Poole Pirates Vs Glasgow Tigers 27th May Championship

[Fromafar]

9 hours ago, TheWellBehavedWorrall said:

You’re missing the point.

Speedway lives and dies on entertainment; Poole are starving the sport of that while they fill their trophy cabinet.

I was vocal about recommending a Poole meeting to two colleagues from Bournemouth last season and unsurprisingly, they haven’t been back.

This has absolutely nothing to do with Poole’s support or their annual revenue.

What point am I missing why are Poole’s crowd levels better than Tigers,who provide the best racing.Tigers crowd levels look down on last seasons .IMO

Why are all these fans consistently turning up at Poole + away from how they attract fans to their meetings.Its hardly Poole’s fault is the sport is dying on its feet.

[foreverblue]

10 hours ago, Noelinho said:

Between them they're not a long way off. Cooper's average will be 6.17 when effective, and Cairns is averaging 6.59 this season, albeit the official average will lag behind given he came in half way through last season. How many young riders have come in to the Championship and done that in recent times?

That is why I said not quite, I would imagine Cooper's average will be above Will's by the end of the season and both will be in the main body of the team so points will be harder to come by and Cairns average was nearly 4 by the end of last season. 

[Wee Eck]

9 hours ago, TheWellBehavedWorrall said:

You’re missing the point.

Speedway lives and dies on entertainment; Poole are starving the sport of that while they fill their trophy cabinet.

I was vocal about recommending a Poole meeting to two colleagues from Bournemouth last season and unsurprisingly, they haven’t been back.

This has absolutely nothing to do with Poole’s support or their annual revenue.

To be fair, I think maybe it’s you that are missing the point. Poole are successful as a business and as a team. They have  a strong supporter base who have been treated to a winning team year after year. They are addicted to winning because they have got used to it. But the team can only beat what’s in front of them, and last night, the opposition were not only poor but disappointing - 5 race wins out of 13. And three of these were by Harris. After last year’s clashes, much was expected of this match but Glasgow were a let down. 
But that’s only half the story - not only do Poole keep their own supporters happy, but the also make other promoters happy when Poole come to visit. Because the home supporters turn out in greater numbers because they want to see the mighty Pirates humiliated by their team. And sometimes that happens. For example, if you were an Edinburgh supporter, would you prefer to watch the Monarchs against Poole or against, say, Scunthorpe?

[foreverblue]

46 minutes ago, therefused said:

Which makes me think there should have been a rule put in place to stop those two signing for the same teams, why dont they grade the reserves the same way they used to a few years ago? Theyve stopped teams signing one rider over an 8 average but done nothing about riders at the bottom of the team. 

The season is over, award Poole the title now.

So you want a rule just to stop Poole winning! The riders wanted to come to Poole and the fans are grateful that we can see two up and coming stars every week. Another team could have signed them but they didn't. 

[therefused]

4 minutes ago, foreverblue said:

So you want a rule just to stop Poole winning! The riders wanted to come to Poole and the fans are grateful that we can see two up and coming stars every week. Another team could have signed them but they didn't. 

No, i want a rule that makes it fairer across the board for all teams, instead of a lopsided league (again). Another team wouldnt have met the wage demands so saying another team could have signed them is totally facetious

[SteveLyric2]

38 minutes ago, therefused said:

No, i want a rule that makes it fairer across the board for all teams, instead of a lopsided league (again). Another team wouldnt have met the wage demands so saying another team could have signed them is totally facetious

Categorically Poole do not pay inflated wage demands! However what they do offer is regular payment of wages and introduction to a range of local companies that are able to offer a variety of support services, eg, accommodation, transport, workshop facilities and yes some financial support.

Plus of course a history of winning trophies - and all within the same team building points as everyone else.

Some people on here seem to think that winning meetings/trophies is not entertainment!!🤩

[foreverblue]

54 minutes ago, therefused said:

No, i want a rule that makes it fairer across the board for all teams, instead of a lopsided league (again). Another team wouldnt have met the wage demands so saying another team could have signed them is totally facetious

Facetious?

Lopsided again?

Nobody said that last year when we could probably should have lost to  Glasgow or got beat by Redcar in the BSN final.

[Steve Shovlar]

16 hours ago, gjcone44 said:

yes its just broke the record from 1922, and also recorded in 1944. 🤣 no such thing as global warming back then.

No. They were weather spikes. But now global warming is clear for all to see, with temperature records broken on a yearly basis. Ten of the hottest ever years have been very recently. Stats are there for all to see. 

[foreverblue]

11 hours ago, TheWellBehavedWorrall said:

You’re missing the point.

