystery rider Glasgow were supposed to be signing ?

I do wonder if they will struggle to get six teams next year though Mike, anyone moving up really would have to be insane or have £100-£200k they would be happy to set fire to. I love the game live to far away from a track now used to go to Lynn when we had Loram and Lofquist at reserve and Henka turned up brilliant days, things were on the decline then even but we really are on the last knockings now sadly.

I wonder if they are forced into doing something next season assuming Brum shut and with Oxford struggling to put a decent prem team together despite being rumoured to being one of the best backed teams financially. Also Sheffield situation seems cloudy. So it might be a Championship light league of say 13-14 teams the top stars would leave meaning a shortage of riders so would probably have to be 5 man teams moving forward.

Agreed Mike, Matt Ford might be marmite but he's shrewd, he knows hardly any body is breaking even in speedway best case with some regularly losing six figures per season. He must be gutted he didn't manage to push a sale through when he had Holder and Ward in their pomp as would probably struggle to give the club away now. From memory costs are a third lower in division two, he still gets good crowds, assuming if they moved back up and had to get say a Doyle and Emil style spearhead those kind of riders would probably want 5k each per meeting which at £20 per head that's 500 adult paying fans you need every week coming in before you get to paying for the rest of the team, stadium hire, ambulances, insurance etc. Unless you have a really good main sponsor who will chuck in 100k plus each season why would you take the risk plus if one of the main men get injured you have next to zero chance of getting anyone over to replace them where in the second division you might be able to get over a young unpolished gem like Oxford have with McDaid.

To be fair to the Ford's they are probably the best promoters of Speedway in the last 20 years (digs aside )the big mistake they made was not unloading the club when Holder and Ward were in there pomp and Sky were still involved, from memory they held out for two big a money. The problem now is even they would struggle to give the club away for virtually nothing given stadium under threat and anyone following them probably won't be so successful and most likely will be covering losses of 50-100k per season from end of season one.

Final bit of nostalgia 1991 british final Coventry, as an aside I used to watch Lynn when we were the whipping boys, Campbell, Redgeling, Courtney, Woods and only Bob Schwartz who was top league standard. Bill Barker took over and we had Lance King, Bo Peterson, Rich Knight, John Davies, Allan Johanson we looked powerhouse first meeting with this team we must of had 3-5k in, but in true Lynn style it all fell apart Bo Peterson went from unbeatable round Lynn to average at best, King started like an express train but got injured to many times, and John Davies couldn't ride the track and would ride so wide he would be in Peterborough and leave a gap the size of the Watford gap that the opposition would toodle past. Brilliant days when I was in late teens early twenties would be back there again in a heartbeat.

Sorry getting old here's the link

Here's the link to the world team cup meeting I mentioned at Lynn looks like it was 2011 the place was packed I also remember going down to Ipswich for the bank hol meetings when you would get 5-6k in looking at the Ellis/Thomson vid barely a thou there again Monday nights, same riders each week, more competition for the dollar are just nails in the coffin. I will say fair play to the promoters for all the flak they take they aren't in this game for the money lord knows how much Tolley must have lost but I would bet 500k to a mil isn't far off.

Hi Phil where is the british gp going to be for 2026 ?

All interesting views I'm probably with Mike BV, with the shut down of so many clubs over the years the premier league has become a non event as you can already see barring injuries who the top three will be, with Lynn and Leicester vying for the final spot so a lot of people will just think I will just go to the semi and play off final. Throw in seeing the same riders week in week out guests galore, r/r I don't go to speedway much now but was a regular when Lynn had Loram and Lofquist at reserve every week you had world class riders coming and you knew if you missed them you most likely wouldn't see them again that season. Travelling down to Coventry for the british final when regularly over 10k would attend the place was rammed great atmosphere, now it seems struggling to get 1,500 people to the same event. However back in the late 80's early 90's Sky tv was in its infancy, Netflix, Disney Plus didn't exist, Xbox's/Playstations weren't invented, bowling allies, multi plex cinema's bars/restaurants weren't massive chains like today. The fact that Cardiff had gone from nigh on 50k to low 20k is also telling, I think sadly for the sport it will be a continued managed decline if Birmingham and Sheffield don't start next year I personally think they will have to with one big league of 12-14 clubs, 5 man teams at a standard around the current championship. Okay you would lose loyal great riders like Doyle and Kurtz but I don't think for many clubs crowds would drop much lower and people wouldn't have to put up with a guest fest if most of the riders were UK based and clubs could dictate the race night more than having to fit round gp stars. I would imagine in the perfect world no club would really want to run on a Monday or Tuesday, the other option as Mike mentioned is you maybe just have open meetings once a month and do away with the team side of things, again I can remember ten years or so back going to a world team cup qualifier at Lynn which pulled in 5k so demand is there for the right meetings. I sadly think today there's to many other things competing for peoples dollar and unless you get the much awaited big chief in to try and turn things around who's got 10-30 mil available to buy all the stadiums the return of the glory days are a pipe dream. Might be worth contacting Amazon and seeing if they would be willing to do a series like Clarkson's farm where maybe they front the money for Alan Sugar to try and turn a club around. Still when its run well the best sport ever in my opinion the final four heats in the world cup final a couple of years back show what a great spectacle it is when you have a decent track and riders who are at the top of their game.