Speedway lives and dies on entertainment; Poole are starving the sport of that while they fill their trophy cabinet.

I was vocal about recommending a Poole meeting to two colleagues from Bournemouth last season and unsurprisingly, they haven’t been back.

This has absolutely nothing to do with Poole’s support or their annual revenue.

Not sure speedway lives and dies on entertainment, if you dont win the crowds soon dwindle. That said there must have some entertainment last night for you Harris got 15 points. 

There have been many,what you would call entertaining tracks, that are sadly not here anymore, they did not close because there were not entertaining. 

[Noelinho]

3 hours ago, therefused said:

Which makes me think there should have been a rule put in place to stop those two signing for the same teams, why dont they grade the reserves the same way they used to a few years ago? Theyve stopped teams signing one rider over an 8 average but done nothing about riders at the bottom of the team. 

The season is over, award Poole the title now.

I don’t agree with this. We have a points limit and a limit on 8 point riders. That’s already a decent amount of equalisation of teams, and Poole aside, I think most people would greet it’s been very effective at balancing the teams this year.

One thing people also have to remember if younger riders are often more dependent on others for travel because they often aren’t old enough to drive legally. In that situation, it’s much harder for a rider based in say the south of England to commit to a club in Scotland. No one’s fault, just practicality. 
 

What I would say is the rising star programme really belongs in the Championship rather than the Premiership and it’s a shame we don’t have that. Or maybe there could be a progression and have it in both leagues. I would also be minded towards only allowing British riders at reserve. Mario might not be a fan of that…

[lewy]

2 hours ago, Steve Shovlar said:

No. They were weather spikes. But now global warming is clear for all to see, with temperature records broken on a yearly basis. Ten of the hottest ever years have been very recently. Stats are there for all to see. 

So is your criminal record 😂

[Bagpuss]

3 hours ago, Wee Eck said:

To be fair, I think maybe it’s you that are missing the point. Poole are successful as a business and as a team. They have  a strong supporter base who have been treated to a winning team year after year. They are addicted to winning because they have got used to it. But the team can only beat what’s in front of them, and last night, the opposition were not only poor but disappointing - 5 race wins out of 13. And three of these were by Harris. After last year’s clashes, much was expected of this match but Glasgow were a let down. 
But that’s only half the story - not only do Poole keep their own supporters happy, but the also make other promoters happy when Poole come to visit. Because the home supporters turn out in greater numbers because they want to see the mighty Pirates humiliated by their team. And sometimes that happens. For example, if you were an Edinburgh supporter, would you prefer to watch the Monarchs against Poole or against, say, Scunthorpe?

That is all fair enough, but if Poole decide to race at a level lower than they really should be (and yes we know why they do) meaning they are a huge attraction for the best young riders and will more often than not are the best team in the league then you can't really complain about visiting teams being disappointing/a let down. You are inevitably going to clatter some sides, especially if they are injury hit. Its part of the deal. Winning is great and will keep people coming back to a point but eventually the lack of jeopardy will wear thin.

[SteveLyric2]

5 minutes ago, Bagpuss said:

That is all fair enough, but if Poole decide to race at a level lower than they really should be (and yes we know why they do) meaning they are a huge attraction for the best young riders and will more often than not are the best team in the league then you can't really complain about visiting teams being disappointing/a let down. You are inevitably going to clatter some sides, especially if they are injury hit. Its part of the deal. Winning is great and will keep people coming back to a point but eventually the lack of jeopardy will wear thin.

The jeopardy for Poole would have been joining the Premiership...........

[Paddy The Rebel]

4 hours ago, therefused said:

Which makes me think there should have been a rule put in place to stop those two signing for the same teams, why dont they grade the reserves the same way they used to a few years ago? Theyve stopped teams signing one rider over an 8 average but done nothing about riders at the bottom of the team. 

The season is over, award Poole the title now.

What a load of tosh every team had the chance to sign whoever they want it’s the riders perogitive where they go,can’t help that both riders what to go to most professional run club which pretty much guaranteed silverware most years.

[therefused]

32 minutes ago, Paddy The Rebel said:

What a load of tosh every team had the chance to sign whoever they want it’s the riders perogitive where they go,can’t help that both riders what to go to most professional run club which pretty much guaranteed silverware most years.

and also pays the most 😃

[mac101]

I think getting to 35 points with that team last night was pretty good. Jack smith had spasm in his back after his first ride and really struggled all night  ,if we had a full team I think we could have maybe hit 40 KJP has already ridden well in the meeting he rode there last year and has scored well away from home in every meeting and with the track being slick I think Mario would have given the reserves a run for their money, if you look at the scores we kept it close in the second half of the meeting once the riders kinda got a set up 

[TheWellBehavedWorrall]

3 hours ago, foreverblue said:

Not sure speedway lives and dies on entertainment, if you dont win the crowds soon dwindle. That said there must have some entertainment last night for you Harris got 15 points. 

There have been many,what you would call entertaining tracks, that are sadly not here anymore, they did not close because there were not entertaining. 

You literally couldn’t name a sport where the term “lives or dies on entertainment” is more fitting than speedway.

It is the definition of an event sport.

Crowds will dwindle? I’ll counter that with: the sport will die, never mind dwindle.

Speedway is built on close racing, passing and even jeopardy. 

The saddest thing is one of the most entertaining meetings I’ve been at was at Wimborne Road for the 2004 World Cup final. The second saddest thing is the Fords know how to build a capable team.

Yet, despite both of those facts, you continue to prepare a track for what I can only describe a sleeping tablet in speedway track form.

Given the state of British speedway, all clubs must contribute to its survival. Poole aren’t and why is beyond me.

[foreverblue]

1 hour ago, TheWellBehavedWorrall said:

You literally couldn’t name a sport where the term “lives or dies on entertainment” is more fitting than speedway.

It is the definition of an event sport.

Crowds will dwindle? I’ll counter that with: the sport will die, never mind dwindle.

Speedway is built on close racing, passing and even jeopardy. 

The saddest thing is one of the most entertaining meetings I’ve been at was at Wimborne Road for the 2004 World Cup final. The second saddest thing is the Fords know how to build a capable team.

Yet, despite both of those facts, you continue to prepare a track for what I can only describe a sleeping tablet in speedway track form.

Given the state of British speedway, all clubs must contribute to its survival. Poole aren’t and why is beyond me.

The 2004 World cup final was incredible just a shame we lost! Sport is about winning though and while many would have gone home saying we lost but a cracking meeting, a large section would have been gutted we didn't win.
Unfortunately some of the most entertaining venues in this country have been lost.

 

 

[foreverblue]

3 hours ago, mac101 said:

I think getting to 35 points with that team last night was pretty good. Jack smith had spasm in his back after his first ride and really struggled all night  ,if we had a full team I think we could have maybe hit 40 KJP has already ridden well in the meeting he rode there last year and has scored well away from home in every meeting and with the track being slick I think Mario would have given the reserves a run for their money, if you look at the scores we kept it close in the second half of the meeting once the riders kinda got a set up 

Could of been worse if Coopers bike didnt break down when leading

[mikebv]

10 hours ago, Fromafar said:

What point am I missing why are Poole’s crowd levels better than Tigers,who provide the best racing.Tigers crowd levels look down on last seasons .IMO

Why are all these fans consistently turning up at Poole + away from how they attract fans to their meetings.Its hardly Poole’s fault is the sport is dying on its feet.

In the "halcyon days" of the sport I was fortunate to attend Hyde Rd every week, and they had massive crowds, with several coaches full of away fans..

The racing was very much on a par with today, with most races strung out, with a few "good races" thrown in per meeting...

PC would often win a race by half a straight when he gated...

The Aces though were serial winners in those days meaning crowds stayed big, and whenever they went away they often drew the biggest crowds of that tracks' season..

When the sport started to lose its fan base, there started to be too many gaps on the  terracing, and hardly any away fans in attendance, which resulted in nowhere near the same atmosphere being generated, which led to even less people then attending, making the atmosphere worse, and on, and on the vicious cycle went, with it never being even slowed down, let alone stopped...

The racing was the same, the crowd size wasnt, therefore as the atmosphere declined, with it also went the stature of the league titles being raced for, which then also adversely impacted crowds further..

Poole know they need a winning team to keep a good crowd level, so provide one, with their crowd numbers ensuring that there will be sufficient atmosphere each week to (hopefully), engage enough people to keep coming due to the feel good factors of success..

Off track atmosphere, through winning, can add plenty of entertainment to a Speedway meeting, and obviously keeps people attending at Poole, even if the on track action doesn't always excite as much...

Cardiff's first ten years or so also proved that...

Great racing in a one third full stadium doesnt generate much atmosphere, and, thus, crowd growth... 

The NSS proves that...

Poole "sells" success and the crowds respond in numbers..

Glasgow "sells" entertainment and the crowds respond in numbers..

Each to their own, and, if it works, why change?..

 

Edited 1 hour ago by mikebv